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It is currently May 25th, 2012, 10:23 pm
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jsw5620
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Post subject: Why the difference between FC levels here and manufacturer?  Posted: August 25th, 2011, 11:22 am |
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Joined: March 30th, 2011, 8:24 pm Posts: 129
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I have been trying to get my SWCG percent and power levels set up. The minimum FC on here in the chart and calculator is 4ppm and recommended is 6ppm. The manufacturer recommends 1-3ppm and when I spoke with them they insisted I was putting unnecessary stress on my cell trying to maintain anything above the 3ppm.
_________________ 31,000G IG vinyl 20X40 True L. Hayward 1.5 superpump, Autopilot Pool Pilot Digital SWG, Hayward Model S244T 300lb sand filter, TF100 kit
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Optica
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Post subject: Re: Why the difference between FC levels here and manufactur  Posted: August 25th, 2011, 11:27 am |
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Joined: July 11th, 2011, 10:53 pm Posts: 70 Location: Southern California
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What level of CYA are they using for that recommended FC level?
_________________ ___________________________________________________ 12,000 Gal IGP, Gunite/Plaster, Pentair DE & Pump, Heliocol Solar, K-2006, BBB'd & Borated.
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jsw5620
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Post subject: Re: Why the difference between FC levels here and manufactur  Posted: August 25th, 2011, 11:33 am |
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Joined: March 30th, 2011, 8:24 pm Posts: 129
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They recommend a CYA of 60-80ppm
_________________ 31,000G IG vinyl 20X40 True L. Hayward 1.5 superpump, Autopilot Pool Pilot Digital SWG, Hayward Model S244T 300lb sand filter, TF100 kit
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Poolsean
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Post subject: Re: Why the difference between FC levels here and manufactur  Posted: August 25th, 2011, 3:41 pm |
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Joined: April 15th, 2007, 9:48 pm Posts: 1203 Location: Ft Lauderdale, Florida
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Jsw, what size cell do you have and how many hours a day are you running your pump? You should be fine running 4 or 6 ppm though. It is on the high side for a residential Pool. Just increase the output until you get to your desired chlorine level.
_________________ Sean Assam
Commercial Products Sales Manager
Aqua Cal Heat Pumps
AutoPilot Salt Chlorine Generators
www.autopilot.com
www.aquacal.com
sean@teamhorner.com
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linen
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Post subject: Re: Why the difference between FC levels here and manufactur  Posted: August 25th, 2011, 4:13 pm |
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Joined: July 30th, 2010, 8:56 am Posts: 1793 Location: Minnesota
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Full disclosure: Intex swg, northern clim (short swim season, sometimes lower nightime temps, lower overall pool temps compared to the southern folk unless we go crazy with the solar), CYA of 50 ppm (currently). I will let my FC run as low as 1 ppm  (poolcalculator.com has 2 a my minimum), not all the time, but sometimes 1-2 times a week depending on temperature. Don't yell at me frog I should mention these additional caveats, I test FC and CC daily, I run the swg during the day, my pump runs on low 24/7 (unless doing solar, then it is on high), when there is high swimmer load I increase my intex swg on time and on rare occasions suppliment with LC, and my family is very clean (okay this last one is a lie...my wife, who is clean, would not agree that the rest of us are, me and the three boys basically take our baths in the pool during the summer) /disclosure They guidelines for levels on this forum are conservative (FC higher), and rightly so. This is the "Trouble Free Pool" site and the levels are based off of empirical data that has shown to give good results to most pools, in most locations, environments, etc. When knucleheads like me  push the limits sometimes/sometime it may/will backfire. As to why the swg manufacturers list lower levels, I think they are not being conservative, they may be assuming other methods of algae prevention are at play, like algicides, etc. Remember, although swg systems are gaining steam and changing the industry, they are not separate from the whole pool store food chain.
_________________ Going to Pool School and learning the BBB method of pool care with a TF100 test kit that helps me use the Pool Calculator to properly maintain the water in my: Round AGP 11K gal (free on CL) with a deep end, Meteor 20" sand filter, Matrix 1hp 2spd, 4 2ftX20ft Sungrabber panels, Intex SWCG (copper bars removed), and Borates. Also a Rubadub hot tub and a UDS (Ugly Drum Smoker) poolside. If your water has you worried, do an Overnight Chlorine Loss Test (OCLT), and if you fail, then follow the Shocking Process until: 1. CC is less than 0.5 ppm, 2. An OCLT shows a loss of 1.0 ppm or less and, 3. The water is crystal clear.
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jsw5620
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Post subject: Why the difference between FC levels here and manufacturer?  Posted: August 25th, 2011, 8:00 pm |
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Joined: March 30th, 2011, 8:24 pm Posts: 129
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Poolsean wrote: Jsw, what size cell do you have and how many hours a day are you running your pump? You should be fine running 4 or 6 ppm though. It is on the high side for a residential Pool. Just increase the output until you get to your desired chlorine level. I am running the rc-52 cell. The pump is running 10hrs a day right now. 6hrs from 12am-6am and 4hrs from 10am-2pm. Right now it is at power level 2 at 75%, buy that temp is automatically adjusted higher or lower based on water temp.
_________________ 31,000G IG vinyl 20X40 True L. Hayward 1.5 superpump, Autopilot Pool Pilot Digital SWG, Hayward Model S244T 300lb sand filter, TF100 kit
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jsw5620
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Post subject: Re: Why the difference between FC levels here and manufactur  Posted: August 25th, 2011, 9:44 pm |
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Joined: March 30th, 2011, 8:24 pm Posts: 129
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Just tested my Chlorine levels. Running 10 hours per day as previous stated, I now have FC of 3ppm and CC of 1ppm. My water is crystal clear. I am at power level of 2 at 75% output. Now, should I increase the run time to 12hrs per day or leave it at 10 and increase the %? If I increase the run time 2hrs, do I tack those two hours on to the daytime run or nighttime run? I really didn't think I would have to run levels this high. I was thinking max of 50% at level of 2 since my cell is rated for 52,000 gallons and I am only at about 31,000 gallons. If I understood the manufacturer, he said the cell is only rated for like 550lbs of chlorine output before it needs replacing so the more I use it the faster I am going to have to replace it.
_________________ 31,000G IG vinyl 20X40 True L. Hayward 1.5 superpump, Autopilot Pool Pilot Digital SWG, Hayward Model S244T 300lb sand filter, TF100 kit
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linen
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Post subject: Re: Why the difference between FC levels here and manufactur  Posted: August 25th, 2011, 9:49 pm |
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Joined: July 30th, 2010, 8:56 am Posts: 1793 Location: Minnesota
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Hate to say this jsw, but with 1 ppm CC, that is a sign you may need to shock. I would redo the test to make sure the CC measurement was right and if it repeats, either go directly into the shocking process: http://www.troublefreepool.com/pool-school/shocking_your_pool or a least raise you pool to/towards shock level and do a OCLT see: http://www.troublefreepool.com/pool-school/overnight_fc_test...Sorry if you know this already...
_________________ Going to Pool School and learning the BBB method of pool care with a TF100 test kit that helps me use the Pool Calculator to properly maintain the water in my: Round AGP 11K gal (free on CL) with a deep end, Meteor 20" sand filter, Matrix 1hp 2spd, 4 2ftX20ft Sungrabber panels, Intex SWCG (copper bars removed), and Borates. Also a Rubadub hot tub and a UDS (Ugly Drum Smoker) poolside. If your water has you worried, do an Overnight Chlorine Loss Test (OCLT), and if you fail, then follow the Shocking Process until: 1. CC is less than 0.5 ppm, 2. An OCLT shows a loss of 1.0 ppm or less and, 3. The water is crystal clear.
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frogabog
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Post subject: Re: Why the difference between FC levels here and manufactur  Posted: August 25th, 2011, 9:57 pm |
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Joined: July 16th, 2010, 4:22 am Posts: 1068 Location: Portland, Oregon
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If you do shock the pool as Linen suggested (I concur, 1ppm CC means shock), turn OFF the SWG. No sense wasting your cell while shocking, and it'll skew the test results if you do run it anyway.
_________________ Where kids swim in 54 degree water, turn blue, and giggle happily cuz they got a POOL! Year 2 BBB -15' x 48" Intex Metal Frame - Two 1000gph Intex style pump/filters (see full-time-pumping-intex-t33543.html) I use http://www.poolcalculator.com for minimum/maximum and shocking chlorine levels Don't waste time and energy looking for a better value on test kits, the TF100 is the best deal around http://www.tftestkits.net
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jsw5620
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Post subject: Re: Why the difference between FC levels here and manufactur  Posted: August 25th, 2011, 10:22 pm |
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Joined: March 30th, 2011, 8:24 pm Posts: 129
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Ok, just retested again using a different water container and the new chems I ordered. I am at a CYA of 70 now, due to all of the backwashing and stuff from previous shock a couple of weeks ago. When I tested earlier my equipment wasn't running (not sure if it should be), but I fired up the equipment this time and tested where I normally do by a return in the deep end. I am now getting FC of 5ppm and CC of .5ppm.
_________________ 31,000G IG vinyl 20X40 True L. Hayward 1.5 superpump, Autopilot Pool Pilot Digital SWG, Hayward Model S244T 300lb sand filter, TF100 kit
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linen
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Post subject: Re: Why the difference between FC levels here and manufactur  Posted: August 25th, 2011, 10:29 pm |
| Mod Squad |
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Joined: July 30th, 2010, 8:56 am Posts: 1793 Location: Minnesota
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jsw5620 wrote: I am now getting FC of 5ppm and CC of .5ppm. Phew, you had me worried there 
_________________ Going to Pool School and learning the BBB method of pool care with a TF100 test kit that helps me use the Pool Calculator to properly maintain the water in my: Round AGP 11K gal (free on CL) with a deep end, Meteor 20" sand filter, Matrix 1hp 2spd, 4 2ftX20ft Sungrabber panels, Intex SWCG (copper bars removed), and Borates. Also a Rubadub hot tub and a UDS (Ugly Drum Smoker) poolside. If your water has you worried, do an Overnight Chlorine Loss Test (OCLT), and if you fail, then follow the Shocking Process until: 1. CC is less than 0.5 ppm, 2. An OCLT shows a loss of 1.0 ppm or less and, 3. The water is crystal clear.
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jsw5620
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Post subject: Re: Why the difference between FC levels here and manufactur  Posted: August 25th, 2011, 10:33 pm |
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Joined: March 30th, 2011, 8:24 pm Posts: 129
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linen wrote: jsw5620 wrote: I am now getting FC of 5ppm and CC of .5ppm. Phew, you had me worried there  You and me both! I was gonna cry if I had to shock again  So is it correct to test with equipment on?
_________________ 31,000G IG vinyl 20X40 True L. Hayward 1.5 superpump, Autopilot Pool Pilot Digital SWG, Hayward Model S244T 300lb sand filter, TF100 kit
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frogabog
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Post subject: Re: Why the difference between FC levels here and manufactur  Posted: August 25th, 2011, 10:35 pm |
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Joined: July 16th, 2010, 4:22 am Posts: 1068 Location: Portland, Oregon
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If you're testing the functionality of the equipment, of course! :~}
That sounds good actually. Right where it should be. I'd watch it though, and test tomorrow morning after the SWG has been off to see what kind of loss you have (if any).
_________________ Where kids swim in 54 degree water, turn blue, and giggle happily cuz they got a POOL! Year 2 BBB -15' x 48" Intex Metal Frame - Two 1000gph Intex style pump/filters (see full-time-pumping-intex-t33543.html) I use http://www.poolcalculator.com for minimum/maximum and shocking chlorine levels Don't waste time and energy looking for a better value on test kits, the TF100 is the best deal around http://www.tftestkits.net
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jsw5620
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Post subject: Re: Why the difference between FC levels here and manufactur  Posted: August 25th, 2011, 10:37 pm |
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Joined: March 30th, 2011, 8:24 pm Posts: 129
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My equipment is actually scheduled to run at night. From Midnight to 6am and then comes on during the day from 10am to 2pm.
_________________ 31,000G IG vinyl 20X40 True L. Hayward 1.5 superpump, Autopilot Pool Pilot Digital SWG, Hayward Model S244T 300lb sand filter, TF100 kit
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linen
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Post subject: Re: Why the difference between FC levels here and manufactur  Posted: August 25th, 2011, 10:39 pm |
| Mod Squad |
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Joined: July 30th, 2010, 8:56 am Posts: 1793 Location: Minnesota
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I agree, I would have the water moving at least for a few minutes before you test. Also, make sure you are getting a sample under a ways under the surface (foot or so).
_________________ Going to Pool School and learning the BBB method of pool care with a TF100 test kit that helps me use the Pool Calculator to properly maintain the water in my: Round AGP 11K gal (free on CL) with a deep end, Meteor 20" sand filter, Matrix 1hp 2spd, 4 2ftX20ft Sungrabber panels, Intex SWCG (copper bars removed), and Borates. Also a Rubadub hot tub and a UDS (Ugly Drum Smoker) poolside. If your water has you worried, do an Overnight Chlorine Loss Test (OCLT), and if you fail, then follow the Shocking Process until: 1. CC is less than 0.5 ppm, 2. An OCLT shows a loss of 1.0 ppm or less and, 3. The water is crystal clear.
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jsw5620
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Post subject: Re: Why the difference between FC levels here and manufactur  Posted: August 25th, 2011, 11:17 pm |
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Joined: March 30th, 2011, 8:24 pm Posts: 129
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I guess this is one of my concerns with running the SWCG at night. During the day I am always afraid it will drop below the minimum FC levels and might be prone to algae and I will end up having to shock again.
_________________ 31,000G IG vinyl 20X40 True L. Hayward 1.5 superpump, Autopilot Pool Pilot Digital SWG, Hayward Model S244T 300lb sand filter, TF100 kit
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linen
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Post subject: Re: Why the difference between FC levels here and manufactur  Posted: August 25th, 2011, 11:28 pm |
| Mod Squad |
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Joined: July 30th, 2010, 8:56 am Posts: 1793 Location: Minnesota
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Yeah, I run mine in the heat of the day, I figure that is also when I need it the most.
_________________ Going to Pool School and learning the BBB method of pool care with a TF100 test kit that helps me use the Pool Calculator to properly maintain the water in my: Round AGP 11K gal (free on CL) with a deep end, Meteor 20" sand filter, Matrix 1hp 2spd, 4 2ftX20ft Sungrabber panels, Intex SWCG (copper bars removed), and Borates. Also a Rubadub hot tub and a UDS (Ugly Drum Smoker) poolside. If your water has you worried, do an Overnight Chlorine Loss Test (OCLT), and if you fail, then follow the Shocking Process until: 1. CC is less than 0.5 ppm, 2. An OCLT shows a loss of 1.0 ppm or less and, 3. The water is crystal clear.
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jsw5620
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Post subject: Re: Why the difference between FC levels here and manufactur  Posted: August 25th, 2011, 11:52 pm |
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Joined: March 30th, 2011, 8:24 pm Posts: 129
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PB told me I needed to run it at night because it is easier on the equipment so I divided it up. One thing that was a shock to me was when I called autopilot, they informed me that the SWCG needed to be calibrated about every three months. Told me to take a sample to a pool store and let them use a digital meter to check salt level and calibrate my unit to that.
_________________ 31,000G IG vinyl 20X40 True L. Hayward 1.5 superpump, Autopilot Pool Pilot Digital SWG, Hayward Model S244T 300lb sand filter, TF100 kit
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linen
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Post subject: Re: Why the difference between FC levels here and manufactur  Posted: August 26th, 2011, 12:24 am |
| Mod Squad |
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Joined: July 30th, 2010, 8:56 am Posts: 1793 Location: Minnesota
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jsw5620 wrote: Told me to take a sample to a pool store and let them use a digital meter to check salt level and calibrate my unit to that. I hope the pool store meter is calibrated often. The one I use at my work, needs calibration every 6 months to maintain its accuracy specification. If I was you, I might consider getting the Taylor dropwise salt test (each drop is 200 ppm) to use for recalibrating the swg. tftestkits.com has em.
_________________ Going to Pool School and learning the BBB method of pool care with a TF100 test kit that helps me use the Pool Calculator to properly maintain the water in my: Round AGP 11K gal (free on CL) with a deep end, Meteor 20" sand filter, Matrix 1hp 2spd, 4 2ftX20ft Sungrabber panels, Intex SWCG (copper bars removed), and Borates. Also a Rubadub hot tub and a UDS (Ugly Drum Smoker) poolside. If your water has you worried, do an Overnight Chlorine Loss Test (OCLT), and if you fail, then follow the Shocking Process until: 1. CC is less than 0.5 ppm, 2. An OCLT shows a loss of 1.0 ppm or less and, 3. The water is crystal clear.
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