Ball valves or Jandy valves?

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Looks about right. I'm on the road right now so I'll give it a more thorough review later.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk,16k gal SWG pool (All Pentair), QuadDE100 Filter, Taylor K-2006
 
One of the problems with DYI of pool automation is that it is complex and the guys that know it best work for pool builders. You can DYI or have your electrician do it. I however would look for a high end pool repair guy who sells Pentair. I know a couple in Sacramento CA but none in Texas. I suspect you could get a good price from them for the setup if you do it before their heavy season in the summer. Its just a magnitude more difficult than most DYI and their are some quirks and tricks to make it work better.
 
Jamie,
I'm going to agree with gwegan on this one - I think you should look around for licensed Pentair installers (you can call Pentair to help you find one). Let me show you a few phtoto's of what my setup looks like -

Automation Panel (don' laugh at the Sharpie, that was the installer. I would use P-Touch labels but they peel off from the heat so I need to find an industrial label maker)



Outside of panel



Valve Actuator (and a non-actuated valve) -



The electrician can add all the breakers and hopefully do some of the pump wiring and light wiring for you. But to setup the valve actuators, the SWG, and any other device that requires the use of the panels relays, that work is typically done by the PB. So unless you feel really comfortable reading and following installation manuals and debugging electronics, you might want to consider that the few hundred bucks you spend on a Pentair pro doing the install will be well-worth the avoidance of unnecessary headaches.

I've wired single CVA-24 actuators to the panel and believe me, just doing one actuator took this novice well over an hour to get right and I'm actually pretty handy with DIY electrical stuff.
 
JoyfulNoise said:
Jamie,
I'm going to agree with gwegan on this one - I think you should look around for licensed Pentair installers (you can call Pentair to help you find one).
Click to expand...

Thanks guys, you made your point very well! I've got an email in to my prospective electrician to see if the $500 setup he mentioned includes all the extras like valve actuation, SWG etc. This is definitely way over my head, and my husband's! I'll also put a call in to Pentair to see if they can recommend someone for me.

- - - Updated - - -

openpool said:
I've found that if ball valves are in the sunlight directly, it's a sure fire way for them to become brittle and then the handles crack on you.
Click to expand...

Thanks Open. It's pretty certain that mine will get a lot of sun, so I think I'll be investing in the Neverlubes.

Oh, one more thing... Based on my setup, will two actuators be enough, or do I need one more for the bubblers? (Am I right to understand that one is for the suction, one is for the returns, and the third would be for the bubblers, or maybe I have that all mixed up?)
 
I think you might have enough actuators. Unfortunately, you don't/can't/probably shouldn't mess with the valve outputs that are specifically designated for POOL and SPA mode because those "features" are also associated with other settings. An example is SPA mode would command the intake and return valves to turn to the spa side suction and jetted returns while activating the heater and setting the IntelliChlor to 1/20th output power. Since you don't have a spa, that entire feature is going to be ignored.

So realistically all you have available to you are the VALVE A and VALVE B control outputs. You might make VALVE A the bubbler valve and VALVE B the water slide. So you're two CVA-24T actuators in that package are probably enough for now.

Another thought is this - you could call Pentair and tell them the details about the pool you're building and they can recommend an EasyTouch Load Center layout for you as they have different models. You might save some money by going with an EasyTouch that is more compatible with your pool layout. With no attached spa, it makes very little sense to have such an elaborate EasyTouch. You can't add an attached spa later to your pool so it makes no sense to have the controls for one.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk,16k gal SWG pool (All Pentair), QuadDE100 Filter, Taylor K-2006
 
Jamie,

Since you do not have a spa, then there is no real need to automate anything on the suction side of your plumbing. Once you set the valves for the two skimmers and the main drain the way you want, you won't be changing them very often, if at all. The things that I see that might make sense to automate would be to turn on/off the water to the bubblers and the slide. I believe your engineer put the ball valves in more for volume control rather than to turn them on or off. That is why there are two bubbler valves, so that you can make sure they each bubbler can be adjusted independently. Like everyone else, I'm not a fan of ball valves and recommend you use the Neverlube style valve.

Keep in mind that you can manually turn a Jandy valve to adjust the amount of water going through it, kind of like a light dimmer control. But, if you automate a Jandy valve it acts more like a light switch, it is either on or off.

In my opinion, installing all Neverlube style valves now, gives you the option to automate later, if you decide that is something want to do.

As Matt has said, the Easytouch 8 only has two user controlled valve outputs. Since you don't have a Spa, the Pool and Spa outputs are not much use. I'd stick with the two actuators that came with your EasyTouch for now. I'm not sure the additional valve Expansion Card is available for the EasyTouch, I believe it is for the IntelliTouch Units only.

The best thing about automation is a combination and valve action and pump speed. I "assume" that a VS pump is part of your package???

Thanks,

Jim R.
 
Jimrahbe said:
Keep in mind that you can manually turn a Jandy valve to adjust the amount of water going through it, kind of like a light dimmer control. But, if you automate a Jandy valve it acts more like a light switch, it is either on or off.
Click to expand...

:goodpost:

I LOVE that analogy!! I plan on plagiarizing it early and often ;) :p :bowdown:
 
Jimrahbe said:
Jamie,

Since you do not have a spa, then there is no real need to automate anything on the suction side of your plumbing. Once you set the valves for the two skimmers and the main drain the way you want, you won't be changing them very often, if at all. The things that I see that might make sense to automate would be to turn on/off the water to the bubblers and the slide. I believe your engineer put the ball valves in more for volume control rather than to turn them on or off. That is why there are two bubbler valves, so that you can make sure they each bubbler can be adjusted independently. Like everyone else, I'm not a fan of ball valves and recommend you use the Neverlube style valve.

Keep in mind that you can manually turn a Jandy valve to adjust the amount of water going through it, kind of like a light dimmer control. But, if you automate a Jandy valve it acts more like a light switch, it is either on or off.

In my opinion, installing all Neverlube style valves now, gives you the option to automate later, if you decide that is something want to do.

As Matt has said, the Easytouch 8 only has two user controlled valve outputs. Since you don't have a Spa, the Pool and Spa outputs are not much use. I'd stick with the two actuators that came with your EasyTouch for now. I'm not sure the additional valve Expansion Card is available for the EasyTouch, I believe it is for the IntelliTouch Units only.

The best thing about automation is a combination and valve action and pump speed. I "assume" that a VS pump is part of your package???

Thanks,

Jim R.
Click to expand...

Thank you Jim and Matt. I'm sure I'll be digesting what you wrote for awhile, but it's been helpful already. Unfortunately, when I called Pentair originally I must not have understood what the guy was telling me very well because I was under the impression that even without a spa, I'd be able to use the spa's automation controls. Oh well. I also bought it to control my Intellibrites and bubbler lights. It can still do that, right?

Also, are you saying that if I want to be able to adjust the water output of the bubblers and slide I should not actuate them, because by actuating them I would lose that ability to fine tune and will only be able to turn them on and off with the controller? If so, when I want to turn on either of those features, do I just manually turn the valve from closed to open and the water from the pump (assuming it's running) is waiting to flow out to them at the rate my Jandy valve has been set to? In that case I can see how waiting on using the actuators till later, or not at all might be the way to go.

Yes, I will be using the Intelliflo VS 011018 model. What do I need to learn about coordinating its settings with the Easy Touch to get the most out of both?

Thanks again for your help, sirs. You're awesome! :)
 

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You may be able to use the spa settings to do something else. However, that will generally take a Pentair trained installer who knows the ins and outs of the system.

With the Jandy valves on your bubblers you set the valve for how much you want it to open. Then each time the automation opens the valve it opens to the setting you have selected. On -- Off at the specified setting. If you don't use the automation you could select a different selection each time. The same would be true with the slide. Although with the slide there may be times when you want major water and times when you want it normal.

Oh -- and its just my opinion -- But I think the consensus is that Jandy's valves are the best. Lets see what kind of an argument I start there. I have a different opinion about other pool equipment or that they are not much different, but Jandy does make the best valves.
 
I have Pentair 3-way valves; they work just fine. If they ever die catastrophically, I'll chop them out and add Jandy valves. For the time being, they "ain't broke" so I "ain't going to fix'em".
 
Ha! No argument here. Jandy is the best and Pentair is really good for a less money. I have two Jandy 3-way valves and one Pentair 3-way valve and they are pretty much identical. Both have been trouble free for over three years.
 
JamieP said:
Thank you Jim and Matt. I'm sure I'll be digesting what you wrote for awhile, but it's been helpful already. Unfortunately, when I called Pentair originally I must not have understood what the guy was telling me very well because I was under the impression that even without a spa, I'd be able to use the spa's automation controls. Oh well. I also bought it to control my Intellibrites and bubbler lights. It can still do that, right?

Also, are you saying that if I want to be able to adjust the water output of the bubblers and slide I should not actuate them, because by actuating them I would lose that ability to fine tune and will only be able to turn them on and off with the controller? If so, when I want to turn on either of those features, do I just manually turn the valve from closed to open and the water from the pump (assuming it's running) is waiting to flow out to them at the rate my Jandy valve has been set to? In that case I can see how waiting on using the actuators till later, or not at all might be the way to go.

Yes, I will be using the Intelliflo VS 011018 model. What do I need to learn about coordinating its settings with the Easy Touch to get the most out of both?

Thanks again for your help, sirs. You're awesome! :)
Click to expand...

Jamie,

In the old days, everyone had a single speed pump going full blast. So if you turned your bubblers on they might shoot 12 feet in the air. This is why your engineer added the two ball valves, so you could turn the flow down to exactly what you wanted. Fast forward to today... You can simply adjust your pump speed to set the bubbler height to what you want. What automation can do for you is to make several things happen at once. In your bubbler's case, automaton can turn the bubblers on, adjust the pump speed to whatever speed makes the bubblers work best, turn on your bubbler lights, and anything else you want to have happen a the same time. You can make this happen on a time schedule or when you push a single button. And later, if you want, you can add the capability to push that button from your cell phone or computer...

All the "coordination" between your pump, your lights, your valves, and your SWG, is handled by the way your EasyTouch is programmed or set-up. This why everyone here is recommending that a Pentair knowledgeable technician initially set up your system. At the same time you need to make sure this technician knows what you expect the system to do. After it is installed, it is fairly easy to stumble around and make changes to fine tune the operation.

Jim R.
 
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