Become a TFP Supporter Pool Math Forum Rules Pool School
Results 1 to 9 of 9

Thread: Please help clarify some information!!

  1. Back To Top    #1

    Join Date
    Jun 2015
    Location
    O'Fallon, MO
    Posts
    45

    Please help clarify some information!!

    Hello All,

    I'm new to this forum & somewhat new to pool care. We had an AG pool 7 years ago but my husband took care of it using traditional methods-he pretty much kept it sparkling. Well, he's now sick & is not in the take care of pool business any longer. We closed the pool for several years but now my 10 YO daughter & I decided it was time for another one since we live in the middle of nowhere!! I bought a very cheap Intex 12 ft 21/2 ft. pool last year & the pump quit after 4 weeks. When I purchased it, I also put a 24 x 52 intex pool on layaway via Rural King. I went to cancel it in the fall & they had clearanced it from $600 to $200 so I had to pay very little to finish my purchase so I did. Fast forward to this year. I know it's fairly late season but it's taken some time to get things ready as I'm at the mercy of my grown sons. It is going on sand where my old pool was but the sand is very compacted underneath. I'm hoping to leave the pool up, but that's not my question now.

    What my post is for is to just get a handle on using the BBB method beyond what I've read here. WalMart carries liquid chlorine 12 % for $6.47 for 2 gallons which seems way cheaper than bleach. But, here's my question. All things balanced in the pool, about how much bleach/liquid chlorine will I generally use for a 24' round 52" deep? I did buy an Intex sand filter to use with it also so any tips on connecting that would be great. I'm putting it up Saturday. I've bought Borax & already bought 3" tablets before researching this method. I just need to decide what to do & what to buy. I'm assuming I need to buy baking soda plus CA? Is that correct? Also, is it really true this is cheaper than traditional methods? I also purchased some HTH Super Extended Release Algeacide per my sister's suggestion (she has an in ground pool). Upon looking at the label it contains copper. I do have well water but it's very clear & we had no issues with the previous pools due to the well water that I know of. Any advice you can give will be so very welcomed.

    Thanks in advance!!
    24 x 52 intex AG round with well water-water has no issues with rust or other contaminants
    2800 GPH Intex sand filter pump
    Located in Missouri

  2. Back To Top    #2
    DaninFLA's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2015
    Location
    Sarasota, FL
    Posts
    1,011

    Re: Please help clarify some information!!

    that's a long first post

    first thing first, you need one of the two recommended test kits...I would get the TF-100, its a better deal I think.

    Return that algaecide and get your money back.

    the cost on the 12% chlorine sounds like a good deal, I would stock up on that big time.

    this is a new pool, so first thing you need to do is fill up the pool! haha. then add stabilizer (CYA) to the pool to get it to 30ppm. use pool math http://www.troublefreepool.com/calc.html . you should be able to get the stabilizer at Walmart, they sell a 5lb jug of it for about $14. the one by me is called Chlorox Chlorine Stabilizer. just check label and make sure its cyanuric acid. pool math says you are going to need a little over 3lb of stabilizer, so a single jug is more than you will ever need.


    fresh water, add enough chlorine to get you to 2ppm right off the bat. once you get your stabilizer dissolved in the pool, you need the add chlorine to get to 4ppm. this chart is the single most important thing to have: Pool School - Chlorine / CYA Chart

    - - - Updated - - -

    you asked about how much chlorine you will use a day? well, wont know that until you have a test kit and figure it out, but assuming 3ppm loss a day, with 12% chlorine, and a 13,500 gallon pool (assuming 48" deep), you would need 43oz of chlorine a day. based on the price you said, that works out to be $1 a day in chlorine. obviously it might be more or less, but ballpark. so yes...pretty cheap don't you think

    also pick up some muriatic acid while you are out. should be about $7 a gallon. one gallon will be good for now. we use that to lower pH. you will probably need that eventually, if not its good to have for around the house anyway and its cheap.

    pick up a couple boxes of baking soda as well. this is to raise TA if needed. and if not, can always use baking soda around the house.


    you have a vinyl pool so don't need to worry about CH.


    you already have borax so that's good (used to raise pH).

    like I said, order the TF-100 and you will be in great shape. and return as much stuff as you can to the pool store for refund.
    Dan
    9,000 gallon in-ground Saltwater pool, plaster, cartridge filer, 1.0 hp pump, Hayward T-15 SWCG, TF-100
    Pool School - Chlorine / CYA Chart; Pool School - Test Kits Compared;

  3. Back To Top    #3
    Richard320's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    San Dimas, CA (LA County)
    Posts
    18,768

    Re: Please help clarify some information!!

    Welcome!

    Lose the algaecide. Unless you're a huge fan of The Joker.


    You may not need the Borax. It just depends on the fill water. You also may not need baking soda. You will need bleach. In a well-balanced pool, typical consumption is 2-3 ppm per day. That's roughly a quart of 12% chlorine every day.

    Pucks add CYA and lower pH. You could use them to raise CYA, but it will take a long, long time. Alternately, add a 4 lb canister of stabilizer to get CYA up to 30 to get things started and then use pucks a while. 16 pucks will add another 20 CYA to your pool.

    It's really not that hard to do if you have the information at your fingertips, and that means a proper test kit. Yes, a TF100 is a chunk o'change, but it will pay for itself in savings for not buying useless chemicals you don't need and never going green. 24' across is no longer a kiddie pool. It's a real pool and needs a real test kit.
    16K freeform gunite with spa; Pentair 4000 DE filter; Century Whisperflow 1 HP; Pentair Minimax heater.
    Troublefree does not mean Maintenancefree. It's like brushing your teeth: You can spend a couple minutes a day and pennies a week or go to the dentist once a year and spend several thousand dollars.
    A pool is like a pet - you have to feed it every day, even the days you don't want to play with it!

  4. Back To Top    #4

    Re: Please help clarify some information!!

    Welcome to the forum! Your daughter must be excited about the new pool.

    First off, return the algaecide if you can. You don't need it, and you don't want copper in your pool. If you ever want to get algaecide, buy the polyquat type.

    The main thing about the TFPC method (that's the new name for the BBB method) is that you need to do your own testing with one of the recommended test kits. See: Test Kit Comparison. It is a small investment that will save you lots of money and avoid lots of frustration, because you'll always know exactly what your pool needs to stay healthy. The FAS-DPD chlorine test is essential. The DPD and OTO tests are insufficient for proper pool care using the TFP method. (We avoid the term BBB now, because it made people run out and buy the three B's before they needed them. Many people don't need borax, since pH tends to rise on its own.)

    I assume you've already been reading the Pool School articles here? It can take a few re-readings before everything clicks. Then it becomes really easy.

    You will want to get some Stabilizer (aka conditioner) in the form of granular Cyanuric Acid, available at any pool store, or at Walmart if you are in the warmer half of the USA. You can use PoolMath (link at the top of every page) to calculate how much to add to your pool based on the volume of the pool. You'll want to raise CYA to about 30ppm. Pour the recommended amount into a sock, and hang it in front of the return jet in your pool. It will dissolve in a day or two.

    Yes, you'll want baking soda to adjust your Total Alkalinity. You can get 10lb or 13lb bags at most of the larger membership stores, like Costco and Sam's club. Test your fill water (well water) to see how much Alkalinity you already have, then use PoolMath to determine how much baking soda to add to raise your TA to the 60-70ppm range.

    You'll want to have some Muriatic Acid on hand. This is also available in the hardware store, and varying strengths. Enter the strength (as a percentage) into PoolMath, along with your tested pH, and PoolMath will tell you how much acid to use to reduce your pH to where you want it. (You can also use granular acid from the pool store, but it has other ingredients that make it less desirable. Muricatic acid is just HCl and water.)

    With a vinyl pool, you don't need to worry much about Calcium. But if you find your pool water is foaming a lot, calcium will reduce that. You want calcium carbonate. It is sold in hardware stores as "ice melt". (Or you can get the same stuff at the pool store, paying quadruple the price just for the special name on the package.)
    25000-gallon semi-public IG concrete/plaster pool, Triton II sand filter
    750-gallon semi-public IG concrete/plaster spa, cartridge filter
    Volunteer pool caretaker for my condominium complex

  5. Back To Top    #5

    Join Date
    Jun 2015
    Location
    O'Fallon, MO
    Posts
    45

    Re: Please help clarify some information!!

    Thank you all so much! Sorry about the BBB thing-see I did go buy Borax, ha ha. I'm also wordy so I'll apologize up front for too long posts!! OK, so a couple of follow up questions. Test kit-as soon as I'm sure I will be using this method (99.9% sure now), then I'm ordering it-probably tonight. The Taylor K-2006 is on sale for $50 which is more in line with my budget plus I have a bucket of pucks I paid $50 for so that's an even wash on $$. I have the very simple test kit that tests Cl, Br, pH per the colored kit vial. I guess that will have to do until I get the regular test kit. Here are my questions:

    Do I really need the T-100 or will the K-2006 do. What's the difference?

    I have read all Pool School stuff, some more than once but will keep reading them. When I played around with the calculator it didn't do anything. I set the current values to 0-guessing that was wrong. Should I test with my mini kit once we fill it & then plug those things in? I did not indicate vinyl, etc. so I guess I should have done that!!

    OK, the next question has to do with $$. Please bear with me-I know all of you are sold on this method & I'm about there, but my family who helps me won't be b/c they are very traditionally old school. My parents had a pool & sister has the IG. They tell me I need the algeacide I bought & will return, the pucks, & Ph up, which I know is baking soda. Just looking at the average daily cost, (I appreciate the guess) it still looks like I'm spending some $$ when my initial research on this had many sites/posts saying how cost efficient this method is. I'm not doubting that, but please tell me very clearly where I'm saving money. I've spent $135 so far without buying the Ph up stuff. I got 2 tubs of 25 lb pucks for $50 each. So:

    Am I really saving $$? I really don't know how much of the pucks I will use but my BIL said I bought too much. So, is the cost savings coming from not needing additional chemicals to undo the bad stuff the pucks do?

    Also should I keep one of the puck tubs for any out of town times or return them both & buy a smaller quantity for that or not worry about that? I might be gone in August for a few days but not before then.

    Finally, is there a way to test the CYA with this rinky dink test kit or does your chart show it? I'm on very slow hotspot for my Internet connection after cutting wire while mowing around air conditioner after it quit. So we're hot & slow here LOL! Kind of wish the pool was up & going right about now.

    Thank you all sooooo much again!
    24 x 52 intex AG round with well water-water has no issues with rust or other contaminants
    2800 GPH Intex sand filter pump
    Located in Missouri

  6. Back To Top    #6
    eazy's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2015
    Location
    puyallup, wa
    Posts
    11

    Re: Please help clarify some information!!

    Quote Originally Posted by needmypoolboy View Post

    Finally, is there a way to test the CYA with this rinky dink test kit or does your chart show it?
    I made the mistake of buying the wrong test kit. I ordered this CYA only test for $17 to hold me over until this kit is gone and I upgrade to the correct test kit.

    TFTestkits.net
    4440 gallons,intex round 15 x 48, ag, cartridge filter, krystal clear 637r filter pump,assembled and filled 5/15/2015
    poolmaster premier deluxe 5 way test kit, tap water

  7. Back To Top    #7

    TFP Guide

    pabeader's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2015
    Location
    Dallas Ga
    Posts
    4,064

    Re: Please help clarify some information!!

    $$ saving is easy. Once you get your pool right, all you normally do is test. Once in a while you might need to put in some bleach, maybe a cup or two as needed, based on test values.
    Bob - Palm Beach by San Juan Pools. approx 5000 gals., Pentair 320 cartridge filter (all new guts installed by me), Goldline SWG, 'New to me' Kreepy Krauly Sand Shark, Intermec 104 Timer Test kit: TF-100 w/Speed Stir

  8. Back To Top    #8
    Beens's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2013
    Location
    Virginia Beach, Va
    Posts
    1,171

    Re: Please help clarify some information!!

    The main difference between the TF-100 and the K-2006 is the size of the bottles. The TF-100 comes a bit of a better balance geared towards the TFP methods. A lot of people buy the K-2006 and end up needing refills for the chlorine and cya tests pretty soon after getting their new kit. As long as you keep that in mind you'll be ok. Both have the same tests but the TF-100 allows you to test *more* times before needing refills so it can save money in the long run. (Remember it would be the price of refills + shipping) Here's a link that shows the difference between the kits. Pool School - Test Kits Compared

    TF-100 is also put together by the owner of this forum which is why it's able to be more geared towards the TFP methods. Just an FYI, no one here gets anything for recommending this kit. It's just the one that a lot of us have found to be the best deal and we hate to see people run out of stuff they need especially when they're in the middle of cleaning up a mess.

    If it were me, I'd return the pucks if I could and maybe at some point in the future get a small amount of them. Really the main thing you'd use them for would be if you were going to be out of town. I guess it's up to you. I'm all about getting my money back when I can and spending it again later (or maybe not needing to!) lol

    The cya test is a pretty specific test and most small kits don't have it. There's a 6-way kit that some wal-mart stores sell but #1, if you're already buying a k-2006 or TF-100 you'll get the CYA test with that and #2, For a new fill you will start with 0 CYA (It's not naturally in well water and it is not added to city/municipal water.) so you won't need to test it until 1 week after you've added your initial dose of CYA which will hopefully be after you already have your kit!

    As far as saving money goes, it's in the maintenance. Any start up costs something. You have to get your initial stuff going. The kit is a big up front cost but extremely necessary, CYA won't need to be added very often at all. (It generally doesn't change unless you drain and replace water.)

    Now when it comes to maintenance, you'll mainly be using bleach/liquid chlorine. Some people have to adjust their ph regularly so in that situation they keep muriatic acid on hand. (I've never had to use it yet! My ph is happy and never seems to change much.)

    If there's any metals issues with your fill water that would be a possible maintenance cost *but* that would be the same whether you use the TFP or "pool store" method.

    The main thing we teach here is to do your own testing so you know what your pool needs and aren't dependent upon someone who is in the business of selling pool chemicals and potions.

    You'll save money because you won't be walking into the pool store with an open wallet buying things you hope will work. You will know exactly what's going on with the pool and only put in what you need to. No expensive magic potions and no guesswork which can lead to very costly purchases!

    There will always be someone here to help or answer questions or walk you through something. If we don't personally know the answer to something we'll find someone who does! Best part is we're not going to be making money off you. We just do it because we like to help. It's kind of addicting.

    There you go, a very long and wordy response from someone who should be in bed! lol

    Welcome to TFP! I hope I helped a little and made some sense. It's almost 2 am sooooo I might be a little off on making sense. lol
    18' x 48" (42" water depth) Intex Metal Frame 6,700 Gallons
    Hayward Power-Flo LX 1.0 HP pump
    Hayward Pro Series S166T Sand Filter
    Original Intex Floating Skimmer

  9. Back To Top    #9

    Join Date
    Jun 2015
    Location
    O'Fallon, MO
    Posts
    45

    Re: Please help clarify some information!!

    Beens, thank you so much!!!! I was up at that hour as well probably due to no air conditioning resulting in an 84 * house-doesn't make for good sleep LOL. You answered many of my questions. I plan on returning the pucks & just picking up a small pack later. I'm going into town in a little bit to buy the chlorine & baking soda. One more quick question-how much liquid chlorine should I buy for start up? Thanks again, everyone!!
    24 x 52 intex AG round with well water-water has no issues with rust or other contaminants
    2800 GPH Intex sand filter pump
    Located in Missouri

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •