New pool in upstate NY...I've never owned a pool before so I'm looking for advice

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Hi from the other side of the river and good luck in your pool build! We finished ours up last Spring and enjoyed a great summer in the pool. I will say that I spent a lot of time sorting out build issues and worrying about various details, but in the end it was worth it!

For equipment frame of reference, we went with all Pentair equipment (really by builders choice because I had no clue) and ended up with a single speed pump, SWG (IC40), DE filter and a 250K btu natural gas heater. I've seen people give advice regarding higher capacity heaters, but honestly I had no issues with 250K btu in a 20,000 gallon pool. We only ran it early season and late season anyway. I've also heard that an option to the variable speed pump would be a 2 speed - less cost with most of the benefits.

Regarding decking, we went straight brushed concrete - but a lot of it. Our concrete guy brushed swirls into the finish at no extra charge. It looks great at half the cost of stamped.

Have fun with your build and update as you go along!
 
DanielJ said:
.... I've also heard that an option to the variable speed pump would be a 2 speed - less cost with most of the benefits.....
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Just a word of advice/caution for anyone with an SWG and considering building or upgrading to a 2-speed pump - You must ensure that any 2-speed pump you choose has enough horsepower on LOW speed to ratify the SWG's minimum flow requirement or else your SWG will only be able to produce chlorine at HIGH speed (which totally negates the purpose and reason of having a 2-speed pump). This is one of those "little details" that should be totally obvious to a pool builder but is often overlooked and then the customer is left with a 2-speed pump that can, for all intents and purposes, only be run on HIGH speed.

Enjoy your build!

Matt
 
My yard also has a slope and we had to address this so we didn't have a ledge for people to fall off of. It was 3 feet at the tallest and gradually sloped down. I thought I'd need to do a retaining wall but the landscaper suggested otherwise. We essentially turned the straight drop into a hill and landscaped it. I'll post pictures in the next day or two if you're interested.
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We asked about just making it a hill but I guess we have too much elevation change. The landscaper is trying to divide the change in elevation on both sides of the pool. I've been meaning to post these landscape designs and this is a good time to.
Hi from the other side of the river and good luck in your pool build! We finished ours up last Spring and enjoyed a great summer in the pool. I will say that I spent a lot of time sorting out build issues and worrying about various details, but in the end it was worth it!

For equipment frame of reference, we went with all Pentair equipment (really by builders choice because I had no clue) and ended up with a single speed pump, SWG (IC40), DE filter and a 250K btu natural gas heater. I've seen people give advice regarding higher capacity heaters, but honestly I had no issues with 250K btu in a 20,000 gallon pool. We only ran it early season and late season anyway. I've also heard that an option to the variable speed pump would be a 2 speed - less cost with most of the benefits.

Regarding decking, we went straight brushed concrete - but a lot of it. Our concrete guy brushed swirls into the finish at no extra charge. It looks great at half the cost of stamped.

Have fun with your build and update as you go along!
Click to expand...


It is so nice to see someone from the area on here as well. How many months did you get out of your pool last summer? We are also going to do brushed concrete. Did you use your pool company or someone else for your decking?
Just a word of advice/caution for anyone with an SWG and considering building or upgrading to a 2-speed pump - You must ensure that any 2-speed pump you choose has enough horsepower on LOW speed to ratify the SWG's minimum flow requirement or else your SWG will only be able to produce chlorine at HIGH speed (which totally negates the purpose and reason of having a 2-speed pump). This is one of those "little details" that should be totally obvious to a pool builder but is often overlooked and then the customer is left with a 2-speed pump that can, for all intents and purposes, only be run on HIGH speed.

Enjoy your build!
Click to expand...

Matt, we are going to go with a variable speed pump, we just have to decide on the automation. It seems sort of standard these days so I don't want to limit our options but I also don't know if we need it or how much of a priority it is for us at this point. Thanks for all of your advice, it definitely got me on the right track.

View attachment 45357View attachment 45358

So here are the landscaping pictures, the second one is the most recent but it is very blown up so you cannot see the surrounding area very well. We are currently trying to work in a place for a grilling/bar area to the right of the upper patio. Also, we are debating what to do about a shed. We have a large ride on mower and snow blower as well as other garage type stuff that would be nice to get out of our garage. We will also now have pool chemicals, toys, and patio stuff. We were originally going to put a large 12x20 shed in the woods line but are now thinking that it would be nice to have some sort of shade structure (pool house) within the fence line off of the patio on the deep end side of the pool. It would be great if we could combine these two needs into one structure, but I'm worried that it will look huge and out of place. Oh, and there is also the issue of the septic field being too close to everything.
 
A variable speed pump is a great up-front investment. It will save you lots of hassle to not worry about flow rates, etc, and it will save you LOTS of money since you'll be able to run it on low speed. VSPs are pretty much becoming the de-facto standard for in-ground pools and many states are starting to recognize this by passing restrictions against single-speed pump installations. It's just like how robotic cleaners are really starting to push pressure and suction side cleaners out of the way. The robots cost more, but they have great performance (comparable or better than pump-driven cleaners) and they allow the pool owner to decouple their cleaning schedule from the pump run time. A robot cleaner is on my pool's bucket list.

Anyway, LOVE the layout!!! Looks like you guys have a great landscape designer to work with. I love the Japanese Lilac, it's a beautiful shrub/tree. Keep it well pruned and under control and it will be beautiful to look at when floating in the pool. Honestly, if you have the budget and room for a pool house, that would be an awesome addition to the backyard. We have a casita near our pool but it is currently occupied by my mother-in-law. If it were free, my wife and I would change it into a pool house/gym in a heart beat. A large shed is another good option; I feel for you with all that bulky, but necessary yard equipment....one of the many reasons why I love living in Arizona - no grass and no snow (I have 800 sq ft of artificial turf and the snow only stays in the mountains ;) )!!!

Enjoy the planning phase and keep dreaming, it's going to look fabulous!!

Matt
 
JoyfulNoise;970985]A variable speed pump is a great up-front investment. It will save you lots of hassle to not worry about flow rates, etc, and it will save you LOTS of money since you'll be able to run it on low speed. VSPs are pretty much becoming the de-facto standard for in-ground pools and many states are starting to recognize this by passing restrictions against single-speed pump installations. It's just like how robotic cleaners are really starting to push pressure and suction side cleaners out of the way. The robots cost more, but they have great performance (comparable or better than pump-driven cleaners) and they allow the pool owner to decouple their cleaning schedule from the pump run time. A robot cleaner is on my pool's bucket list.

Anyway, LOVE the layout!!! Looks like you guys have a great landscape designer to work with. I love the Japanese Lilac, it's a beautiful shrub/tree. Keep it well pruned and under control and it will be beautiful to look at when floating in the pool. Honestly, if you have the budget and room for a pool house, that would be an awesome addition to the backyard. We have a casita near our pool but it is currently occupied by my mother-in-law. If it were free, my wife and I would change it into a pool house/gym in a heart beat. A large shed is another good option; I feel for you with all that bulky, but necessary yard equipment....one of the many reasons why I love living in Arizona - no grass and no snow (I have 800 sq ft of artificial turf and the snow only stays in the mountains ;) )!!!

Enjoy the planning phase and keep dreaming, it's going to look fabulous!!

Matt
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thanks Matt for all of your wonderful advice, the variable pump it is! Thanks for the encouragement with the landscaping as well. I am currently trying to figure this shed thing out.

Does anyone have any suggestions on diving boards? We have a 6" smith in our contract but can probably get an 8" if we want to.

Also, I was playing around with pool studio since I am so impressed by other people's pictures and found some things about our design that should be changed. I'll try to send a screenshot once I figure that out. But we need more deck on the deep end side especially if we will be rolling up one of the solar covers on that end. We may need more elsewhere.. Any suggestions are greatly appreciated!....thanks
 
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Karen14 said:
Does anyone have any suggestions on diving boards? We have a 6" smith in our contract but can probably get an 8" if we want to.
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I am perfectly happy with our diving board:

http://www.amazon.com/S-R-Smith-66-209-268S2-1-Fibre-Dive-Replacement/dp/B002D48HHO

And Flyte Deck II stand.

We went with 8' length to give us enough distance to clear our autocover pit. Otherwise, I would have been more comfortable with the 6' board. Reason being that the shorter the board the less flex and therefore less dive height and then less momentum propelling heads down towards the pool floor. We went with 8 1/2' pool depth. I would have gone to 10' if I could have managed 5'+ more of pool length. 8' is the required minimum depth and really is bare minimum - but no guarantees with any depth and certainly not 8'.

Make sure you have all your ducks in a row regarding insurance. Our base homeowners policy was fine with the board (only had to have a non-slip surface - which is standard). However, I found out after the fact that our umbrella coverage (which I highly recommend for anyone, pool or not) did not allow diving boards (same company). So we ended up placing ALL new insurance coverage (home, auto, umbrella and related endorsements) with a company that did not have a diving board exclusion.
 
LOVE the design! Can't wait to see it in place!

Storage=MUST have........the toys can be done like this:

pvc pool float rack - Google Search

The chemicals=well ventilated......chlorine and muratic acid should NOT be kept side by side or very close at all. The muratic acid vapors can cause rusting of metals so keep that in mind when you are thinking about where to keep it.

Kim
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Kim, thanks. I am so excited to start seeing this all happen. We are about a month out from breaking ground and have a bunch of decisions that I need to make now as far as landscaping. I've played around with pool studio and am posting pictures in my next comment. Thanks for the tip about the chemicals, I didn't think about the ventilation of them. Are they OK in a shed? I guess I should not store them in an attached garage.

bmoreswim said:
I am perfectly happy with our diving board:

http://www.amazon.com/S-R-Smith-66-209-268S2-1-Fibre-Dive-Replacement/dp/B002D48HHO

And Flyte Deck II stand.

We went with 8' length to give us enough distance to clear our autocover pit. Otherwise, I would have been more comfortable with the 6' board. Reason being that the shorter the board the less flex and therefore less dive height and then less momentum propelling heads down towards the pool floor. We went with 8 1/2' pool depth. I would have gone to 10' if I could have managed 5'+ more of pool length. 8' is the required minimum depth and really is bare minimum - but no guarantees with any depth and certainly not 8'.

Make sure you have all your ducks in a row regarding insurance. Our base homeowners policy was fine with the board (only had to have a non-slip surface - which is standard). However, I found out after the fact that our umbrella coverage (which I highly recommend for anyone, pool or not) did not allow diving boards (same company). So we ended up placing ALL new insurance coverage (home, auto, umbrella and related endorsements) with a company that did not have a diving board exclusion.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the advice, I didn't realize that it was a pool depth issue. I'm all set with the insurance, thanks for the heads up though. Do you know the difference between the stands? I like the flyte deck stand but I'm not sure if it is a functional difference with the others or aesthetics.
 
I've been playing around with pool studio this weekend and this is what I have come up with. I am by no means an expert with this software so some things are off but the measurements are accurate. This has allowed me to get a good idea of space. We have decided to expand the deck 3ft of the deep end side of the pool to accommodate the diving board and solar cover (when not in use) and we are also going to add some space on the long end side of the pool (to make room for the ladder coming out of the deep end. These changes are not depicted in these pictures. Also, the outer fence is not a fence but represents the woods line. I will not at all be offended by any suggestions, please be critical and honest as now is the time for me to make changes. Thanks for your time!

whole project from back right.jpgwhole project from back left.jpg
 

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Marlahoutex said:
How deep is the deep end? Could you put a bench there (or maybe different height benches) instead of a ladder?

- - - Updated - - -

Oh, nice design!
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Thanks, the deep end is 8 ft. I would have liked to put a bench there but was hesitant since it will be a diving pool. Thanks for the suggestion it is a good one :)
 
Looking good!

Store bleach/chlorine inside, laundry room or pantry is typical. You can keep a couple in a shed. Heat and sunlight degrades the strength of the chlorine.

Muriatic acid should be stored outside in the shade, under a deck is great, behind a shed on the north side. Muriatic acid will outgas and rust all things metal, especially a bottle that has been opened and resealed.
 
Karen,

I forgot, do you a heater in your plans? That's a lovely backyard design, it would be a shame to have to wait until mid-June for the water to warm up. Since you'll be making space for a cover reel, adding a heater will get the water warmer faster.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk,16k gal SWG pool (All Pentair), QuadDE100 Filter, Taylor K-2006
 
Karen14 said:




It is so nice to see someone from the area on here as well. How many months did you get out of your pool last summer? We are also going to do brushed concrete. Did you use your pool company or someone else for your decking?
Click to expand...


We didn't get the pool completed until Spring of last year. Equipment was up and running May 10 or so. We closed it October 16th. Columbus Day weekend in the pool was awesome! The builder says that some people around here keep it open through November - we aren't that brave. There's a thread around here somewhere with a homeowner in the Toronto area that keeps it open year round! We are on the schedule this year to have it opened April 22.

Regarding concrete, the concrete guy was a sub to the builder. The price for extra concrete deck beyond what was included in the base pool price was specified in the contract. We just worked directly with the sub regarding how much extra we wanted.
 
pooldv said:
Looking good!

Store bleach/chlorine inside, laundry room or pantry is typical. You can keep a couple in a shed. Heat and sunlight degrades the strength of the chlorine.

Muriatic acid should be stored outside in the shade, under a deck is great, behind a shed on the north side. Muriatic acid will outgas and rust all things metal, especially a bottle that has been opened and resealed.
Click to expand...

Thanks for that advice, I didn't think about those things!

DanielJ said:
We didn't get the pool completed until Spring of last year. Equipment was up and running May 10 or so. We closed it October 16th. Columbus Day weekend in the pool was awesome! The builder says that some people around here keep it open through November - we aren't that brave. There's a thread around here somewhere with a homeowner in the Toronto area that keeps it open year round! We are on the schedule this year to have it opened April 22.

Regarding concrete, the concrete guy was a sub to the builder. The price for extra concrete deck beyond what was included in the base pool price was specified in the contract. We just worked directly with the sub regarding how much extra we wanted.
Click to expand...
That is good to hear. I hope we have a nice long season this year with the weather we have been having!

JoyfulNoise said:
Karen,

I forgot, do you a heater in your plans? That's a lovely backyard design, it would be a shame to have to wait until mid-June for the water to warm up. Since you'll be making space for a cover reel, adding a heater will get the water warmer faster.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk,16k gal SWG pool (All Pentair), QuadDE100 Filter, Taylor K-2006
Click to expand...
Matt, yes, we are doing a heater, we want to maximize our ability to utilize all of this!
 
I'm confused again with our equipment. I was told directly by Hayward that I need either the tristar or ecostar pump if we want the omnilogic system. Having such a high hp pump is forcing us to have a larger sand filter. Our PB was hesitant to have us put in anything over the Hayward 244 sand filter. He said that he has only done 1 S310 which is the lower of what Hayward recommended for the ecostar pump (with the 360 being preferred because of the higher flow rate ability) Am I completely overdoing the equipment on this build. it is a 26,000 gal pool? He recommends a 1.5 hp pump with the 244 sand filter. Also he said that he rep told him that all of the Hayward pumps are compatible with the omnilogic system????

Regarding the larger sand filters with a higher hp pump, it seems that I will lose a lot of water during the back wash cycle. is this a reason to use a smaller pump and filter? We are on a well and do not have great flow. Why is this so difficult?
 
I am getting excited now. I just made my final equipment decisions and feel good about them. Tristar pump, s310 sand filter, 300k natural heater, and we decided to add automation, the Omnilogic system that comes with the salt system. And our landscaping is coming out to draw the pool location, decking, patio and walls out. I am now in the state of mind where I'm thinking what do I have to think about now. Are there any things I need to make a decision on now before it is too late. I'm really liking those lit bubblers but I'm not sure that they will work for us. We extended our second step which will have a water height of about 12 in. I think that is too deep for those. Also, I'm secretly think that I would like some sort of fire element on our walls....you know, to keep the bugs away...right.

we do not have a start date yet and of course we are planning a big outdoor party for what is looking like the weekend before they will get started. I'll try to send picture after today's meeting but I have not figured out the photobucket thing yet. Thanks for all of your help and suggestions!
 
Karen14 said:
I'm confused again with our equipment. I was told directly by Hayward that I need either the tristar or ecostar pump if we want the omnilogic system. Having such a high hp pump is forcing us to have a larger sand filter. Our PB was hesitant to have us put in anything over the Hayward 244 sand filter. He said that he has only done 1 S310 which is the lower of what Hayward recommended for the ecostar pump (with the 360 being preferred because of the higher flow rate ability) Am I completely overdoing the equipment on this build. it is a 26,000 gal pool? He recommends a 1.5 hp pump with the 244 sand filter. Also he said that he rep told him that all of the Hayward pumps are compatible with the omnilogic system????

Regarding the larger sand filters with a higher hp pump, it seems that I will lose a lot of water during the back wash cycle. is this a reason to use a smaller pump and filter? We are on a well and do not have great flow. Why is this so difficult?
Click to expand...

Hi Karen!!

I'm so sorry nobody replied to this and I just saw it. I'm sure someone will come around soon. As far as the equipment goes it is good you upgraded the size of your filter. I'm not totally sure about which pump you need for the 26,000 gallon pool but I do know that an oversize filter is ALWAYS a good thing. If you're worried about the water waste from back washing with a sand, maybe consider a cartridge? That's what we're doing because we wanted to conserve water and have a lower bill. We way oversized and should only have to clean it twice per year or so. Any filter can and should be oversized though. Hopefully others will reply soon!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
twinkiesmommy2009 said:
Oh, and we're in TX where it's hot. 400k heaters seem to be standard here even on pools closer to the 17k gallons we're building so I'm curious why in NY they would do 300k

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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Thanks for the comments. I feel good about our equipment now. I just had to make the decision. I'm not sure about the difference in heater choices from the north and south. It is strange but 300k is actually large for around here.

So it is predicted to snow here this weekend!!!? We have been having such a nice spring ☺️ This sure in killing my excitement!
 

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