Pot, meet Kettle. Come on, Wendy. People have asked you some very legitimate questions here and you've ignored almost every one. Then you have the temerity to accuse others of not responding to your "valid points"; you're not operating in good faith here.

There's a 15 page thread on this forum with some very good discussion on problems with SWGs and saltwater. Most people here have been very receptive to The Pool Guy's points about SWGs; not everyone agrees with his opinions but with some rare exceptions the discourse is fact-based on both sides.

While I doubt very much that SWGs are in any way "good" for the environment, I doubt even more that the negative impact of SWGs is nearly as bad as you'd like to make it out to be. You're extrapolating out a long way from some pretty dissimilar salt applications (water softeners and road salt) to make your arguments.

Wendy,
How many of your systems are installed in recreational water facilities in the US?

You know, Wendy was right about one thing, Pool Addict. Your supposition that I should like salt systems because if I'm right and they're destroying pools that it would be good for my business says alot about YOUR character. I'd sure hate to do business with you. I'm a poolman, and people hire me to be their advisor. My job is to steer my customers AWAY from things that destroy their pool.

Part two of your question: My service rate includes chemicals and the price is the same whether a customer uses conventional chlorine or a salt system, so it makes no difference to me.

As far as wodnering why I don't bash ionizers: They are about 0.001% of the market. Hardly worth me wasting a blog on. And when they stain the pool, I can drain and acid wash their damage away and warn the homeowner that they shouldn't have been fooled by another gadget salesman.

But a salt system deals a blow to the whole pool. It can ruin the decks and coping and corrode metal parts. We're beginning to see scaling of heater parts, in that pressure switches in particular are fouling with calcium buildup on salt pools where these switches are right up stream from the salt cell that's, oddly enough, exchanging calcium and salt between the cell plates, hence the reason for the reverse mode on these salt systems to clean the cell plates. Too bad they can't do that for the cell plate to pressure switch stray current path. But then, I'm crazy for thinking that a stray path exists. Right? Just like I'm crazy for thinking that there's an environmental impact, even though more and more environmental agencies, and even the waste water treatment industry, is saying that the impact exists.

But you just gotta have that salt system, SteveT1, and so you look at the FACT that I've had thirty-six inches of rain and humped an extra 17,500 lbs of salt and an extra 400 lbs of stabilizer to my pools because of that rain and you say to yourself, "There it is. That must be an exageration. So, I'll use that to discount everything this man is saying and as my rationalization for why I ought to buy that salt system that I want so bad I can taste it."

Well, let me tell you something. I have lots of customers that love their salt system a lot. And their fully aware of the damage that it's doing to their pool's decks, coping and equipment. But they're rich. And I don't mean Drive A Nice Car Rich. I mean Captains of Industry Rich. And they've flat out told me, "If it means I have to remodel my decks and coping five years early, that's okay. Or if it means that I have to replace my heater every four years, that's fine with me. Heck, it's only $2850." (Lo NOX installed).

So enjoy your pool, SteveT1. And start saving your money. You're going to need it.

And Pool Addict. I know we're supposed to be civil, but what you casually posited is dishonest at it's core. I hope you're an employee and not a businessman, and I'm glad you're not my employee.

Stevet1

Congrats on your informed decision. I have a SWG as a completely new pool owner, and totally love it. As for salt doing damage to land, I don't buy the hype. Maybe some places are banning them, but they also will be having a major problem with any water with any chemicals in it being poured into the water system. As for Damage, I did some quick reading and found out its as much from Chlorine and all that then it is from Salt. If the salinity is close or lower then tears, are we to stop crying and solve this issue?

I love the bashing, it really is humourous to read these people who have vested interests in someone not having a SWG and then come running ot them so they can load them up with chemicals or some other solution that is yet unproven.

Enjoy the pool and your salt.

Rik

Ecosmarte's track record isn't the greatest at the BBB. Seems as if some people claim that their system didn't operate/perform as advertised. How shocking!

I REALLY don't mind you all having heated discussions. Frankly, it's good for the site. People love to keep up with these threads; however, the name calling has to stop. It's not at all difficult to tell someone you disagree with them without making any personal comments.

I don't like locking threads, especially popular ones, but if the personal bashing continues, you won't leave me any choice, and the thread will be locked and removed.

PoolSean: Did you ever used to watch Saturday Night Live? Ah, never mind.

We don't use liquid chlorine here in Dallas. I have worked in markets where we did, but this isn't one of them. It's because our water is anywhere from 70 to 120 ppm calcium out of the tap and we have to add calcium flake on start-up. So, we use cal hypo to shock and tabs for our constant, daily chlorine source. I would have assumed that a man as worldly and experienced and multi-faceted as you would have known that. In fact, neither of our primary distributors - SCP & PWP - even carry liquid chlorine. PWP used to, but the last batch they had pretty much turned to water waiting for someone to buy it. So, all your gobble-de goop about jugs and such is just... well, a bunch of gobble-de-goop.

I'm so disappointed, Sean. I thought you knew everything. But it is strange. You're the National Sales Manager, right? And you give seminars all across the country, right? Funny that you didn't know that.

Perhpas your lack of understanding of our water conditions and consequently the way we sanitize our pools points to your overall lack of understanding of our market here in Texas. It would certainly explain your obstructionist, argumentative responses to the airing of our regional problems with salt systems.

It's the same as the way that you keep trying to talk your sisters here in Texas into suction side cleaners because they work well in Florida where your pools are in screened enclosures. You always kept repeating that over and over again in those endless e-mails you used to send me, how you just didn't understand why we used Polaris' here in Texas. And that's because you don't know anything about our market here.

Suction side cleaners run about ten feet, suck a big magnolia leaf, or a bunch of red oak leaves, and then sit there, cavitating, until you pull them up and clear their throat. Polaris' don't. But you don't ever see the practical, working end of pools in my market so I wouldn't expect you to know that.

Then, in your next paragraph, you say, "your saturation index is way off. or do you not subscribe..."

That's such a transparent trick. Stray current from the cell plates to the pressure switch is causing the scale buildup, but you try to imply that it's because I subscribe to some hair-brain water balance index to throw folks off the scent of what's happening here.

I get my information by talking to warranty stations - pool repair companies licenced by the mfg's to do their warranty work - that work on my pools and everybody elses pools in town, and they say that the failed pressure switch on a salt pool is becoming a more and more common sight. Instead of just denying that it's happening, why don't you ask around? You must have friends who actualy work on pools, right? I mean, it can't just be a bunch of salesmen sitting around telling each other how great their product is, right?

Ask some repairmen in the Taxas market what heater issues they're seeing with salt pools and then YOU get back to US. And if they come back and tell you that they're not seeing any problems, be advised that we want to see water chemistry conditions for all the pools they talk about. Otherwise, your claims that salt doesn't damage heaters is just anecdotal.

Sean, you really need to check in with the folks who sell outdoor gas fired heaters. I know you sell heat pumps and so IT'S YOUR JOB TO BASH GAS FIRED HEATERS (we call that the negative sell), but they last more than a few years. Unless of course they're installed on a salt pool. Honestly, I still have a few millivolt heaters tucked away in indoor equipment rooms, and they still fire, after going on twenty years.

Once again, if you knew anything about the Texas market, you'd know that heat pumps just don't cut it here. There are some companies that are selling them, but just because they cost more and so they make more. The customers aren't happier when they find out that they only have about 125,000 BTU's and they need that full 400,000 BTU from a residential gas fired heater to keep up with the spring and fall chill to extend their swimming season here. And don't talk to me about thermal blankets. They don't work here either. All they do is collect all the debris that falls on the surface and would have been skimmed by the skimmers or picked up by the Polaris, and then when you reel them up, all that debris goes Bloosh! right into the pool anyhow.

So, in SeanWorld, service companies here in Texas would be better off raiding the aisles of Krogers for Clorox and using Kreepy Krawly's and heat pumps that don't heat. Sure glad I don't have to try to make a living in SeanWorld.

Gosh, I am just bowled over by your depth of knowledge of the market you serve! You represent Team Horner so well!

And Pool Addict. I know we're supposed to be civil, but what you casually posited is dishonest at it's core. I hope you're an employee and not a businessman, and I'm glad you're not my employee.

Where do you or did you see me be dishonest?

You are a far cry from being civilised on here and why Sean has not banned your IP is beyond me. This forum is about helping people, and you certainly are the opposite side of that equation.

Grow up and learn to adjust with whatever changes come along.

For someone in the pool industry, which I assume would be busier in the summer months, I am curious as to why you have so much time to post all these long winded rants. Perhaps your time would be better spent out looking for business rather then on here.

Enjoy P.I.T.A

Rik

Locked!