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Thread: SWG question - Add to floor popup line or return line?

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    SWG question - Add to floor popup line or return line?

    So, our PB is adding the Hayward T-Cell-15 to our plumbing (plumbing is completed). We have two pipes going to the pool - one goes to the in-floor popups and the other to the returns.
    He recommends adding the cell to the pipe that feeds the in-floor popups - says it will ensure all chlorine goes into the deep water and mixes well. He says it is better not to put this in the line that feeds the returns, since chlorine will be in more 'shallow' water.

    Any advice on this? Logically he sounds correct, though.
    2015 build (link)| 16.5 K gal | Salt Water | IG rect | 35'x16' | 568 sf | 105 ft peri | depth 3'-5' | PV3 in-floor | 2 Venturi skimmers | MDX+SDX drains | T-CELL-15 SWG | Hayward Ecostar VS pump | Hayward 7220 DE Filter | Aqua Cal Icebreaker Heat / Cool pump SQ166 | Hayward Sense & Dispense PH Controller| Omnilogic | Pebble Sheen Blue Surf | Ultra UV | Stenner acid pump | Coverstar Automatic | TF-100

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    UN1017's Avatar
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    Re: SWG question - Add to floor popup line or return line?

    I would say it doesn't matter. The SWG does not chlorinate water in the same manner as adding bleach and would not leave "pockets" of high concentrations of chlorine that needed to mix. The only question I have is what if want you turn off the in-floor pop-ups? Does that mean you can only chlorinate the pool with the SWG if the in-floor cleaning system is on? Why doesn't he install it so either returns chlorinated water to the pool?
    15'x30' IG - Roman-style - 14K - Pebble Fina Classico
    Filter: Jandy CL460 Pump: Jandy Stealth SHPF1.5 SWG: Jandy AquaPure 1400 Cleaner: Jandy RayVac Test Kit: TF-100 w/SpeedStir

    Chlorine/CYA Chart----Extended Test Kit Directions----SLAM

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    Re: SWG question - Add to floor popup line or return line?

    Quote Originally Posted by UN1017 View Post
    I would say it doesn't matter. The SWG does not chlorinate water in the same manner as adding bleach and would not leave "pockets" of high concentrations of chlorine that needed to mix. The only question I have is what if want you turn off the in-floor pop-ups? Does that mean you can only chlorinate the pool with the SWG if the in-floor cleaning system is on? Why doesn't he install it so either returns chlorinated water to the pool?
    He says that there is not much space to install prior to the 'branch off' to the two areas. According to him, the infloor popups will run 90% of the time to ensure the bottom is clean and is a good way to deliver chlorine. I was insisting that he put this prior to the branching, but there is not much room. Some plumbing rework is necessary to accomplish this, which I think he is trying to avoid.
    2015 build (link)| 16.5 K gal | Salt Water | IG rect | 35'x16' | 568 sf | 105 ft peri | depth 3'-5' | PV3 in-floor | 2 Venturi skimmers | MDX+SDX drains | T-CELL-15 SWG | Hayward Ecostar VS pump | Hayward 7220 DE Filter | Aqua Cal Icebreaker Heat / Cool pump SQ166 | Hayward Sense & Dispense PH Controller| Omnilogic | Pebble Sheen Blue Surf | Ultra UV | Stenner acid pump | Coverstar Automatic | TF-100

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    Re: SWG question - Add to floor popup line or return line?

    There is a reason you have returns. If you can't use the SWG without using the pop ups, what purpose do the returns serve? The cell should be installed before the returns branch off. Will it work if installed just on the pop up side....yes, but then you could never chlorinate the pool when using the returns.
    chiefwej
    Tucson, AZ
    16x36 rectangular (19k) Pebble Tec play pool/spa, Pentair Intelliflo VS 011018, Super II 2hp (spa), Aqua Rite T-15 SWG, Pro Grid 60 DE, Hayward H400 & Heliocol Solar heating, A&A infloor system, fill water w/high CH and TA, 50 ppm borates,TF-100 test kit

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    Re: SWG question - Add to floor popup line or return line?

    Quote Originally Posted by chiefwej View Post
    There is a reason you have returns. If you can't use the SWG without using the pop ups, what purpose do the returns serve? The cell should be installed before the returns branch off. Will it work if installed just on the pop up side....yes, but then you could never chlorinate the pool when using the returns.
    Thanks Chief.. will talk to the PB tomorrow.
    2015 build (link)| 16.5 K gal | Salt Water | IG rect | 35'x16' | 568 sf | 105 ft peri | depth 3'-5' | PV3 in-floor | 2 Venturi skimmers | MDX+SDX drains | T-CELL-15 SWG | Hayward Ecostar VS pump | Hayward 7220 DE Filter | Aqua Cal Icebreaker Heat / Cool pump SQ166 | Hayward Sense & Dispense PH Controller| Omnilogic | Pebble Sheen Blue Surf | Ultra UV | Stenner acid pump | Coverstar Automatic | TF-100

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    Re: SWG question - Add to floor popup line or return line?

    Quote Originally Posted by trbvm View Post
    He recommends adding the cell to the pipe that feeds the in-floor popups - says it will ensure all chlorine goes into the deep water and mixes well. He says it is better not to put this in the line that feeds the returns, since chlorine will be in more 'shallow' water.
    Don't pool builders know that Jedi mind tricks don't work on people that belong to TFP? (Okay...I made that up).

    Regardless, I wonder how long it took him to come up with that silly excuse?
    15'x30' IG - Roman-style - 14K - Pebble Fina Classico
    Filter: Jandy CL460 Pump: Jandy Stealth SHPF1.5 SWG: Jandy AquaPure 1400 Cleaner: Jandy RayVac Test Kit: TF-100 w/SpeedStir

    Chlorine/CYA Chart----Extended Test Kit Directions----SLAM

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    Re: SWG question - Add to floor popup line or return line?

    On my pool, the SWG outputs to 2 floor pop-ups and 4 returns spread around the pool. The floor pop-ups are independent of the in-floor cleaning system.
    15k Pebble Tec (2002), Ecomatic ESC-16 SWG
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    Paramount IFCS, Taylor K-2006 Test Kit w/SpeedStir.

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    Re: SWG question - Add to floor popup line or return line?

    Quote Originally Posted by BassTrix View Post
    On my pool, the SWG outputs to 2 floor pop-ups and 4 returns spread around the pool. The floor pop-ups are independent of the in-floor cleaning system.
    That's a good design, I guess. I don't think we have floor returns.. only popups. Not sure, though .. will know when they complete it.
    2015 build (link)| 16.5 K gal | Salt Water | IG rect | 35'x16' | 568 sf | 105 ft peri | depth 3'-5' | PV3 in-floor | 2 Venturi skimmers | MDX+SDX drains | T-CELL-15 SWG | Hayward Ecostar VS pump | Hayward 7220 DE Filter | Aqua Cal Icebreaker Heat / Cool pump SQ166 | Hayward Sense & Dispense PH Controller| Omnilogic | Pebble Sheen Blue Surf | Ultra UV | Stenner acid pump | Coverstar Automatic | TF-100

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    Re: SWG question - Add to floor popup line or return line?

    I have return valves that allow me to return water either through the cleaning system, side returns on the pool, to a fountain in the spa, or side returns in the spa for spill over into the pool. My SWG cell is located just before these valves. That required them to create a separate loop just for installing the cell. Best practice is plumbing so that all return water can be chlorinated.
    chiefwej
    Tucson, AZ
    16x36 rectangular (19k) Pebble Tec play pool/spa, Pentair Intelliflo VS 011018, Super II 2hp (spa), Aqua Rite T-15 SWG, Pro Grid 60 DE, Hayward H400 & Heliocol Solar heating, A&A infloor system, fill water w/high CH and TA, 50 ppm borates,TF-100 test kit

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    Re: SWG question - Add to floor popup line or return line?

    I would not have all the chlorinated water going to the pop ups. If you decide to turn them off during a party or event and then the unit will not be chlorinating.
    Hayward Pool Tech
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    Re: SWG question - Add to floor popup line or return line?

    The returns are completely redundant in a pool with in floor cleaning. Both, A&A and Paramount recommend against installing a separate return loop - its not needed. The in floor heads will always pop up, regardless of whether pump is running on high or low speed (although they will just barely pop up to release the water on low speed). The in floor system are essentially returns.

    In other words, there is absolutely no reason to have a return loop seperate from in floor. The water should always run through the infloor - it is a superior way to sanitize the pool.
    28000 gallon IG pool, 3.5ft - 8ft deep, Stonescapes Tropics Blue Interior, Pentair Intellichlor SWG, Pentair Quad DE 100 filter, Pentair Intelliflo VS-SVRS, Whisperflo 3hp (water features), A&A Max in floor cleaning, Pentair Easytouch 8 Automation, Screenlogic II, Pentair Mastertemp 400k BTU heater, Pentair Intellichem with acid injection via stennar pump, 9'x7' spa with Infiniti edge

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    Re: SWG question - Add to floor popup line or return line?

    sounds like your PB didn't leave enough room in his plumbing to install the cell in the correct location and is using excuses to avoid cutting out and re-doing PVC. have him plumb it so that the cell is feeding all the returns (not just the floor pop ups or return jets), i.e. before the line splits. its going to be more work for him at this point, but that's not your problem. he should have thought about that before he installed all the pipes. besides, 2" PVC is cheap. you are spending a lot of money on a pool, get it right the first time.
    Dan
    9,000 gallon in-ground Saltwater pool, plaster, cartridge filer, 1.0 hp pump, Hayward T-15 SWCG, TF-100
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    Re: SWG question - Add to floor popup line or return line?

    L
    Quote Originally Posted by jamcha02 View Post
    The returns are completely redundant in a pool with in floor cleaning. Both, A&A and Paramount recommend against installing a separate return loop - its not needed. The in floor heads will always pop up, regardless of whether pump is running on high or low speed (although they will just barely pop up to release the water on low speed). The in floor system are essentially returns.

    In other words, there is absolutely no reason to have a return loop seperate from in floor. The water should always run through the infloor - it is a superior way to sanitize the pool.
    I would never build a pool with only pop ups for returns. If I ever had a leak in the many, many return lines running to all those pop ups, I could, in a pinch, abandon the cleaning system and use side returns. Much like my previous pool that had a leak in the main drain plumbing and I abandoned it to use only skimmers. Without side returns, the only option would be to tear up the bottom of the pool to repair a leak. When planning a pool, generally the more options you consider, the better. I have four different ways to return water to the pool and four separate suction lines. All have valves for individual control. I wouldn't have it any other way. In fact, I kind of wish my two skimmers had individual runs and valves, as opposed to being plumbed together with a diverter in the bottom.
    chiefwej
    Tucson, AZ
    16x36 rectangular (19k) Pebble Tec play pool/spa, Pentair Intelliflo VS 011018, Super II 2hp (spa), Aqua Rite T-15 SWG, Pro Grid 60 DE, Hayward H400 & Heliocol Solar heating, A&A infloor system, fill water w/high CH and TA, 50 ppm borates,TF-100 test kit

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