Competing Pool Specs-Advice?

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Itsjustme0770

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Nov 22, 2014
165
Dallas Texas
So we have two competing pool specs and have narrowed it down to these two builders. The prices are essentially the same.

I am listing them one after the other. Would love and appreciate any comments or criticisms. I know about the minimal decking which is referenced. We are building a cabana/fireplace/raised beds, etc and using a different builder for those and they will be handling the decking.


BID 2

Pool Data
• Perimeter: 146 Linear feet
• Area: 863 Square feet
• Depth: 3’5" – 8’5”
• Dimensions: 16’ x 50’

Permits
• Includes plans & city permits

Excavation
• Contact Dig Tess prior to excavation
• Provide removal of existing wall and driveway (2500sqft allowance)
• Provide standard excavation / Form work / Removal of spoils
• Rock excavation billed at $300 per hour (not included in base bid)
• Includes 10 helical piers w/ 10 extensions

Reinforcing Steel
• #4 Steel-8" O.C.E.W.(Floors and walls)
• #4 Steel transition bars (Stress points)
• #4 Steel 4 box beam
• #4 Steel additional reinforcement at skimmer location
• #4 steel – double curtain on spa wall

Gunite
• Walls, Floors, Benches, and Steps (3000 PSI Min.)
• 12” Beam / 8” to 12” Walls & floor
• Mixed onsite

Code Plumbing
• Backwash line to P-Trap (Includes first 100lft)
• Gas line from meter to heater (includes first 100lft)




Plumbing
• All plumbing to be schedule 40 PVC.
• Spa suction and returns to be 2.5” PVC
• 2 skimmers – individually plumbed w/ 2” PVC
• Split main drains w/ hydrostat – 2” PVC
• 5 pool returns
• 6 Hydro Air spa jets
• Jandy Never-lube Valves
• Overflow drain and fill line

Pool Equipment
• Pentair VS Intelliflo filter pump-1 http://www.pentairpool.com/pdfs/intelliflovspeedwtimerB.pdf
• Pentair FNS60 D.E. filter w/ backwash valve -1
• http://www.pentairpool.com/pdfs/fnsplusDS.pdf
• Pentair Intellitouch I-7 Computer control system
http://www.pentairpool.com/pdfs/intellitouchDS.pdf
• Pentair Wireless control remote
• Pentair LED Lights(3) pool, (1) spa
• http://www.pentairpool.com/pdfs/lightingB.pdf
• Rheem Heater 400,000BTU-1
Air Conditioning, Gas Furnaces and Water Heating Products by Rheem

• Ultrapure Ozone w/ Rainbow inline 320 chlorinator-1
Request Rejected
• Polaris 280 pool cleaner w/booster pump-1
Polaris Pool USA | #1 Swimming Pool Cleaner Worldwide | Polaris Automatic Pool Cleaners & Accessories

• SR Smith diving board


Electrical
• Connection and grounding of all pool equipment
• Installation of 4 underwater niche lights
• Bonding of pool steel, light brass and all metal components within 5
feet of water's edge
• Sub panel $300 extra if needed

Coping
• Includes precast coping for pool and spa
• Includes brick veneer for spa and hidden diving board area

Waterline tile
• 6” perimeter ceramic tile-($5.00/ S.F. material allowance
Noble Tile Supply - Noble Tile Supply

Decking
• Includes 400sqft acid etched concrete deck
• Includes 100lft of 4” drains


Interior Finish
• Durazzo polished plaster / Color TBD
http://sgm.cc/pdf/durazzo_new_web.pdf

Also Included
• Includes 15” raised spa
• Complete maintenance kit: (Pole/Brush/Leaf Net/Test Kit)
• Two week start up and brush-down service
• Operation instructions class to owners
• Programming of all equipment to homeowners specifications
• Custom brass deck drain and skimmer lids
• Alarm or house door mechanisms to meet code requirements.
• Clean up and removal of all pool construction debris

Not included in this bid
• Re-routing of any existing utilities (power, water, sewer, gas)
• Landscape installation
• Fence or irrigation modifications
• Rock charges for excavation or plumbing installation
• Covered pavilion, fireplace or fire pit areas


BID 2

1). Pool dimensions are 16 ft. x 50 ft. with an attached 9 ft. x 7 ft. spa. The pool depth is 3’-6” to 4’ to 8’-6”.
2). The spa is raised 15” with Brick veneer. There are 6 jets with split level seating and a 2h.p air blower for different speeds. There are two main drains and a fountain in the spa.
3). The steel rebar is all #4 or 1/2” steel throughout the entire pool. The steel centers are 5” and 10” on cente5. The beam is a #4 rebar California box beam and is 256% stronger than a typical Texas beam. *** The pool structure has 10 Helical piers 22 ft. deep.***
4). Texas shotcrete is pneumatically applied instead of typical dry gunite. The shotcrete has an average psi of close to 6000 vs 3000 with sand based gunite. ***
5). All pvc plumbing is run independently and laid flat with glued and fitted joints. All plumbing is pressure tested twice. Heat bent plumbing is not used anywhere including the spa to ensure structural stability.***
6). Intelliflo VS variable speed pump with anti entrapment device is used to exceed all local and federal guidelines. A booster pump for water feature is included.A 400,000 btu mastertemp heater with Easy touch remote control. A pool miser and Rainbow 320 chlorinator is included along with an ultra pure Ozone system. The filter is a DE FNS60 with a backwash line and P-trap or a Cartridge 520 system.
7). The equipment pad is hand formed and shot in place with Texas shotcrete to provide years of stabilization
8). 2” Lueder limestone coping and frost proof tile with $8.50 allowance is included.***
9). A 15” raised brick veneered wall and deck are located in the deep end of the pool. The 6 ft. Diving board is sunken in the deck. Two 21 ft. deep end ledges are included.
10). There is no decking.
11). The pool interior is state of the art Hydra mix that contains acrylic additives and Mexican beach sand which provides a smooth dense surface. This interior has a 10 year limited warranty.***
12). Never lube valves have a lifetime warranty. The Platinum pool cleaner has a ¾ h.p booster pump. All equipment has an exclusive 3 year Pentair warranty. The pool shell has a lifetime structural warranty.
13). All permits are included. Homeowner to get HOA approval.
14). All work is scheduled and supervised by Christopher Michaels and PoolscapesNTX.
15). The pool is filled and chemicals are added and maintained by PoolscapesNTX and its agent the Pool Surgeon for 5 days. The pool is brush vacumed and cleaned to insure the most precise start- up phase. All service work is performed by the Pool Surgeon, an authorized Pentair warranty station.***
16). Gas line hook up to pool heater of 120 ft. is included.is All electrical hook ups for pool equipment is included.
17). There is 2560 sq. ft. of driveway and wall and concrete demolition included.
 
I would suggest asking for a top shelf Robot replacement of the Polaris Booster/Pressure cleanser set ups on either bid. Doing that was the best thing I did on my entire build. IMO, Robots are the future of pool cleaning, but they clean better with less energy, noise and maintenance.

So which of these two are you leaning towards?
 
gwegan said:
One proposal call for piers the other does not. Do you have a soils report?

Why piers on one but not the other?
Click to expand...

There are piers on both proposals. We have terrible soil. Lots of movement. Good news is that our house has been in place for 100+ years, so it can be dealt with.

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YippeeSkippy said:
How are you planning on chlorinating the pool? Or was it only the ozone you rejected and not the inline chlorinater (that uses pucks that also contain that annoying CYA)?
Click to expand...

I believe both proposals call for an in-line rainbow 320 chlorinator.
 
Patrick_B said:
I would suggest asking for a top shelf Robot replacement of the Polaris Booster/Pressure cleanser set ups on either bid. Doing that was the best thing I did on my entire build. IMO, Robots are the future of pool cleaning, but they clean better with less energy, noise and maintenance.

So which of these two are you leaning towards?
Click to expand...

Thanks for the thoughts on the pool cleaning. I've been studying pool robots and I am interested in them. Would love to hear some recommendations of preferred robots. Assuming we go with the robot, is there any reason to still need the pressure pump?
 
Nope, and if you want a top shelf Cleaner look at a Dolphin M5/500, M4, or Z5. Hard to beat any of them. I love my M5, and would not want to be without it. Don't skimp on this, or your test kit. Two best things you may ever do for maintaining your pool I assure you.
 
Itsjustme0770 said:
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I believe both proposals call for an in-line rainbow 320 chlorinator.
Click to expand...

Yes, but do you *really* want to use it for extended periods? You will have problems with CYA if that builds up from the pucks. Big problems. Did you consider salt water chlorine generator or just using household bleach in daily doses?
 
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Itsjustme0770 said:
Thanks. We have decided against a swg for a number of reasons. If we decided at some point to go with household bleach is there any reason I couldn't simply remove the pucks from the inline chlorinated and go with bleach?
Click to expand...

mind if I ask why you didn't want the SWCG? not to be argumentative, but don't want to making decisions based on incorrect information, etc.

the pucks are a very bad idea, go to the "just started" section and read through all the new people finding this site with green pools and tons of problems...95% of them are due to the use of pucks and powdered shock and the CYA levels which can get sky high VERY quickly.
 

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Horror stories? chlorine is chlorine is chlorine. the SWCG just uses the salt that's in the water to create chlorine. no different than pouring bleach or chlorine in the pool. Its definitely the easiest way to maintain your chlorine in your pool, just get the controller adjusted to create the proper amount of chlorine and it does it every day. took me 3-4 days to "dial it in".

the horror stories you may have heard, are they related to algae? the thing with SWCG is they cannot create a huge amount of chlorine, so if you get an algae outbreak, they cannot create enough to overcome the algae growth rates and clear up the pool. the reason for this is people are letting their chlorine levels go too low, which allows the algae to grow. since you are on this website and hopefully have (or will have) a proper testing kit, that will not be a problem. I test my chlorine levels once or twice a week just to make sure. the other issue people have with SW pools is not having enough stabilizer (CYA), but again with the test kit you can get the right number. people with too low CYA allows too much chlorine to burn off from the sun.

honestly, the SWCG makes for about the most maintenance free pool you can do, without lugging around bleach, etc.

the only thing I do with my pool really is add some muriatic acid once a week to lower the pH.

I would defiantly recommend you read up on this website, I think you will find the SW is about the best option if you are ok with the upfront costs to put it in.

another problem people with SW pools have is putting too small of a cell, you need an oversized cell, the biggest you can get. will last longer and be more efficient.

I also love the "feel" of the SW pool. its 1/10th as salty as the ocean, you can barely barely taste the salt in the water. but it definetly is a softer feeling water and less irritation. I get compliments all the time when people swim in it that have never been in a SW pool. my daughter had eczema before we moved into the house, and she swims every day without rinsing off after and has not had a breakout since.
 
Sorry, I should have been more clear. The issues I have read about are corrosion both of decking and furniture, etc as well as internals of equipment.

I've been poking around on the site but if there is a specific article that can detail this info you could point me to, that would be great.
 
corrosion of the deck is easy to avoid, your PB should not spec out certain times of natural stone that are susceptible to salt corrosion.

furniture shouldn't be an issue if its outdoor furniture, the minimal salt content wont have an impact

internals of equipment? no corrosion concerns with that.

where have you been getting this info btw? just curious. there is a lot of misinformation on the internet about everything as you know. An many PB are great at building pools. but when it comes to how to maintain them, well, that's not their specialty.

post in the "just getting started" section about info on SW pools. Don't just take my word on it. I don't think there is a specific article on these issues, but there are a lot of threads im sure.

SW system should be around $1,500-$2,000 installed...if you already had chlorinator system in your bid, might not be an increase at all. definitely do your research
 
Just curious... Would a stenner pump setup dosing bleach provide the same benefits of convenience that a SWG would? If your liquid chlorine/bleach tank is big enough, you'd just fill it once every so often, not having to lug jugs all the time. So if salt water is a worry because of the kind of stone someone might want, then would this be a good alternative in a situation like the one Itsjustme has?
 
JamieP said:
Just curious... Would a stenner pump setup dosing bleach provide the same benefits of convenience that a SWG would? If your liquid chlorine/bleach tank is big enough, you'd just fill it once every so often, not having to lug jugs all the time. So if salt water is a worry because of the kind of stone someone might want, then would this be a good alternative in a situation like the one Itsjustme has?
Click to expand...

Exactly the choice we made. Our builder showed us pictures of 1 year old stone heavily pitted around a salt pool they built. In addition just about every builder we interviewed warned us against salt given our environment, rock sources/softness and water type. Not that they wouldn't install it but almost none of them would warranty the coping with it.
 
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