Progress but slow as molasses!

SCPoolParadise said:

…. I get a free fill a year from the water company!

Click to expand...

Ah spoken like the denizen of a water-rich state

Here in Mad Max World, if you use any water without first informing the municipal water supplier, they have their own personal SWAT team that they send in. They bust down your door, demand to see all faucets/spigots, and then they confiscate any drinking water glass over 6 fl oz and hand you a pack of Dixie Cups instead. You only get one warning to use your water rations wisely or else “they’ll come back with the dogs” …

If they have to come back, they make you drink out of one of those hamster water feeders.

SCPoolParadise said:

at the bottom is my existing porch to my house (screened in mostly). Bricks on the left are for the water feature they are ssssllloooowwwllllyyyy building, they laying there not poured around them.

Click to expand...

If that section of concrete is continuous from the pool to the porch/house, a expansion joint is needed between the two.

Dirk said:

Ooh, I caught one in time! Given the shape of your pool, it'll be relatively easy to calculate its volume. But to double check...

Keep a close eye on the plasterers, because they'll start your fill the minute they finish. Just before they do, go take a picture of your city's water meter. Minimize water use in the house and yard (showers, toilet flushes, laundry, dishwasher, sprinklers, irrigation, etc). When the water level makes it halfway up the skimmer opening, turn off the fill and take another snap of the water meter. The difference between those two numbers will be your pool's volume, give or take a percentage point or two. The less water you use during the fill, the more accurate will be your number.

Click to expand...

Don't forget the meters read slow as they age so could read upwards of 20% less water than actual. My calculated volume was 11,000gallons but the meter only read 8,800 gallons. Given it is quite old and the fact I'm willing to keep paying for less water than I use I'm going to keep the old meter. One more thing.. Water Meters read in 100CF or sometimes just in CF. There's 7.48 gallons in a CF so do the math...

ShallowWater said:

Water Meters read in 100CF or sometimes just in CF.

Click to expand...

That's not a given. Some read in gallons. But good point, you have to know which is which.

The new meters in Tucson all read out in CCF (100 cu feet). They are all integrated with RF readouts so that the truck just has to drive by to grab the data. I live out in the county but I’m serviced by Tucson Water. When TW started replacing all the old analog meters in the old homes out here people lost their mind with rage. The old meters were terrible at reading low flow and would not register leaks and drips at all. The newer meters can detect a spit worth of water and read every single drop. Homeowners that had the old meters went from having water bills below $100 to suddenly having to pay $500 or more a month. At first Tucson water would ask permission to change the meter and try to schedule it but everyone resisted for obvious reasons. Then they decided to just do the replacements with only notifications of when the water would be off. Lots of very angry people when their bills suddenly jumped hundreds of dollars. Lots of leaky pipes and toilets were fixed and many drip irrigation systems ripped out as well …

JoyfulNoise said:

The new meters in Tucson all read out in CCF (100 cu feet). They are all integrated with RF readouts so that the truck just has to drive by to grab the data. I live out in the county but I’m serviced by Tucson Water. When TW started replacing all the old analog meters in the old homes out here people lost their mind with rage. The old meters were terrible at reading low flow and would not register leaks and drips at all. The newer meters can detect a spit worth of water and read every single drop. Homeowners that had the old meters went from having water bills below $100 to suddenly having to pay $500 or more a month. At first Tucson water would ask permission to change the meter and try to schedule it but everyone resisted for obvious reasons. Then they decided to just do the replacements with only notifications of when the water would be off. Lots of very angry people when their bills suddenly jumped hundreds of dollars. Lots of leaky pipes and toilets were fixed and many drip irrigation systems ripped out as well …

Click to expand...

Why would people rip out drip irrigation? It is the most efficient form of irrigation.

JoyfulNoise said:

The new meters in Tucson all read out in CCF (100 cu feet). They are all integrated with RF readouts so that the truck just has to drive by to grab the data. I live out in the county but I’m serviced by Tucson Water. When TW started replacing all the old analog meters in the old homes out here people lost their mind with rage. The old meters were terrible at reading low flow and would not register leaks and drips at all. The newer meters can detect a spit worth of water and read every single drop. Homeowners that had the old meters went from having water bills below $100 to suddenly having to pay $500 or more a month. At first Tucson water would ask permission to change the meter and try to schedule it but everyone resisted for obvious reasons. Then they decided to just do the replacements with only notifications of when the water would be off. Lots of very angry people when their bills suddenly jumped hundreds of dollars. Lots of leaky pipes and toilets were fixed and many drip irrigation systems ripped out as well …

Click to expand...

Now I'm curious. I've got three water meters on site now (more on that in a future write up I've been trying to get to). They're in series. My 12-year-old city water meter feeds the other two, so I could test all three by seeing how they compare. Water in now my biggest utility expense, by far.

I made a big stink when PG&E tried to get my old analog electric meter off my previous house. I figured they were going to use the meters at some point to determine exactly when I was using what, and one way or the other I'd be paying more. So I paid $10 a month for them to leave the old meter. Then I moved and now have a "smart" meter, no choice, it was here when I got here. Oh well, whaddayagunnado?

ShallowWater said:

Why would people rip out drip irrigation? It is the most efficient form of irrigation.

Click to expand...

My experience with drip is not that at all. At least in the desert southwest, surface watering is very inefficient. The clay soil combined with high heat and low humidity means very little water will actually make it to the plant. It will pool and evaporate before the plant can utilize it. So overwatering is required to keep plants alive. Couple that with how cheaply landscapers will install systems and all it takes is one broken 1/2” feeder line to go unnoticed for a few days and any “savings” you might have had are out the window.

Many old homes in Tucson had extensive irrigation systems that watered lots of greenery … that’s a recipe for high water use. At nearly $10/CCF, you can’t really afford to water landscaping. In fact, leaky irrigation is the biggest (ab)user of water, it’s right up there with leaky toilet bowls. If you have Tucson Water send out their Zanjero’s (water auditors) the first thing they will ask to see is your irrigation system and their number 1 recommendation for lowering your water bill is to get rid of the outdoor irrigation.

The most efficient irrigation system is … none at all. Here at least, people should only be installing native, drought tolerant plants. Xeriscaping is the fancy word used for it. Too many people try to have grass or fruit tree or extensive gardens and the result is overuse of the one resource we can’t live without - water.

JoyfulNoise said:

My experience with drip is not that at all. At least in the desert southwest, surface watering is very inefficient. The clay soil combined with high heat and low humidity means very little water will actually make it to the plant. It will pool and evaporate before the plant can utilize it. So overwatering is required to keep plants alive. Couple that with how cheaply landscapers will install systems and all it takes is one broken 1/2” feeder line to go unnoticed for a few days and any “savings” you might have had are out the window.

Many old homes in Tucson had extensive irrigation systems that watered lots of greenery … that’s a recipe for high water use. At nearly $10/CCF, you can’t really afford to water landscaping. In fact, leaky irrigation is the biggest (ab)user of water, it’s right up there with leaky toilet bowls. If you have Tucson Water send out their Zanjero’s (water auditors) the first thing they will ask to see is your irrigation system and their number 1 recommendation for lowering your water bill is to get rid of the outdoor irrigation.

The most efficient irrigation system is … none at all. Here at least, people should only be installing native, drought tolerant plants. Xeriscaping is the fancy word used for it. Too many people try to have grass or fruit tree or extensive gardens and the result is overuse of the one resource we can’t live without - water.

Click to expand...

I am begrudgingly coming to terms with these facts. I don't know how many gallons I poured over my stupid tomato plants, for literally a handful of small cherry tomatoes. I've yet to get a piece of fruit. All I'm doing is making the squirrels very happy. I did replace my lawns with a draught-tolerant ground cover, but that's just a dent. I'm going to have to keep replacing or removing plants if I want to be able to afford my water bill in the future. The local company has issued another 5-year cost increase notice, about a year or two before the last one has even played out. This will be ongoing forever, and I have to get off de Nile river onto dry land (literally).

Dirk said:

I am begrudgingly coming to terms with these facts. I don't know how many gallons I poured over my stupid tomato plants, for literally a handful of small cherry tomatoes. I've yet to get a piece of fruit. All I'm doing is making the squirrels very happy. I did replace my lawns with a draught-tolerant ground cover, but that's just a dent. I'm going to have to keep replacing or removing plants if I want to be able to afford my water bill in the future. The local company has issued another 5-year cost increase notice, about a year or two before the last one has even played out. This will be ongoing forever, and I have to get off de Nile river onto dry land (literally).

Click to expand...

Funny story -

We planted a bunch of photinia along a block wall to give it some green and I had the drip irrigation run to the same area. There a few other plants in the area but mostly photinia. The drip lines (1/4” spaghetti tubes) were all on 2 GPH emitters. For all the years that the irrigation system was running my photonia looked absolutely horrid - chlorosis, brown tips and edges on the leaves, weak spindly growth, just absolutely terrible. Then, about 3 years ago after spending an entire summer tracking down and fixing leaks in all the lines WEEKLY(!!), I got fed up and just shut off the irrigation system completely at the backflow valve. I was done. I said to my wife, “if it can’t survive what Mother Nature gives it, it dies. I’m done with leaks and $500 water bills.”

Well, ever since shutting off the irrigation system those photinia have been the stars of my backyard! Thick, lush growth, deep healthy green leaves, new leaf growth that starts off red, beautiful clusters of white flowers. And the hummingbirds are happy. And we have been through some hot and dry summers … they literally don’t care. I will occasionally hook up the soaker hose that runs along there and let it run to saturate the ground when it’s really hot but then that’s it and it goes off.

As for fruit trees, the soil in our area is just not right for it and the backfill they used in our lots I think is toxic waste they scrapped off the fields of the local Air Force base and sold to developers for cheap . That, and Tucson municipal water is so hard you might as well be spraying concrete slurry all over the yard.

Kill the irrigation, go native-only on the landscaping, install turf if you need a green patch to look at and get off the crazy-train of high water bills. You’ll be happier. I am.

I'm with ya. The ground cover I replaced my lawns with has been struggling. Neighbor has the same stuff and his is going gangbusters. I asked him the secret, and his watering schedule. He says "What water? I don't water it at all!" So the more I turn my down, the better it looks.

I recalled some advice I got from a nursery worker when I asked what I was doing wrong with a particular plant (this was at my previous house). I had told her that I had tried everything, and that I didn't want to keep replacing it. She replied "Some plants just don't have the will to live!"

It'll be interesting to see any difference between the hose meters and the street meter...

Not to digress too much but drip systems work fine if they're done mostly with ½" PVC and short lengths of ½" tubing with small ¼" leads to the emitter and the plants themselves are planted with organic mulch in the entire root zone expected for the full sized plant. I too live in a hot area but not quite as much so as Southern Arizona.

SCPoolParadise said:

well I accomplished plaster yesterday and it’s been filling all night. Took a picture of the water meter but I also have portable water meters on both hoses filling up. Looks like it’ll be filled at some point tomorrow. Now to get the PB back out there to power up equipment and finish that waterfallView attachment 464119

Click to expand...

Looking forward to seeing the finish fill!