DE Filter Cleaning (Repair) Cost

You can always appeal any decision, so just because some petty bureaucrat makes a decision, that does not mean that you have to accept their opinion.

JPMorgan said:

There is only one application in Illinois (see attached). It covers new construction and major alterations. There is no application for other alterations to pool equipment.

Questions:
1) Should we just proceed with the the equipment changes without applying? If we submit an application, then it looks like we need to indicate that it is a "Major Alteration" and have an architect or engineer sign off. What, if any, could be the consequences at the next inspection when the inspector becomes aware of the changes we made to our equipment?
2) Should we ask our licensed pool contractor to submit an application and not check the "Major Alteration" box, but just describe the proposed changes. We would also not have an architect/ engineer sign off on the application... or does this invite an "incomplete submission" from the state official? Will a licensed pool contractor even do this?

What to do???

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If it’s not a major alteration then no permit is needed so no need to worry about which boxes to check. It’s up to the state to define what major alteration means if they care about it.

In my opinion, they probably won’t care if you change the feeder.

You could probably just have a licensed contractor do it without a permit.

If they want to make an issue about it later, they can, but I doubt they will.

Note: There are legal issues involved, so I am not making any suggestions or recommendations about what you can or cannot do or should or should not do.

Only you can decide what you want to do based on whatever information you can get from all sources including attorneys, contractors, city officials etc.

Do not base your decision on my opinion.

You might also have legal liability issues if you don’t get a permit and something goes wrong at some future point.

The safest thing from a liability point of view is to get a qualified engineer to develop drawings and plans for the installation and operation of any equipment and a permit with an inspection.

A licensed contractor should know if they are qualified to do the work or not.

So, as long as you hire a licensed contractor, you should be covered from a liability standpoint.

The contractor should know all legal requirements whereas a customer won’t be expected to know these things.

In my State the code compliance, and inspection guys can be different. One has a check list of things to check, not a list of what equipment the properties have. I could move the entire pump room to the other side of a building and they wouldn't know the difference.
Many times they only check for the same list of about ten items, they pencil whip the drain covers, because they didn't bring their scuba gear. They look for signs, shepherd hooks, lift buoys, emergency phones, spa shut offs, flow meters, gauges, gates and gate locks, the pool light, and they may or may not check ALL the chems.

We have some in the same city that might check all of that, or some that hardly check for one third of above. Their thing seems to be they want to find something stupid for you to fix, many times it's not on their check list if they even have one. They pass over little things all the time and we darn sure don't point it out if we are missing it or if it's broke. We just go back later to rectify it on our own. This summer the same dude inspected 5 pools and didn't even have a test kit. And of course our person walking with him was out of R13 and R4. How convenient for us right? No cya or Ph test. lol

If we pull a permit, a different code compliance guy will come out after weeks of back and forth paper work and fees. Before during and after the job is complete. Now that dude knows much more about what he is doing. Our rule of thumb is if you are not building something, or tearing it down, you almost never need a permit. Replacing something, like a filter, or timer is just that. Forget about different models, nomenclatures, or minor size differences your replacing or adding, and just focus on what the States intent is. Does what your replacing change the danger to you or others. Are you building something new, or adding to in a meaningful way, or taking away from a small structure. Like filling in a spa. From what I have read, no you are not. But I know nothing about your State or City.

Don't take this wrong, you are probably the kind of guy that will talk yourself into needing a permit that you do not really need. You need to be able to speak, ask, and answer questions about the above in whatever language they speak in. Like having a lawyer in court with a judge.

Somewhere in your city, there is an office with a little window and some lady sitting behind it that knows absolutely nothing about whatever your asking about. Like when you go to the DMV. Get passed her, and her supervisor, to get the number of the "guy" that knows about what your asking. The one who would go out to inspect for permits. Those ladies are going to give you several packets with forms that have nothing to do with you. Sometimes we spend weeks trying to get a permit for stuff we don't need permits for but all that paper work they give us implied that we do need a permit. You'll only get one shot asking that "guy" your questions, and how you answer his. If you make a mistake that you never knew were mistakes and he says you need a permit, your stuck with that guy now, and your on his radar. Changing his mind will be harder than having the right answer the first time.

" The flow rate on this pool is to low for it's size. How many gallons is this pool are you sure it's 45,000 gal?
What! No! That's way high, this is only about 32,000 gal, take away the steps, benches, and sun bathers it's no where near 45K.
Well that makes much more since on the flow rates".
"Yeah we're good here. "

Can you imagine answering that one simple question wrong?

Get a contractor to ask those questions for you if you truly are in a grey area. Like James said they should know the answer already.

I will say this when putting a bid together to get a job the contractors are going to want you to pay less to the Govt if they can. You seem to be worried about getting good bids from contractors. Why? Do they charge for quotes up there? Down here they are free and none binding. I don't see a downside of having lots of bids. The only money you are going to shave off from advice here will be on the items price if you buy them yourself, not the labor. TX, FL, CA, or HI are never going to compare against your contractor bids, in what I must say is a messed up state from what in hearing.

JPMorgan said:

Thanks for all the input. It's been very helpful! I will proceed with caution in relation to any changes in our equipment. I will probably draft an email to the Illinois Swimming Facility Dept. explaining what we want to do and citing the definition of "major alteration" and arguing that the liquid chlorine feeder is a "comparable component" to replace the trichlor feeder and that a sand filter is a "comparable component" to replace the DE filter.

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This was posted while before I could finished reading. Dude just stop. Why tell the State what you are doing? Like I predicted I can tell you now, your going to need permits for everything you inquire about if you go that route. Hey maybe you are dead to rights to the State on most of this, but Larry the contractor has the "guys" number on speed dial, with chuck. Larry should ask chuck for you. Again maybe you need a permits for everything. I just don't see how tho. Asking the State if you should pay them money, well they are going to say you already owe us money buddy. Pay up, lol Now what was your question? How can you pay us more, sure fill out these forms and pays us more.