Why not keep CYA in the low 100's? :)

Can you tell us how you are getting a 120 ppm CYA reading with your K2005? That would be very helpful.

I have a K2005 - along with a TF100 - and I know that you can't measure the CYA directly at 120.

Lots of members are here to help, but we would need more information.
 
I don’t want to pile on but….when you finish with the bio active “treatment” have your sump pump nearby with your refill hose. You be one to two days later in time though. Ask me how I know.
 
There are users who had great luck with the bioactive product and others that didn't, I'm very aware that it isn't a fool proof solution
So from what I've seen discussed in pieces over many threads is that the enzymes work awesome in the lab, but die in transit/ storage and you get a box full of useless powder. They haven't figured out to keep it alive (active?) long enough to make it to most people's pool. The few success stories (10% ? and I'm probably being too generous) are likely the folks who got real fresh product.
There are some users on this TFP forum of people running with high cya and high chlorine and I was wondering if anyone out there has done this and had advise.
Anyone who has tried to maintain a sanitary FC with 100+ FC has given up quickly at the massive amounts of bleach it took to keep the FC up accordingly. I imagine if any were to do so now with the current prices through the roof, they'd last a week and not 3 weeks.
They state that the chlorine despite being high (around 10ppm) will still "slowly" release and sanitize the pool and pose no harm while swimming.
Entirely true. Swimming is safe/sanitary between minimum (about 7.5% of CYA) and SLAM (40% of CYA) at any CYA value.
Some major experts suggest the copper sulphate poolrx with this setup.
None here. We avoid both copper and sulphates.

*****************************

No matter which way you go forward, make sure to do the dilution test for CYA first. Cut the pool water with tap water 50/50, add reagent and multiply times 2. It may be a 120, or 100 or 180. You can't see the 100+ as you'd like to because the scale is logarithmic and not linear. If you're going to treat/drain, the difference between 100 and 180 is huge and you'll want to be attacking it correctly from the start, not realizing you only went half as much as you should have.
 
Absolutely no offense taken and the comments are very much appreciated.
Let me try to clean things up a little bit. First off, thanks again for all the help. I use Taylor K2005 for maintaining my pool and also spot check at the pool store couple times a year. Taylor and pool store came in at roughly 120 ppm for cya. I've never had high cya before because I think I was dumping to waste when opening the pool and refilling it and hence the cya was good, now that I stopped doing that the pucks go ahead of me!

The solution is very clear, in order to lower CYA I have to dump the water. I get that, and honestly that is the number 1 response to lowering the cya that 99.87% of any pool owner will tell you. I have a very easy plan to implement that.

--> There are users who had great luck with the bioactive product and others that didn't, I'm very aware that it isn't a fool proof solution.
--> There are some users on this TFP forum of people running with high cya and high chlorine and I was wondering if anyone out there has done this and had advise.
--> They state that the chlorine despite being high (around 10ppm) will still "slowly" release and sanitize the pool and pose no harm while swimming.
--> Some major experts suggest the copper sulphate poolrx with this setup.

I was digging and exploring if that was more common with you the experts. And I haven't been to the happy hour yet but that is in the forecast!

Thanks for the help! Again, I know the standard solution to my high CYA! Was just digging into unChartEd waters and guess what I learned? LOL Go back to the basics!
If I could boil it down, add nothing (NOTHING) to a pool unless you fully understand why, what it will do, now and over the long term. I tease my wife that she even she can’t get in my perfectly balanced pool lol. If you are planning to add something other than very simple Cl, CH, TA adjusting chemicals, acid or pure salt, post the ingredients and I will guarantee you there is an expert here who can explain exactly why not to do it and how to solve whatever the problem is with just the basic time tested chemicals. The downside of adding magic elixirs is irreversible surface stains, chemistry that is impossible to correct without water replacement, tale of woe that goes on and on. Please, just don’t.

Chlorine is really good at killing things (I think among few only thing that kills everything) and ok at oxidizing organics. For a residential pool, the ok at organics is more than good enough. For magic bullet cures, there are side effects for everything. If you want to go at something with other than chlorine, make sure you understand the side effects. If you do, I think you will see that soley good old chlorine is the answer. Biomagics and copper sulfate do not belong in a pristine pool.

Also want to add that I have followed the advice given on this site (with slight deviations for increased FC and slightly lower CYA), the SWG run recommendations, pump and filter run recommendations, robot recommendations and I spend maybe 5 or 10 minutes per day on average maintaining the pool. I spend maybe 4 or 5 hours per day on my landscape and gardening. Maybe 2 hours per day on happy hour. It’s the way to be lol!
 
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The funny part is, the steps are where the algae grows every year and with the poolrx, 0 growth and in fact the steps are the cleanest white they have ever been.
You don’t need poolrx to have 0 algae growth. Your asking for trouble using copper as has been stated already.
 
Absolutely no offense taken and the comments are very much appreciated.
Let me try to clean things up a little bit. First off, thanks again for all the help. I use Taylor K2005 for maintaining my pool and also spot check at the pool store couple times a year. Taylor and pool store came in at roughly 120 ppm for cya. I've never had high cya before because I think I was dumping to waste when opening the pool and refilling it and hence the cya was good, now that I stopped doing that the pucks go ahead of me!

The solution is very clear, in order to lower CYA I have to dump the water. I get that, and honestly that is the number 1 response to lowering the cya that 99.87% of any pool owner will tell you. I have a very easy plan to implement that.

--> There are users who had great luck with the bioactive product and others that didn't, I'm very aware that it isn't a fool proof solution.
--> There are some users on this TFP forum of people running with high cya and high chlorine and I was wondering if anyone out there has done this and had advise.
--> They state that the chlorine despite being high (around 10ppm) will still "slowly" release and sanitize the pool and pose no harm while swimming.
--> Some major experts suggest the copper sulphate poolrx with this setup.

I was digging and exploring if that was more common with you the experts. And I haven't been to the happy hour yet but that is in the forecast!

Thanks for the help! Again, I know the standard solution to my high CYA! Was just digging into unChartEd waters and guess what I learned? LOL Go back to the basics!
A fc of 10ppm is not high for a cya of 120 - its barely Over minimum- as it falls the algae will return. The daily target should be near 14ppm. SLAM Process level is 47ppm. FC/CYA Levels (click on the link to the original chart)
The Ph test is not accurate at fc levels above 10ppm- this presents another ongoing balancing problem.
As mentioned above- clear water doesn’t equal sanitary water or else you would only receive boil water alerts from your municipality when the water “looked bad”.
Person to person transmission of pathogens is a real risk with under sanitized water.
This path u are on is only doable till its not. It’s trepidatious to say the least & certainly not recommended here.
An Overnight Chlorine Loss Test will actually determine whether u have algae/organics or not.
 
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At closing last year, my CYA was high at 130 and I was starting to see algae problems. Tried many things to reduce CYA including BioActive without success. My FC seemed to be locked at levels > 10 and going down very slowly, CC was > 1 - not safe. Copper was also building up due to multiple years of algaecide and then used CUlater to reduce. Things were getting expensive, neither BioActive or CULator are cheap. The BioActive product was a complete waste of money and did not work. BioActive needs to have your free chlorine at 1-5ppm while treating. I waited weeks for my FC to drop and I was never able to get it to drop to those levels. I thought it must be ok because my water is clear but something didn't feel right.

When I opened my pool this year, I checked CYA hoping it had gone down over winter and sure enough it did not. Frustrating. So the single best thing I did was to drain about 2/3 of the water and start over. Got rid of the pucks, switched to liquid bleach and started using the app Poolmath. I can honestly say the water is 10x better than last year, way more clear. With CYA of 50, I now target FC around 5-6 and my CC is always 0. No signs of algae and no algaecide used. My family has noticed a difference as well, no more green hair and itchy skin. I've saved so much money this year in pool chemicals. While it may seem ok with high CYA, there are more effective ways to maintain your pool. TFP seems to have a good recipe here.
 
Given that we are in mid season, I would leave things as they are, and keep your FC in the 1-3 ppm range. You don’t need to follow the FC/CYA chart because algal/fungal growth is preempted by the Poolrx system. During the next winterization cycle, you will lose some CYA, and depending on CYA at opening you can switch to the TFP method.
 
Given that we are in mid season, I would leave things as they are, and keep your FC in the 1-3 ppm range. You don’t need to follow the FC/CYA chart because algal/fungal growth is preempted by the Poolrx system. During the next winterization cycle, you will lose some CYA, and depending on CYA at opening you can switch to the TFP method.
Lack of visible algae doesn’t equal sanitary water conditions even if the poolrx does control some of the algae growth - which is questionable at best.
Maintaining only 1-3ppm fc with a cya of over 100 is not advisable & will cause many issues sooner rather than later.
Always follow the FC/CYA Levels to ensure sanitary water no matter what other magic potions/apparatuses are used.
The use of copper containing products is not recommended or endorsed on TFP.
The OP wanted to know the repercussions of continuing on with this high cya level & they have been laid out,
along with the possible solutions —> water exchange
or reverse osmosis
to reduce cya level so adequate chlorination balancing of other parameters is more manageable.
 

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keep your FC in the 1-3 ppm range. You don’t need to follow the FC/CYA chart because algal/fungal growth is preempted by the Poolrx system.
This is not solid advice. Following it could lead to an algae breakout even worse than you had before.

What needs to happen now is a 50% drain of the water to bring down the CYA and the extra stuff the poolrx put in the pool.
 
This is not solid advice. Following it could lead to an algae breakout even worse than you had before.

What needs to happen now is a 50% drain of the water to bring down the CYA and the extra stuff the poolrx put in the pool.

I also wonder if keeping chlorine that low would also be a sanitary hazard since the main job of chlorine is to kill pathogens.
 
I also wonder if keeping chlorine that low would also be a sanitary hazard since the main job of chlorine is to kill pathogens.
There is *zero* wondering, It would be unsafe. The industry is fixated on unsightly but harmless algae. It is nothing but the canary in the coal mine and if algae can grow, bacteria or swimmer to swimmer transmissions will flourish.
 
have verified with local big box test
I am actually a little surprised @Newdude hasn't brought up his analogy in this thread yet about cheating off the dumbest kid in the class. I would never compare my verified, and accurate test results with someone else's data that I am pretty sure is wrong. That's almost like me comparing my test results with my neighbors test strips who doesn't use the TFP way. They may be dead on for one test, but no way I would use that as reassurance my results are good.

Some major experts suggest the copper sulphate poolrx with this setup.
I won't even try to get into a more scientific discussion in this thread, the experts here, and I do mean experts, have already weighed in and are spot on.

But what I will say is, this comment is very similar to a new TFPer who isn't quite ready to embrace the TFP methods. "Other experts" told me this, the pool store told me that. The simple reality, is you have to either embrace the TFP way, or do not, that choice is up to everyone, and no one will come hunt you down if you head to Redit or Facebook, or some pool store. I mean, I wouldn't want to be in that pool, but its not mine to manage. It is just impossible to try and weave in parts of TFP, parts of other experts, and parts of pool store advice. Thousands of people have embraced it, and so many people are here to help out, for free, with nothing to sell, to help get us through it and understand it. I can not offer any advice to the OP that will hep, or deter from their theories, but will only say, if you want to embrace the TFP protocols, there is a wealth of knowledge and lots of rewards waiting for you.
 
You don’t need to follow the FC/CYA chart because algal/fungal growth is preempted by the Poolrx system.
As mentioned before, This is not good advice! Algae is the least of your problems when it comes to Sanitation(not harmful to humans) but if algae is growing this means Bacteria and viruses can thrive in that same environment, which is very harmful to humans.
 
Well, the contrarian always has to be contrary and looks like that’s me lol. And I get the call to not mix and match methods — but I don’t see it as so much embrace the TFP way or go some other way. I see it more as there’s plenty of different sources with different merit, all calling their way “expert,” and it can be hard for anyone new at this to sort out. It’s a process. Let folks ask questions, give your best answer, most people will come to realize you happen to be right. I don’t think it’s unreasonable for someone new at this to ask, like hey, some other guy says he knows what he’s talking about and swears by unicorn tears to kill algae like magic and make a rainbow sprout from the pool. What could possibly go wrong with unicorn tears? The answer is well, the unicorn tears might work like the guy says, but what he didn’t tell you is you’ll get splotches of essentially permanent green stains all over your very expensive pool finish, if you have light hair it may turn green and if you rely on even very expensive unicorn tears and don’t use enough chlorine, you may pick up pathogens that will make you very sick or die. Most folks can make the right decision. ;)

At the end of the process, there are valid reasons for every TFP way recommendation and valid reasons not to do things contrary to the recommendations. But everybody has to satisfy themselves of the simple truth of that and it usually involves a lot of “what abouts.”
 
I had several lengthy responses ready to send over the course of the last few days and before I can hit post my brain said waste no more time on this one and delete it was. I'm just sitting back. We will either find out or not depending on...........
 
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Well, the contrarian always has to be contrary and looks like that’s me lol. And I get the call to not mix and match methods — but I don’t see it as so much embrace the TFP way or go some other way. ;)

At the end of the process, there are valid reasons for every TFP way recommendation and valid reasons not to do things contrary to the recommendations. But everybody has to satisfy themselves of the simple truth of that and it usually involves a lot of “what abouts.”
You are missing a key point -


Contrary to what many believe, TFP does not exist to discuss ALL methods of pool care, but a singular method that has come to be known as Trouble Free Pool care. It involves accurate self testing of your pool water and only adding what the pool needs.

We want pool owners to understand that "traditional" methods of pool care as taught by many pool stores are often adding things to your pool that you really don't need. From CYA in stabilized pool products to the UV and ozone in the "lower chlorine" methods we feel you don't want or need them. High CYA, low CYA, copper, flock, clarifier and a hundered other things some people use for their pools are not taught here.

We are not here to discuss other methods like natural pool care and while other methods like Baqua or Bromine are discussed, but we try to explain that TFP methods are easier and less expensive.

A few times a year someone shows up with the "chlorine is poison" point of view. These types posts are moved to our forum "Agree to Disagree". As long a folks remain civil we let folks talk away to their hears content. But, what generally happens is that this new member gets frustrated that they can't convince all,of us that we should stop using chlorine and begin acting less than civil. At that point the thread is usually deleted.

Some forums just lock threads with rule violations and bad information, but leaving it up just gives that poster a permanent record of their thought to link to. We don't need to support someone else's soapbox. Plus, we don't need misinformation showing up in Google searches.

We invite everyone to participate, but we ask that when making recommendation, please follow our methods.

I guess it just comes down to the fact that as one person said in frustration because we didn't agree to give up chlorine that "TFP is nothin but a chlorine forum". In a way, I guess we are.........

People are more than welcome to talk about any pool care method they like, but somewhere else. We don't want someone to wander in and be confused that this is what we teach or how we think a pool should be maintained.
 
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You are missing a key point -


Contrary to what many believe, TFP does not exist to discuss ALL methods of pool care, but a singular method that has come to be known as Trouble Free Pool care. It involves accurate self testing of your pool water and only adding what the pool needs.

We want pool owners to understand that "traditional" methods of pool care as taught by many pool stores are often adding things to your pool that you really don't need. From CYA in stabilized pool products to the UV and ozone in the "lower chlorine" methods we feel you don't want or need them. High CYA, low CYA, copper, flock, clarifier and a hundered other things some people use for their pools are not taught here.

We are not here to discuss other methods like natural pool care and while other methods like Baqua or Bromine are discussed, but we try to explain that TFP methods are easier and less expensive.

A few times a year someone shows up with the "chlorine is poison" point of view. These types posts are moved to our forum "Agree to Disagree". As long a folks remain civil we let folks talk away to their hears content. But, what generally happens is that this new member gets frustrated that they can't convince all,of us that we should stop using chlorine and begin acting less than civil. At that point the thread is usually deleted.

Some forums just lock threads with rule violations and bad information, but leaving it up just gives that poster a permanent record of their thought to link to. We don't need to support someone else's soapbox. Plus, we don't need misinformation showing up in Google searches.

We invite everyone to participate, but we ask that when making recommendation, please follow our methods.

I guess it just comes down to the fact that as one person said in frustration because we didn't agree to give up chlorine that "TFP is nothin but a chlorine forum". In a way, I guess we are.........

People are more than welcome to talk about any pool care method they like, but somewhere else. We don't want someone to wander in and be confused that this is what we teach or how we think a pool should be maintained.
That’s ok, and I’m not making an argument; just an observation. If that’s how you do things, it’s not a discussion, it’s a book. Read it and take it or leave it. I’ve read many times that some see this site as a teaching site. When you say “talking about pool care” do you mean asking questions as a student should to understand the material, ”why do this?” or “why not do that?” or “somebody told me x“ and implicit in posting it here is “what do you all think of that? or do you mean advocating a contrary position that is known to be wrong? I agree the latter might deserve a different response than the former. I don’t think they deserve the same response.

I see what you’re saying in the examples you gave, and yeah, I agree with you. But those examples are strawmen not found (at least I didn’t see it) in the discussion here.
 

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