Thanks so much for the info and links! Could you please pinpoint the link to the correct one to add about a 15 foot 8 guage solid copper wire to my pump? Don't really understand the particulars. Thank you!
Bonding Lug Wire
- Thread starter twotix
- Start date
Seems, in all likelihood, it is a bonding wire however my curiosity would drive me to measure it's resistance to a known bonded component using a multimeter. The reason you'd want to do that, is to be sure someone didn't just stick a wire in the ground without connecting it to anything, leaving you thinking you were protected when in fact you were not.
You'd need to find a known bonded metal component like an underwater light, disconnect it's ground wire (to separate the the grounding and bonding circuits) and measure the resistance between the green wire sticking out of the ground and light's shell. Something less than an ohm would likely indicate an intentional connection.
Never-the-less, and in the meantime I think it is safe to assume it is your pump bond connection. Good luck.
You'd need to find a known bonded metal component like an underwater light, disconnect it's ground wire (to separate the the grounding and bonding circuits) and measure the resistance between the green wire sticking out of the ground and light's shell. Something less than an ohm would likely indicate an intentional connection.
Never-the-less, and in the meantime I think it is safe to assume it is your pump bond connection. Good luck.
Might be easier to check continuity between that wire and a handrail or ladder. That way you don't have to take anything apart.
Gonna need a wire long enough to make contact between the two
Gonna need a wire long enough to make contact between the two
I typically use an extension cord with a wire wrapped around the piece that you know is already bonded and stuck into one of the extension cord contacts. For a 16ga 100ft ext cord, that would add less than a 1/2 ohm to the reading.
Thanks! I discovered what looks like the bonding wire in the junction box (connected to two ground wires) between the transformer and line to pool (light?).
Not sure how that wire can be connected to the pool motor or even the ozoneator(currently not plumbed in) unless it it's sufficient to be connected to the ground wire and not needed? Hopefully these pics will clarify.Thanks.
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Found a bonding lug in my junction box. Don't know how it relates to that green wire outside the pool enclosure.Added annotated pics. Thx.
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Thanks! Found a bonding lug. Added annotated pics.
I would not think that that is a bonding wire, but it would take a meter to find out. The bond/ground systems should not be interconnected.
borjis
LifeTime Supporter
I don't think the bonding wire would be in the conduit box. Those look like ground wires.
Mine comes right out of the concrete floor in my pump room.
I saw this tarnished copper wire attached to nothing and first thought "oh that's ugly, I should cut that" haha.
Then I did a bunch of reading, got some advice here and bought a copper coupling lug and a length of equivalent thickness copper wire
to reach the bond lug on the pump motor.
Mine comes right out of the concrete floor in my pump room.
I saw this tarnished copper wire attached to nothing and first thought "oh that's ugly, I should cut that" haha.
Then I did a bunch of reading, got some advice here and bought a copper coupling lug and a length of equivalent thickness copper wire
to reach the bond lug on the pump motor.
Good idea. Will do that when I can get my hands on a Multimeter. If it proves to be the bonding wire then I would need an extension wire (8 guage) to run to the pump and a separate wire to the pool frame? Pump manual instruction attached.
As others said, the bonding wires should not be in the conduit and junction boxes ... that is your ground system which should be separate from the bonding system.
borjis
LifeTime Supporter
make sure you clean the inside of really good so its a clean shiny copper inside that lug.
Thanks! You wouldn't happen to have recommendations on which bonding lug and extension wires please? One kind soul gave me this link to lugs but I wasn't sure of the nomenclature of the different lugs and which would be the best option.
http://www.elecdirect.com/catalog/split-bolts-grounding-products/split-bolt-connectors
Also, must the bonding lug/extension wire be solid copper or can it be another metal which may be cheaper? Is the bonding wire normally a solid bare wire? I would need about a 15 foot bonding wire to run to the pump motor and then a short one of a couple feet to bond to the pool cage? Is it customary to bury it so it doesn't get in the way? Came across this in the Intelliflo manual. Thanks!
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Good point! My Intelliflo bonding lug is very rusty also. When the drive died, the motor still ran so wondered if it can be salvaged and used. The general consensus is no but that is another subject. Thanks!
borjis
LifeTime Supporter
I know home depot has copper lugs to join the wires together. The lug must be copper, so don't use anything but copper to join the wires.
They probably have the 8 AWG wire too.
They probably have the 8 AWG wire too.
The page just shows the various sizes. Local store should have them, just get the size that will attach 2 (or 3) 8 AWG wires.
Yes the bonding in usually base solid copper.
Yes it is typically buried.
Yes the bonding in usually base solid copper.
Yes it is typically buried.
Aside from Silver, Copper is the most conductive metal. All other metals pale in comparison. Bonding is all about maintaining an excellent, low resistance electrical path between all pool locations. Copper is your only choice.
The wire by the fence......I would connect and extend with copper lug but leave exposed. Don't bury the lug that way you know if you lost connection.
Bury your wire deep enough.....(I would do at least 18") so it doesn't get cut again.
Instead of buying two separate pieces of wire buy one long one. Pass the bare wire through the lug on pump n move on to your next grounding point. The less breaks in wire better off you are.
Like other said you need to separate n test the mess in the j-box. Determine if any of them are a bonding wire, don't think they are. The BONDING grid needs to be separate from circuit ground.
When your done make sure all the bonding wires are connected by using a continuity tester.
Bury your wire deep enough.....(I would do at least 18") so it doesn't get cut again.
Instead of buying two separate pieces of wire buy one long one. Pass the bare wire through the lug on pump n move on to your next grounding point. The less breaks in wire better off you are.
Like other said you need to separate n test the mess in the j-box. Determine if any of them are a bonding wire, don't think they are. The BONDING grid needs to be separate from circuit ground.
When your done make sure all the bonding wires are connected by using a continuity tester.
Looking at that pic that shows the 3 ground wires under same lug in j box looks to me they are different size wires. Looks like two are #8 and one is #12. Little hard to tell. I would test them see what's going on
Great suggestion. Just want to make a minor correction. Grounding point should read BONDING POINT.
Thanks your right.....Bonding point.
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I think he took all the grounds and connected them together.
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I think he took all the grounds and connected them together.
In the Junction box wiring I see 2 #12/14 ground wires (one from the source and one to the light) and a solid #8 Bond wire most likely from inside the wet niche. You will need to pull the light out of the niche to confirm this. If you find the other end in the wet niche like I suspect you will then that is all good.
Here is a good image of the proper pool light bonding...
http://forums.mikeholt.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=3000&d=1237134375
As has been suspected before, this loose wire may have at one time been connected to either the metal structure we see in the image or to the pool pump. Can you step back a few feet and get us a good overall shot of the entire area so we can see what we are dealing with?
Here is a good image of the proper pool light bonding...
http://forums.mikeholt.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=3000&d=1237134375
As has been suspected before, this loose wire may have at one time been connected to either the metal structure we see in the image or to the pool pump. Can you step back a few feet and get us a good overall shot of the entire area so we can see what we are dealing with?
The Mike Holt site has lots of great information however in this case he seems to propagate the mistaken notion that Bonding and Grounding are the same thing. Holt's diagram uses the words "Grounding (Bonding)" when pointing to the illustrated connections, that are in fact only called "Ground" in the NEC sections he sites. I think in this case, Holt has introduced the same blurring of the words ground and bond, that is unfortunately pervasive in the industry.
Edit: I've read some more of Holt's articles and posts and I understand he's substituting in names of conductors as defined by the NEC, however I still find it un-helpful that he made those substitutions in regard to pool bonding, where those names were probably not developed for bonding in pool environments.
Edit: I've read some more of Holt's articles and posts and I understand he's substituting in names of conductors as defined by the NEC, however I still find it un-helpful that he made those substitutions in regard to pool bonding, where those names were probably not developed for bonding in pool environments.
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