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Thread: Hi Everybody

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    Hi Everybody

    I just got back from my local BioGuard dealer and once again they convinced me to buy their outrageously priced "Smart Shock" for my water that has been cloudy for over a month (third time since we opened our pool in late April). While I was still in the store I overheard a conversation about using liquid bleach instead of shock. I investigated this theory and it led me to your web-site. Please excuse my lack of water chemistry knowledge, some of the chemical names get confusing, but if my understanding of using liquid bleach is correct, I just visited my BioGuard dealer for the last time. The "Alex" readings are as follows: Saturation Idx -0.7; TDS 600; CYA 51; Tot. Chlorine 0.4; Free Chlorine 0.4; PH 7.4; Tot. Alkalinity 114; Adj. Total Alk. 99; Tot. Hardness 72; nothing else was tested. I bought 4lbs. of Sodium dichloro-s-triazinetrione dihydrate ...99% and added it to my water. My goal is to take another reading in 24 hours and correct any "adjustments" by visiting my local grocery store. My question for the experts is how much and how often. I realize that you'll need tomorrows readings to advise me, but I'm wondering if what I did today will have any effect at all.
    I have an above ground "Summer Escape" pool; 18x4; 6,600 gals. printed vinyl with a cartridge style filter. It's your typical "SAMS" pool. I live in central NC and my pool only gets about 4 - 4 1/2 hours of direct sunlight. My granddaughters (2) swim on average 4 hours a day. I do not drain my water over the winter, but I do cover it.

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    Patrick_B's Avatar
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    Re: Hi Everybody

    Welcome!

    We are all about knowledge, and getting your own results from a good kit. We can show you what you are asking about, and teach you how to clear this up. Most importantly how to do it and keep it that way through understanding, no matter what products you choose. Typically we like store brand commodities, but your first step should be getting a good kit and start building your knowledge. What you did today added free chlorine and more Cya, which you don't need if that Cya reading is right. We won't trust that it is unfortunately, because time and experience have proven store testing to be wildly inaccurate way too often.
    TFP Moderator
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    Texas Splash's Avatar
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    Re: Hi Everybody

    Hello and welcome! No need to apologize about pool knowledge, we all started here at one time. But here is my personal, favorite saying:

    "Golden rule - Avoid the pool store for testing, advice, or products. You simply won’t get the advice/service you deserve and you will waste money on products your pool doesn’t need. Do not add anything to your pool other than what is advocated by the TFP site or its experts. You’ll have a happier pool, spend less time maintaining your pool, and probably save some $$ in the process. The following are short articles from this site that you will see linked in my signature below: Pool School, Recommended Levels (for YOUR pool), PoolMath Calculator, SLAM, and the Chlorine/CYA Chart."

    Have a great evening!
    Pat (a.k.a. Texas Splash) ~ My Pool: Viking Fiberglass; 17,888 Gal; Waterway Supreme 2-sp/2-hp pump; Hayward Ctg filter; TF-100 w/ Speed Stir
    Vital Links: POOL SCHOOL, RECOMMENDED LEVELS, RECOMMENDED CHEMICALS, Poolmath Calculator, SLAM, Chlorine/CYA CHART.
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    Mod Squad jblizzle's Avatar
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    Re: Hi Everybody

    Welcome to TFP!!!

    The TFPC method is really just about understanding your pool’s chemistry and through accurate testing, adding only what the pool NEEDS and not what someone wants to sell you.

    As such, the first step to taking control is an investment in one of the Recommended Test Kits and an investment in spending some time reading, asking, and learning on the forum.

    Have you discovered Pool School yet? Start with these:
    ABCs of Water Chemistry
    Recommended Pool Chemicals
    How to Chlorinate Your Pool
    Jason, TFP Moderator
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    Re: Hi Everybody

    Thanks for replying so quickly. I have visited your ABC's and recommended pool chemicals, however I'm still a little confused as to what everything means and what to add when?

    - - - Updated - - -

    I also do not understand why my water is so cloudy when most of my "readings" are within the norm.
    I have an above ground "Summer Escape" pool; 18x4; 6,600 gals. printed vinyl with a cartridge style filter. It's your typical "SAMS" pool. I live in central NC and my pool only gets about 4 - 4 1/2 hours of direct sunlight. My granddaughters (2) swim on average 4 hours a day. I do not drain my water over the winter, but I do cover it.

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    Mod Squad jblizzle's Avatar
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    Re: Hi Everybody

    Well, you need to know your current levels and then you would use PoolMath to calculate how much of what you would add to reach a given target. Here are the Recommended Chemistry Levels.

    It gets to be much easier once you are hands-on.
    Generally you would test some things daily and add what you need (like bleach) to get back to your target.
    Other things do not change as fast and thus you do not test them as often.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Your water is cloudy because at some point the chlorine level drop too low for your CYA level. (See FC/CYA Chart) Then stuff started growing and at that point a "normal" FC level will not kill it faster than it is growing. So you need to follow the ShockLevelAndMAINTAIN Process.

    Sorry, I have now thrown basically all the relevant links at you related to your questions. It is fine if reading them raises more questions
    Jason, TFP Moderator
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    Re: Hi Everybody

    Thanks for the Pool Math link, that's really going to be useful. Since I don't have a water testing kit yet, what do you think I should do in the next couple of days?
    I have an above ground "Summer Escape" pool; 18x4; 6,600 gals. printed vinyl with a cartridge style filter. It's your typical "SAMS" pool. I live in central NC and my pool only gets about 4 - 4 1/2 hours of direct sunlight. My granddaughters (2) swim on average 4 hours a day. I do not drain my water over the winter, but I do cover it.

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    Mod Squad jblizzle's Avatar
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    Re: Hi Everybody

    Add 1/3 bottle/gallon of bleach every day and keep reading and learning while waiting for a good test kit to arrive.

    - - - Updated - - -

    BTW, adding 4 pounds of Dichlor was a bad idea ... that added 40ppm of FC to your pool (WAY above shock level and likely could be fading your vinyl) and 37ppm of CYA. If there number of 50ppm of CYA was right ... your CYA is now way too high and you probably need to replace half the water.

    You test kit will allow us to figure out the next step.

    Do not add the bleach as I mentioned above.
    Jason, TFP Moderator
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  9. Back To Top    #9

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    Re: Hi Everybody

    Their number of 51 CYA is between their ideal range of 30 - 200?
    I have an above ground "Summer Escape" pool; 18x4; 6,600 gals. printed vinyl with a cartridge style filter. It's your typical "SAMS" pool. I live in central NC and my pool only gets about 4 - 4 1/2 hours of direct sunlight. My granddaughters (2) swim on average 4 hours a day. I do not drain my water over the winter, but I do cover it.

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    Mod Squad JVTrain's Avatar
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    Re: Hi Everybody

    An "ideal range" with a difference of 170 ppm between the high and the low is laughable. At 30 CYA, you need a minimum of 2 ppm FC at all times. At 200 CYA you need an estimated minimum FC of 14 ppm at all times. I say estimated because anything above 80 is just not recommended for any reason. This is why pool store advice, testing and test strips are worth absolutely nothing.

    See the recommended FC levels for each CYA ppm here: Pool School - Chlorine / CYA Chart

    If you CYA is actually 50... which I doubt as it was pool store tested, your MINIMUM FC is 4 ppm and your levels aren't within the norm for what we teach here and what we know works for thousands of other users. That's why your pool is cloudy.
    Joel - TFP Moderator - Minnesota - **Become a TFP Supporter!** Helpful Links: ABCs of Pool Water Chemistry - SLAM Procedure - Chlorine/CYA Chart
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  11. Back To Top    #11

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    Re: Hi Everybody

    Checked the CYA levels from Pool School; at 51 CYA the chart recommends a minimum FC (Free chlorine?) of 4. Yet everyone is telling me that not to add any more chlorine.
    I have an above ground "Summer Escape" pool; 18x4; 6,600 gals. printed vinyl with a cartridge style filter. It's your typical "SAMS" pool. I live in central NC and my pool only gets about 4 - 4 1/2 hours of direct sunlight. My granddaughters (2) swim on average 4 hours a day. I do not drain my water over the winter, but I do cover it.

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    Mod Squad jblizzle's Avatar
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    Re: Hi Everybody

    Because you said you added 4 pounds of Dichlor which is 40ppm of FC!!!
    Jason, TFP Moderator
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  13. Back To Top    #13

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    Re: Hi Everybody

    Oh I get it. DON'T ADD ANY MORE! Do you think my Dichlor will dilute to a more reasonable level?, or do you think I'll still have to drain half my water?
    I have an above ground "Summer Escape" pool; 18x4; 6,600 gals. printed vinyl with a cartridge style filter. It's your typical "SAMS" pool. I live in central NC and my pool only gets about 4 - 4 1/2 hours of direct sunlight. My granddaughters (2) swim on average 4 hours a day. I do not drain my water over the winter, but I do cover it.

  14. Back To Top    #14
    Mod Squad jblizzle's Avatar
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    Re: Hi Everybody

    Quote Originally Posted by 85 Custom View Post
    Do you think my Dichlor will dilute to a more reasonable level?
    I am not sure what you mean by this. It is a FACT that the 4 pounds added 37ppm of CYA to your pool. Our recommended range for CYA is 30-50ppm. So if they were correct that your CYA was 51ppm, then you are now at 88ppm ... and need to replace half the water.

    BUT, pool stores are horrendous at testing water, especially CYA. So you need one of the test kits to find out what your real chemistry levels are.
    Jason, TFP Moderator
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  15. Back To Top    #15

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    Re: Hi Everybody

    Thanks, I'll hold off doing anything until I get a test kit and get a more accurate reading. LOVE the site and I truly thank you for the unbiased help.
    I have an above ground "Summer Escape" pool; 18x4; 6,600 gals. printed vinyl with a cartridge style filter. It's your typical "SAMS" pool. I live in central NC and my pool only gets about 4 - 4 1/2 hours of direct sunlight. My granddaughters (2) swim on average 4 hours a day. I do not drain my water over the winter, but I do cover it.

  16. Back To Top    #16

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    Re: Hi Everybody

    Wow, as someone new to TFP this thread had absolutely everything I needed to hear.

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    Mod Squad pooldv's Avatar
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    Re: Hi Everybody

    Yes, waiting for a test kit is a great plan. I use and love the TF100 from tftestkits.net.
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    Re: Hi Everybody

    Hi, Dr. Nick!



    16K freeform gunite with spa; Pentair 4000 DE filter; Century Whisperflow 1 HP; Pentair Minimax heater.
    Troublefree does not mean Maintenancefree. It's like brushing your teeth: You can spend a couple minutes a day and pennies a week or go to the dentist once a year and spend several thousand dollars.
    A pool is like a pet - you have to feed it every day, even the days you don't want to play with it!

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