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Thread: Multiple issues...need lots of guidance!

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    Multiple issues...need lots of guidance!

    Hi, all! We're trying very hard to get our pool sanitized so our kids can enjoy it this summer. We need LOTS of help!!! Let me share as many details as I can remember. Here goes...

    We bought the pool in the summer of 2010 and only that year, possibly the second, has it ever been crystal clear. Last summer, we had shades of green but seemed to bounce back after shocking/adding chlorine tablets to the floater but was always cloudy and we could never see bottom. We also started having problems with the pump and filter. In the fall, we failed to cover it (obviously a BAD mistake). In early May, we started brushing the walls and bottom. Sheets of algae were coming off and we were happy to see the movement along the bottom to see the surface. We used the net to scoop it all out (it was gross and took a few weeks). Then, the frogs took over and began producing offspring in the pool. The color changed to a nasty greenish brown and the water smelled horrendous. We ordered a new pump & filter and installed them on 6/6/15. We added chemicals (shock/chlorine) and the water started to look and smell more like a pool (not like a swamp!!!). We've since vacuumed (Polaris Vac-Sweep 65) a few times, added horrendous amount of shock and the water is still green. Took a water sample to our local pool store on 6/13/15, bought the products they said we needed, followed the steps exactly was prescribed and it's STILL green (pic taken 6/14/15)! I'm so frustrated!!!

    Additionally, with the vacuum we have, are we doing it right? It's powered by the jet and we leave it multi-port valve set to Filter while using it. However, I'm reading that we should have it set to Waste when vacuuming. I don't think the style of our vacuum will operate in that position. Should we using the manual vacuum while still trying to get the algae out? I'm very confused and, as I've already stated, quite frustrated.

    Also, I apologize for not posting our levels. We don't have our own testing kit and while I know the numbers can change daily, our most recent readings from the pool store are at home and I'm trapped at work.

    Any tips or advice would be much appreciated. Thanks in advance!
    IMG_5282.JPG
    13,500 gal AG Pool
    Hayward Pro Series 21" Sand Filter
    1.5 hp Matrix Pump

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    ship of fools's Avatar
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    Re: Multiple issues...need lots of guidance!

    First thing you need to do is buy a reliable test kit so you know what you are dealing with. The pool store tests are notoriously inaccurate.

    Get yourself a TF100 with the XL option and a Speed Stir and you are on your way. Post up your results and we can point you in the direction of a nice clear pool!
    21,000 gallon inground
    Haywood Sand Filter
    Vinyl Liner

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    Re: Multiple issues...need lots of guidance!

    Welcome!

    For a pool in that condition chlorine (FC) readings are changing hourly! Probably dramatically. You need a kit: TFTestkits.net add the XL option for sure. The speedstir does make testing easier. You're going to need lots of bleach and patience. Read up on SLAM: Pool School - SLAM - Shock Level And Maintain .

    Good Luck!
    ~19k Gal, IG Vinyl, Hayward SP2607X10 1hp pump, Hayward S200 Sand Filter, built in 70s, has 8 deep end with diving board, 1 skimmer, 1 return, 1 low hole, Polaris booster pump PB4-60, old Polaris robot not sure model, Rheem P-M266A-EN-C 266,000 BTU heater, solar cover, Taylor K-2006 test kit, Speedstir

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    Mod Squad kimkats's Avatar
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    Re: Multiple issues...need lots of guidance!

    HI! You will be SO glad you found us! We can save you SO much money and help you get and keep your pool CLEAR! So clear that you will be able to know if a coin on the bottom is heads or tails!

    BUT you have to help us help you. You have to buy a good test kit.

    Yeah I know the pool store will test your water for "free" but is it really free if you have to buy this and that to fix your pool and it does not work???????

    Let us know when your good test kit gets there! See my siggy for where to buy it at.

    Kim
    TFP Moderator 33x52 round AG 25,600 gals Sand Filter 1.5hp Pump - 2 Speed, SLAM, Pool School, Recommended Levels, Recommended Chemicals, Pool Math, Chlorine/CYA Chart, TF-100 Test Kit

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    Re: Multiple issues...need lots of guidance!

    As previously stated, you're going to start by getting a test kit. Then you're going to need to SLAM your pool to kill off every living organism in your water.

    As far as vacuuming is concerned, you should be using the manual vacuum with the multiport valve set to waste if your plumbing will allow it. Pool cleaners are intended to "keep your pool clean," not to "get it clean" (taken directly from the manual for my Hayward TigerShark pool cleaner).

    Order the test kit and stock up on bleach and/or liquid chlorine. I've found the Great Value Concentrated bleach at Walmart to be the best value when it comes to using household bleach (8.25% concentration, same as Clorox, but it's $0.90 cheaper per jug), but Home Depot, Lowe's, and Atwood's (don't know if they have stores in WI or not...) sell pool chemicals. Look for liquid shock, and be sure to check the concentration.

    Once you get your test kit, please post your results. Between PoolMath and the good folks here at TFP, you'll be swimming sooner (and for less money) than you would be if you kept going to the pool store.
    25,000 gallon freeform gunnite/plaster, built in the 1970s/80s; Sta-Rite 9463004 575-lb. sand filter; Sta-Rite DuraGlas/Max-E-Glas (P2RA5F-125L) single-speed 1.5 HP pump, manufactured 12/1993 (1M93M).
    Helpful links: TFTestKits; Pool School; ABCs of Pool Water Chemistry; Chlorine/CYA Chart; PoolMath; SLAM - Shock Level And Maintain

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    Texas Splash's Avatar
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    Re: Multiple issues...need lots of guidance!

    Welcome Buffy! Lots of replies already, so you appear to have a good way forward. #1 - test kit. If you have time, keep the link below in my sig handy as they are your primary resource for information - especially the Chlorine/CYA Chart. Have a great day.
    Pat (a.k.a. Texas Splash) ~ My Pool: Viking Fiberglass; 17,888 Gal; Waterway Supreme 2-sp/2-hp pump; Hayward Ctg filter; TF-100 w/ Speed Stir
    Vital Links: POOL SCHOOL, RECOMMENDED LEVELS, RECOMMENDED CHEMICALS, Poolmath Calculator, SLAM, Chlorine/CYA CHART.
    If you enjoyed your TFP experience, please consider donating to Support TFP!

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    Re: Multiple issues...need lots of guidance!

    Thanks so much for the quick replies! Yes, we'll get our own test kit. It's crazy to drive to Leslie's each time to have them test our water only to drive away with $100 worth of chems that aren't working.

    Just an FYI, according to their results on Saturday our chlorine levels, both total and free, were good/normal.

    EDITED TO ADD: Just to make sure I'm understanding correctly, household bleach is sufficient in killing, destroying and eliminating algae? And, when you guys say to stock up on it, how much are we talking? 10 gals? 20? More? Keep in mind that I'm very uneducated about this as I've relied on whatever the pool store guys have been peddling. Additionally, I plan to read the Pool School and SLAM methods as quickly as I can.

    Thanks so much!!!
    13,500 gal AG Pool
    Hayward Pro Series 21" Sand Filter
    1.5 hp Matrix Pump

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    Texas Splash's Avatar
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    Re: Multiple issues...need lots of guidance!

    Good questions. Yes - regular liquid bleach is your primary sanitizing agent. When you went to Leslies, they carried it as "Liquid Shock". At your local grocery store - just regular bleach. Same thing. Only difference is the % in strength. Most people rely on the grocery store's 8.25% at a cheaper rate per gallon versus Leslie's 12% for about a $1 more per bottle. Oh, and it can be generic brands - doesn't have to be top name bleach.

    Your pool is a "healthy" green, but until you get the kit and post good numbers it's just a guess on how much bleach. For now, I would simply advise to make sure there are no "pool store" chlorinating products in your pool (pucks, tablets) and don't use their powdered shock either. Just add about a gallon of regular bleach to your pool each day until your kit arrives. When you do get your test kit, you will use quite a bit of bleach to "SLAM". I would suggest stocking-up on about 15-20 bottles to get you going when you have to "SLAM". You may quite possibly need more after a couple days, but you can judge that later.

    Read the SLAM link below so you're ready to fight war with that algae! Also, post the Chlorine/CYA chart somewhere because you will use that many, many times.
    Pat (a.k.a. Texas Splash) ~ My Pool: Viking Fiberglass; 17,888 Gal; Waterway Supreme 2-sp/2-hp pump; Hayward Ctg filter; TF-100 w/ Speed Stir
    Vital Links: POOL SCHOOL, RECOMMENDED LEVELS, RECOMMENDED CHEMICALS, Poolmath Calculator, SLAM, Chlorine/CYA CHART.
    If you enjoyed your TFP experience, please consider donating to Support TFP!

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    Re: Multiple issues...need lots of guidance!

    Going through slam is different than normal maintenance. So, yeah for slam you're going to need to have plenty of bleach at the ready. I've seen posts of pools consuming over 50 bottles of bleach. I'm not suggesting you rush out and buy 50 bottles either. Be aware that your problem is more than a 10 gallon problem. You might start with 10-20 bottles. Your goal is to get fc at shock level based on your cya and hold it there. The better you can sustain that target the faster the slam goes. Just remember 2 things decrease your fc level. Sunlight and organic material. So if you have organic debris scoop it out. Brush and vacuum often, run filter 24/7 make sure filters are clean. Even before your test kit arrives. You want your additions of bleach to attack algae not trying to break down leaves.

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    Mod Squad kimkats's Avatar
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    Re: Multiple issues...need lots of guidance!

    I am SO glad you are getting your own test kit! You are going to love it! Please make sure you get the TF-100 XL as the Taylor one does not have enough stuff to do a SLAM.

    For right now you can add a jug of bleach a night to try to keep it from getting worse.

    Kim
    TFP Moderator 33x52 round AG 25,600 gals Sand Filter 1.5hp Pump - 2 Speed, SLAM, Pool School, Recommended Levels, Recommended Chemicals, Pool Math, Chlorine/CYA Chart, TF-100 Test Kit

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    Re: Multiple issues...need lots of guidance!

    How old are your kids? Follow the advice of these folks and they'll be splashing around in no time! Amy
    ~16'x40', 25k gallons IG, plaster, Purex Triton 4000 DE filter, Purex Triton Whisperflo WFE-3C 3/4 HP pump. Old pool - at least 30 years. Small spa area that overflows into main pool. Pentair Kreepy Krauly Legend cleaner. Propane Heater. Philadelphia suburbs.

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    Re: Multiple issues...need lots of guidance!

    Hi, all! Just wanted to give an update, albeit another frustrated one....

    We haven't gotten our kit yet (totally my fault for not ordering) but we stopped by a different pool store Saturday morning and hubby was about to buy their BioGuard 74 based upon the suggestion of his friend. The pool store guy called it their "most concentrated, highest formulated" shock. In discussing our problem with him, he wanted to know if we had copper in the pool. According to our water sample from a week ago, 0 copper. I showed him a picture of the water on my phone. He said based upon our description of what we've done, how it looks (the green is so uniform, doesn't plume up when we sweep it, can't see very far into the water...as in maybe a few inches, 0 CYA yet our chlorine was holding at 7.4), he'd like to test for copper. We did not take a water sample back for him. The next morning, hubby's aunt's boyfriend who manages a pool at an apartment complex, came by to take a look at it. He said it looked "odd" to him for the same reasons (doesn't plume up, green all over like we poured green food coloring into it), he suggested we shock it really hard. So, we used 6 bags of shock-plus from Leslies. Today, the water looks EXACTLY the same!!!! Needless to say, I'm beyond upset. I feel like nothing is going to kill whatever is in there. Should we just drain it and start over??? I'm exhausted!
    13,500 gal AG Pool
    Hayward Pro Series 21" Sand Filter
    1.5 hp Matrix Pump

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    Re: Multiple issues...need lots of guidance!

    In order for us to be helpful to you and get your pool reigned in your first step is ordering a test kit and posting the results. Just haplessly tossing some bags into the pool and crossing your fingers isn't a wise approach. If you really want to have crystal clear water you need to know exactly what you're doing. At first you'll be just listening to the folks here but in a very short amount of time you'll be putting 2 and 2 together. It's not rocket science and the kit may look intimidating at first but trust me if you can count the number of drops it takes to make a water sample turn a color or turn colorless you can achieve a perfectly balanced pool that is envious of anyone who sees it. There are some crazy smart people here willing to help. Just do them a favor and post some reliable test results that you take with a proper test kit like a TF100.
    ~19k Gal, IG Vinyl, Hayward SP2607X10 1hp pump, Hayward S200 Sand Filter, built in 70s, has 8 deep end with diving board, 1 skimmer, 1 return, 1 low hole, Polaris booster pump PB4-60, old Polaris robot not sure model, Rheem P-M266A-EN-C 266,000 BTU heater, solar cover, Taylor K-2006 test kit, Speedstir

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    Re: Multiple issues...need lots of guidance!

    BTW, I thing absolutely guaranteed about your situation. There is no product/magic potion capable of just magically turning your pool into a sparkling oasis in one dose. Unfortunately, the mess didn't happen overnight and neither will the solution. It will be trying but you can do it.
    ~19k Gal, IG Vinyl, Hayward SP2607X10 1hp pump, Hayward S200 Sand Filter, built in 70s, has 8 deep end with diving board, 1 skimmer, 1 return, 1 low hole, Polaris booster pump PB4-60, old Polaris robot not sure model, Rheem P-M266A-EN-C 266,000 BTU heater, solar cover, Taylor K-2006 test kit, Speedstir

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    Re: Multiple issues...need lots of guidance!

    I don't know why you are so upset. You have been given some great advice here, what you have done with it is on you.

    A SLAM will fix the problem, but you can't do it without the test kit. If you are exhausted from following everyone else's advice then maybe it is time to listen to ours. That is entirely your decision however.

    From my HTC One via Tapatalk
    JD - 28' Round Above Ground Pool, 17,000 Gallons. Dual speed Jacuzzi pump with cartridge filter. Dual speed 1 HP pump, Hayward S210T sand filter
    Pool School - PoolMath - HIGHLY Recommended Test Kits

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    Re: Multiple issues...need lots of guidance!

    Hi there, long time lurker, first time poster. I just couldn't help myself from chiming in on this because I don't understand why someone would come in and ask for advice, receive excellent advice, then totally ignore the advice and do something totally opposite. Even though I haven't been posting I've been reading and following the instructions here and have a sparkling clear pool when I had NO idea previously how to manage a pool. Please listen to the people here, they know what they're talking about.
    AGP 33' x 54" Lomart Verona, Approx. 27,300 gallons, Pentair cartridge filter/pump 2-speed, 1.5 hp, Dolphin Escape robotic cleaner.

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    Mod Squad jblizzle's Avatar
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    Re: Multiple issues...need lots of guidance!

    Quote Originally Posted by chipchip View Post
    Hi there, long time lurker, first time poster. I just couldn't help myself from chiming in on this because I don't understand why someone would come in and ask for advice, receive excellent advice, then totally ignore the advice and do something totally opposite. Even though I haven't been posting I've been reading and following the instructions here and have a sparkling clear pool when I had NO idea previously how to manage a pool. Please listen to the people here, they know what they're talking about.
    Welcome to TFP, chipchip!!!
    Most of us would totally agree with your assessment and frustration

    buffyj, sorry you feel the way that you do, but you were given solid advice a week ago and chose to ignore it. You should have had a test kit by now ... probably for less $ than you wasted on the potions you threw in.
    Jason, TFP Moderator
    18k IG pebblesheen pool, Hayward ProLogic P4 w/ T-15 SWG, Pentair 1HP 2-speed Superflo, Hayward 6020 DE filter
    500 sqft Heliocol solar panels, ThePoolCleaner, TF-100 test kit w/ SpeedStir
    Pool School + Test Kit + PoolMath = A TROUBLE FREE POOL
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  18. Back To Top    #18

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    Re: Multiple issues...need lots of guidance!

    Wow! Thanks for the replies! Sorry you guys misinterpreted my "rant". It was nothing more than that. I wasn't actually asking for hard advice in my update. It was simply a, "hi, all...still not clear because I don't have my test but I have tried a few things as recommended locally." My question about whether or not we should drain it was more of a rhetorical question.

    At any rate, it's apparent that I've offended some folks around here, which was not my intent. My sincere apologies. FWIW, it isn't that I "chose to ignore" the advice posted here. I simply didn't order the kit in time and was just checking back to say I'm frustrated with the methods we've ventured into by friends & family. Furthermore, we didn't spend more money on chemicals over the weekend. They were all supplies we already had. We just figured why not use them since they're already here.

    Once again, I'm sorry to the regulars and the lurkers alike. I know this forum revolves around numbers which I didn't post because I couldn't provide. I won't bother asking for the advice of others until I have something concrete to work from.
    13,500 gal AG Pool
    Hayward Pro Series 21" Sand Filter
    1.5 hp Matrix Pump

  19. Back To Top    #19

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    Re: Multiple issues...need lots of guidance!

    OK. Deep breath time. Order up a good kit. TF100 with XL option if that is doable. Shouldn't take too long to receive it. If you have done any reading of posts and articles you know that these people are more than willing to hold your hand and get your pool where you want it to be. Before I joined I did the weekly pool store routine--test water, buy lots of stuff to treat water. Water still bad. Since I joined and went the TFP route--test water, hmmm...all good readings. Have a cocktail. Yes, once in awhile I have to tweak something, but I am able to MAINTAIN it properly with my TF100 kit and Pool Math.
    17,500 gal. ABG Doughboy Pool
    1/2 HP Pump/150 sq.ft. Cartridge Filter
    TF100 Test Kit And Speedstir

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    Beens's Avatar
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    Re: Multiple issues...need lots of guidance!

    Just jumping in really quick to address one statement... In reference to the chemicals you've added since your first post... You figured "why not use them since they're already here?"

    There is a reason why we would say not to add anything else besides plain liquid chlorine until you get your kit.

    The reason is, any powdered or solid form of chlorine has other stuff added to it. That stuff is either calcium or cya/stabilizer. You have no idea how much of everything you have in the pool until you have your kit and you may be making things worse and raising levels that can only be dropped by draining a lot of water.

    Other products may have copper or other metals in them and adding anything like that will cause headaches down the road.

    We really can help you do this step by step but I want to join in to strongly urge that you order a test kit asap.

    I'll also recommend the tf 100 xl because with a green pool you'll need the extra bottles of reagent that come with it.

    The sooner you get the kit the sooner you can stop running in circles with pool store advice and get control of your pool.


    Most importantly you have one decision to make : TFP or pool store?

    You can't mix both. We're hoping you'll choose TFP because we know it works.

    Come on! Let's do it! Let's fix your pool.
    18' x 48" (42" water depth) Intex Metal Frame 6,700 Gallons
    Hayward Power-Flo LX 1.0 HP pump
    Hayward Pro Series S166T Sand Filter
    Original Intex Floating Skimmer

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