Calcium hardness super high - planning to drain this weekend but will be on-going issue

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Regeneration of the On the Go RV water softener is easy, but does take time.
First I unhook the outlet hose and hook up a hose to run to my sewer cleanout. Then take off the inlet hose and use an air hose to blow out the water. Then take the top off and dump the two boxes (about 3#) of salt into the vessel. Hook back up the inlet hose. Then run the water through the softener at the low rate as described in the instructions for about 30 minutes. Then flush at a high rate. Take the outlet hose off and hook back up to the autofill.

If there is any way to use a conventional softener, do it. My only issue was no place to send the effluent during regeneration. Or if you have an available softened water line (even inside the home) near the equipment pad, get that run to the autofill.
 
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kul said:
Is there an alternative to an air hose? Hmm I don’t have one.
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You can take the vessel and turn it on its side, gently, and drain off some water. The air is just easier. You need space in the vessel for the salt to go.
 
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Thanks! I think we typed at the same time. I’ll just use the tilt method when it’s time to regenerate.
 
JenniferMarie90 said:
Ok that was easier than I thought lol ok the red dot is where my water soften is, in my garage. The blue dot is where the autofill line piping is. This is an old pic obviously because the grass is now a pool lol
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On the left side of that picture, does there happen to be a bathroom or the kitchen with a sink or other plumbing fixture on the outside wall of the house? If so, a plumber could easily tap into the softened cold water line and plumb it to the ouside. Then run the pipe to the area of the present autofill line and hook it up to the autofill.
 
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mknauss said:
Or if you have an available softened water line (even inside the home) near the equipment pad, get that run to the autofill.
Click to expand...
proavia said:
On the left side of that picture, does there happen to be a bathroom or the kitchen with a sink or other plumbing fixture on the outside wall of the house? If so, a plumber could easily tap into the softened cold water line and plumb it to the ouside. Then run the pipe to the area of the present autofill line and hook it up to the autofill.
Click to expand...
JenniferMarie90 said:
Ok that was easier than I thought lol ok the red dot is where my water soften is, in my garage. The blue dot is where the autofill line piping is. This is an old pic obviously because the grass is now a pool lol
Click to expand...
I have a whole-home softener (no longer active) and there is simply no reasonable way to tie in the autofill. I chose the RV softener as a less-than-perfect alternative. That may be your case as well, but explore all options before moving forward with other options. Follow the advice from Marty and Gene and look for accessible water sources.
 
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proavia said:
On the left side of that picture, does there happen to be a bathroom or the kitchen with a sink or other plumbing fixture on the outside wall of the house? If so, a plumber could easily tap into the softened cold water line and plumb it to the ouside. Then run the pipe to the area of the present autofill line and hook it up to the autofill.
Click to expand...
Hey there, I took a look and there is a spot on that wall where we could access the water softener for the house. We would have to cut open the plaster siding and through our cement block wall, BUT its doable! So I'm thinking of doing that. I do have a question for you guys, regardless of the softener we put in, we will need to partially or all the way drain. I have pebblesheen surface, is it better to try and drain and refill at the same time so the surface isn't exposed at all? Or is it better to drain and then refill with the surface exposed to the air/sun?
 
A quick drain and refill would be fine and will save water while getting your CH down to an acceptable level.

What is your pool water CH right now? Can't remember if you reported it earlier. If you share your PoolMath logs, we could see your test results.
If not too high, you can manage with it thru the summer swim season and plan a full drain in the fall/winter when the temps are lower. If it's really high, possibly draining and refilling this week may work better as the temperature should be more moderate in Vegas this week.
 
JenniferMarie90 said:
I took a look and there is a spot on that wall where we could access the water softener for the house. We would have to cut open the plaster siding and through our cement block wall, BUT its doable! So I'm thinking of doing that.
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This is good. It may cost a bit to get it done, but when you add up costs associated with annual drain/refills (water, CYA, salt, MA, liquid chlorine) it's worth the initial investment.
 
proavia said:
A quick drain and refill would be fine and will save water while getting your CH down to an acceptable level.

What is your pool water CH right now? Can't remember if you reported it earlier. If you share your PoolMath logs, we could see your test results.
If not too high, you can manage with it thru the summer swim season and plan a full drain in the fall/winter when the temps are lower. If it's really high, possibly draining and refilling this week may work better as the temperature should be more moderate in Vegas this week.
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Its about 750
 

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It may be best to drain it now, before the heat sets in.

If you choose to tackle this now - as the pool is draining and refilling, hose down the sides with a hose or set up a sprinkler to keep it damp/moist.

How many hoses can you dedicate to the refill process?

Before starting the refill, take a picture of your water meter and another picture right after it's done refilling. Compare the two readings to give you a pretty close indication of your pool volume.
 
proavia said:
It may be best to drain it now, before the heat sets in.

If you choose to tackle this now - as the pool is draining and refilling, hose down the sides with a hose or set up a sprinkler to keep it damp/moist.

How many hoses can you dedicate to the refill process?

Before starting the refill, take a picture of your water meter and another picture right after it's done refilling. Compare the two readings to give you a pretty close indication of your pool volume.
Click to expand...
I think we can get some more hoses and maybe even a higher capacity pump from DH's work. I'm really not looking forward to this though but I think you're right, it needs to get done before it gets too hot out.
 
JenniferMarie90 said:
I think we can get some more hoses and maybe even a higher capacity pump from DH's work. I'm really not looking forward to this though but I think you're right, it needs to get done before it gets too hot out.
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After this front goes thru I think we are done with "winter" - at least in the south western US. You are going to have to do it at some point. Better now than when it gets hotter. Hotter is for enjoying a dip in the TFP water.

If you drain, just remember to keep the exposed plaster damp whenever the sun is directly on the pebblesheen.
 
proavia said:
After this front goes thru I think we are done with "winter" - at least in the south western US. You are going to have to do it at some point. Better now than when it gets hotter. Hotter is for enjoying a dip in the TFP water.

If you drain, just remember to keep the exposed plaster damp whenever the sun is directly on the pebblesheen.
Click to expand...
I have to say my husband and I are really having some arguments about this whole thing. He’s saying he doesn’t see anyone else in Las Vegas with softeners for the pool so how is it fine for them? And then I did talk to someone at work and their calcium was 700 but that’s after 3 years. I have salt in my pool for the SWG. Mani doing something wrong that my calcium increased so much in one year? He’s thinking it’s something I did or didn’t do and I’m left feeling sort of confused and frustrated and sort of uneducated. I remember speaking to my PB about hardness from the get go and he said he’s built however many pools here in Vegas and it’s a “nonissue”…did I do something wrong here?
 
JenniferMarie90 said:
And then I did talk to someone at work and their calcium was 700 but that’s after 3 years.
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I would question the source and accuracy of his test results. We know not to trust pool store tests. That said, not all pools will experience the same rate of CH increase. Picture two pools with the same surface area (footprint). One is deep (more volume) and one is shallow (less volume). Water evaporates from the surface from both pools at the same rate, so the same amount of fill water is added. The pool with the smaller volume will experience a more rapid CH increase than the larger pool.
JenniferMarie90 said:
Mani doing something wrong that my calcium increased so much in one year? He’s thinking it’s something I did or didn’t do and I’m left feeling sort of confused and frustrated and sort of uneducated.
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You're not. It's science and chemistry or something like that. Have confidence in your knowledge and skills and in the TFP method. I feel bad that you're stuck in the middle.
 
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  • Your water comes from the Colorado River/Lake Mead.
  • The CH of your fill water is about 250+ ppm.
  • Being in Vegas (desert) the water volume of your pool evaporates at least every 12 months (probably more).
  • When the water evaporates it leaves behind the total dissolved solids (TDS).
  • This includes the salt, CYA and (you guessed it) calcium (CH). There are also a few additional trace solids.
So, as the water evaporates, you add fill water with a CH of 250+.
Starting with a fresh fill, CH is about 250+.
A year or less later you have added an additional 250 CH (see above). Now CH is about 500+.
Another year goes by and now the CH is 750+.
CH above 800 becomes more difficult to manage.
Add in the SWG and it is more critical to better manage the water parameters to slow/prefent SWG scaling.

You already know enough NOT to trust pool store test results. Sadly, most pool owners have no clue. They continue to throw unneeded chemicals and $$$$ at their pools. They have cloudy water and usually get algae - but they were told by other pool owners and pool stores that this is "normal`.

  • I live near Phoenix.
  • My pool volume evaporates every 9-14 months (wx and humidity dependent)
  • I started to have the same questioning coming from my wife when I began using TFP methods.
  • I advised her that SHE could take over the pool duties. Like most, she knows little about pool care.
  • She got real quiet and I continued along the TFP path.
  • A few months later, she told me that I was actually spending LESS time taking care of the pool and that it looked and felt SO much better.
  • Over 7 years later, I am still stuck caring for the pool on my own. :brickwall:
  • Last year I plumbed the softener to the pool autofill.
  • In the past year, my CH has risen 50ppm (unsoftened fill water was 225ppm). Prior to using soft water for the autofill, my CH went up by 300+ppm every year.
  • This year when I told her I was going to buy and install an SWG ($$), all she said was "go for it".
  • We have the clearest pool water in the neighborhood with little effort.
  • She is happy.
You could always ask him if he wants you to be happy.
Continue on with TFP. You won't be disappointed.
Happy wife, happy life.
 
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proavia said:
  • Your water comes from the Colorado River/Lake Mead.
  • The CH of your fill water is about 250+ ppm.
  • Being in Vegas (desert) the water volume of your pool evaporates at least every 12 months (probably more).
  • When the water evaporates it leaves behind the total dissolved solids (TDS).
  • This includes the salt, CYA and (you guessed it) calcium (CH). There are also a few additional trace solids.
So, as the water evaporates, you add fill water with a CH of 250+.
Starting with a fresh fill, CH is about 250+.
A year or less later you have added an additional 250 CH (see above). Now CH is about 500+.
Another year goes by and now the CH is 750+.
CH above 800 becomes more difficult to manage.
Add in the SWG and it is more critical to better manage the water parameters to slow/prefent SWG scaling.

You already know enough NOT to trust pool store test results. Sadly, most pool owners have no clue. They continue to throw unneeded chemicals and $$$$ at their pools. They have cloudy water and usually get algae - but they were told by other pool owners and pool stores that this is "normal`.

  • I live near Phoenix.
  • My pool volume evaporates every 9-14 months (wx and humidity dependent)
  • I started to have the same questioning coming from my wife when I began using TFP methods.
  • I advised her that SHE could take over the pool duties. Like most, she knows little about pool care.
  • She got real quiet and I continued along the TFP path.
  • A few months later, she told me that I was actually spending LESS time taking care of the pool and that it looked and felt SO much better.
  • Over 7 years later, I am still stuck caring for the pool on my own. :brickwall:
  • Last year I plumbed the softener to the pool autofill.
  • In the past year, my CH has risen 50ppm (unsoftened fill water was 225ppm). Prior to using soft water for the autofill, my CH went up by 300+ppm every year.
  • This year when I told her I was going to buy and install an SWG ($$), all she said was "go for it".
  • We have the clearest pool water in the neighborhood with little effort.
  • She is happy.
You could always ask him if he wants you to be happy.
Continue on with TFP. You won't be disappointed.
Happy wife, happy life.
Click to expand...
Thank you for that. Yeah he told me to care for the pool myself so I’ve educated myself but then I get asked questions he doesn’t believe my answers which makes me question my own self. I appreciate you sharing your journey as well. I’m going to drain it this weekend. I’m curious though because I didn’t have to handle this part, I have to add CYA and pool salt pretty soon after. Is there a recommended order to that?
 
After drain/refill, post a full set of test results and we will help you out.

Based on the results and not needing to tweak other chemicals...
Add CYA to your target level using the sock method.
Add salt to your target level, brush until dissolved. Run pump continuously for 24 hours after all salt is dissolved to fully mix the salt and pool water before turning SWG back on.
You can do both basically at the same time.
You may have to add liquid chlorine to keep FC in target range for your CYA. That would be the CYA level you are targeting by the added stabilizer, even if not fully dissolved or reading on the CYA test yet.

Since it's your responsibility and you know what you are doing, do it.
Don't doubt the knowledge you have acquired here.
If you have any questions, ask here - even if only to double check.
Anyone asks questions, just provide the link to TFP and have them read thru ALL of Pool School.
Knowledge is power.....
 
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proavia said:
After drain/refill, post a full set of test results and we will help you out.

Based on the results and not needing to tweak other chemicals...
Add CYA to your target level using the sock method.
Add salt to your target level, brush until dissolved. Run pump continuously for 24 hours after all salt is dissolved to fully mix the salt and pool water before turning SWG back on.
You can do both basically at the same time.
You may have to add liquid chlorine to keep FC in target range for your CYA. That would be the CYA level you are targeting by the added stabilizer, even if not fully dissolved or reading on the CYA test yet.

Since it's your responsibility and you know what you are doing, do it.
Don't doubt the knowledge you have acquired here.
If you have any questions, ask here - even if only to double check.
Anyone asks questions, just provide the link to TFP and have them read thru ALL of Pool School.
Knowledge is power.....
Click to expand...
Thank you I definitely will post the results. I have another question, sorry, now that my autofill is plumbed to its own softener, could this increase the salt in the pool as well? I'm worried that'll increase to a point I'll to have to drain as well...
 

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