Stinking Mustard Algae!

[chem geek]

PolyQuat and toxicity

I got a response back from Buckman Labs on the toxicity of PolyQuat as follows:

Buckman Laboratories has carried out a number of studies to determine the toxicity of Polyquat to mammals, and the results of these studies all showed very little toxicity. The test animals used in these studies were rats, rabbits, and dogs. As an example, a one-year chronic toxicity study in dogs showed a No Observed Effect Level (NOEL) of 1% for male dogs and 2% for female dogs. As your calculation correctly shows, the NOEL is VERY far above the actual ppm levels that may be present in the pool. Even at the highest concentration used in this study (4%), only minor histological changes could be found. NONE of these studies (or any others conducted by or for Buckman Laboratories) have ever shown any indication of mutagenic or carcinogenic activity by this product.

So this confirms what I said earlier that the PolyQuat in pool water is essentially non-toxic. Similar studies show the same for CYA (the problem with the pet food had to do with the combination of CYA with melamine with the latter being the bigger problem and the combination being deadly). Chlorine is more toxic while borates are more so, but just around the limit of observed effects when drinking around a pint a day.

Again, teaching your dog to not drink pool water is the safest thing to do.

Richard

 

[gonefishin]

One thing that I noticed in the appearance of the "substance" from above is that it looked like algae. It appeared to have a climbing fuzzy appearance. But after taking a sample it was immediately apparent that what I had been fighting was not algae. Riles...what you describe sounds like what I had. If you can get a sample.

After I began to realize what I was dealing with is pollen I started looking at things a little differently. After watching the pollen build up for a couple of weeks I noticed that things had calmed down. Could this be it? Could the pollen be done? But after another couple of days I noticed that it slowly started back up again. I decided to walk all around my house and on my neighborhood. I had noticed that some of the trees that were in bloom before were starting to have a second bloom. So the problem subsided for a short time...only to start in full force again.

I'll also be taking notice once the fall shrubs and trees go into bloom. We'll see what happens.


chemgeek...
Thanks for the suggestion about covering part of the container. I had forgotten that I read mustard algae likes to start on shady side walls of the pool first.

thanks all,
dan

 

[jnorris]

OK, it's been a few more days. I've let me chlorine level drift back down. For the last 2 days, I have not added chlorine and I have not brushed. I've even turned the pump back down to low, it's been on high for the last 7 days.

Guess what? The stuff is gone.

My conclusion? I have no idea whether it was algae or not.

I guess I can go back to standard operating procedure now. Oh, and apparently my CYA is 60, not 50, so I'd better be more vigilant about keeping my chlorine level where it needs to be.

 

[jnorris]

And now it's back!!!

I did let my FC level drop below 5 a couple of times this week, so I bought some Cal Hypo (Calcium level is fine, and it's easier than hauling a bunch of bleach) and shocked the pool. Guess what, the stuff started coming back the next morning! So now I'm thinking that either it is dead algae, or maybe something that is precipitating out of the water when I add Cal Hypo (is that even possible?).

I have buckets of water out for my dogs, and I've noticed in the last week that green algae keeps growing in that water, but no yellowish brown stuff.

So I'm still perplexed.

 

[haze]

I have been dealing with this for over a month now,

First I thought pollen , but now I am thinking Mustard algae.

I made a point of running hayward ladybug for 10 hours a day for three days and pool was spotless. Filter comes on this morning, only 14 hours after filter shut off and vac was removed, within 20 minutes I see dust collecting in the low spots.

I am wondering if Mustard algae can be growing apparently unnoticable on the liner and then the water circulation is causing it to collect in areas. How fast does Mustard algae grow?

I just can't imagine that much pollen and dust is falling in the pool each day, I see no sign of it on the deck or glass patio table.

Also I see no excessive chlorine usage and have no CC's.

Thoughts?

 

[jnorris]

I'm the OP for this thread.

I've come to the conclusion that what I have been seeing is either 1) dead algae after I have shocked, or 2) undissolved Cal-hypo, or 3) Something precipitating out of the water when I use Cal-Hypo. My belief is that it is dead algae. I haven't had any problems with mustard algae for weeks, but this last week, I've been very busy and let things get away from me. Instead of testing the FC, I've just been adding a couple of jugs of bleach every other day. When I finally tested it, my FC level was around 3, which is too low for my CYA level, so it had probably been dropping too low several times in the last week or so. Water was very clear, and I didn't see anything at all growing, green or otherwise. I used the last bag of Cal-hypo I had, along with a couple of jugs of bleach, just to get the FC level up quickly.

Guess what? The "stuff" was back the next morning. So I brushed several times over the next couple of days, ran the pump on high, and added nothing but bleach since then. The "stuff" completely disappeared over the course of a couple of days.

I have been using Cal-Hypo this year when I need to shock, just to cut down on the number of bleach jugs I am hauling from the store. And the stuff shows up after I use Cal-Hypo.

 

[gonefishin]

Also I see no excessive chlorine usage and have no CC's.

Thoughts?

How is the chlorine usage overnight, >1 or <1?


I don't think hitting this stuff with a high level chlorine shock will hurt anything. If it is algae then you get to hit it with chlorine. If it's not then you really aren't out anything, accept maybe a little time and some chlorine. I think the first place to start is assuming that it's algae, and treating it as such.

But getting an ID can only help, this is why I ask people to collect a sample. To me shocking is a great first place to start. As a collection of the algae should also be at the beginning to try and help with an ID. In some cases it may be pollen. But until you take a collection or identify it as pollen I would treat it as algae. If you can prove or come to the conclusion that it's pollen then you may save yourself some troubles.

What type of filter do you have? If it's a DE or sand make sure you vacuum to waste. If it's a cartridge you will want to give it (and the filter body) a throughout cleaning.


Also...if it's possible for you to collect the substance in a squeeze bottle and send me the suspected algae, I'd like to take a look at it under a microscope. My hopes are just to narrow down what the common characteristics are of people who have mustard algae and those who have pollen/silt/etc. If anyone is able to send me their sample just send me a private message.

thanks,
dan