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Thread: High Phosphate!

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    High Phosphate!

    Had my water testing at pool place today. I have a 20,000 gal in ground pool, new as of Sept 2014. I do have a stubborn green alge that likes to
    cling to sides and in light sockets. Is resistant to shock treatment. The pool water is nice and clear however.
    Total Chlorine 5.6
    Free Chlorine 3.7
    pH 7.4
    Total Alkalinity 80
    Calcium Hardness 210
    Stabilizer 40
    Phosphate **>2500.0 (wow)
    Shock treatment 1.9
    The recommended using Phosfree, 2L to start, clean filter prior and after 2 weeks.
    Does this sound reasonable?
    Can we still enjoy the pool during this process?
    Thank you for any help
    I have a free form in ground 20,000 gallon pool. Pebble Tec, Jandy variable pump with ultra violet technology and chlorine tab.
    Installed Sept. 2014. No overhead tree's but we do have Oak Tree (fuzz) bloom that can be pretty bad in the spring.

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    Mod Squad jblizzle's Avatar
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    Re: High Phosphate!

    Welcome to TFP!!!

    To be blunt, it sounds like a bunch of BS.

    Return the PhosFree junk.
    Order one of the Recommended Test Kits and then follow the ShockLevelAndMAINTAIN Process to rid yourself of algae.

    The phosphate level does not matter in a properly chlorinated pool. And the proper FC level is a function of the stabilizer (CYA) level according to the FC/CYA Chart.

    Have you discovered Pool School yet? Start with these:
    ABCs of Water Chemistry
    Recommended Pool Chemicals
    How to Chlorinate Your Pool
    Jason, TFP Moderator
    18k IG pebblesheen pool, Hayward ProLogic P4 w/ T-15 SWG, Pentair 1HP 2-speed Superflo, Hayward 6020 DE filter
    500 sqft Heliocol solar panels, ThePoolCleaner, TF-100 test kit w/ SpeedStir
    Pool School + Test Kit + PoolMath = A TROUBLE FREE POOL
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    BoDarville's Avatar
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    Re: High Phosphate!

    Gold Supporter, TFP Lifetime Supporter, 26,680 gal Plaster IGP 3.5 - 10' depth / Attached Waterfall Spa, Manually Chlorinated, Triton Sand Filter, 1.5 HP * 1.1 SF = 1.65 SFHP 1-speed Pentair WhisperFlo WF-26 Pump, 400K BTU NG Teledyne Laars Series One Heater, Polaris 360, Test Kit Comparison, Chlorine/CYA Chart, SLAMing Your Pool, OCLT
    A good test kit is an investment, not an expense.

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    Re: High Phosphate!

    Quote Originally Posted by Shannonrn2 View Post
    Had my water testing at pool place today.
    Sadly, that is your main problem. Pool store testing is often woefully inaccurate, and they use it to sell you expensive stuff that you don't need. What we teach here is that you should do your own testing using one of the recommended test kits. It is a small investment that can save you hundreds of dollars a year, just from NOT buying all the crud that the pool store tries to push on you.

    If you have algae, the one-time shock that the pool stores suggest almost never works; since it doesn't kill off all of the algae, the algae comes back with a vengeance as soon as the chlorine level drops down again. As jblizzle said, you need to follow the SLAM process, which will make certain the algae is gone. But to do the SLAM correctly, you need one of the recommended test kits, with extra chlorine testing reagents.

    You mentioned that algae likes to form near the lights in your pool. It is common for algae to grow BEHIND the light, because it is protected the from the pool circulation. Then it migrates to the rest of the pool as soon as the chlorine level drops low enough. Solution: Hop in the pool, remove the light fixture (one screw at the top, don't lose the screw), and use a brush to clean all the gunk out from the light niche.

    The phosfree is expensive and not needed. Will it hurt? Not the pool, just your pocketbook.

    Can you swim during the process? Sure, you can swim after adding phosfree, if you decide to add it. You can swim during a SLAM if your free chlorine is at or below the shock level for your CYA level. But pool store testing is notoriously bad with the CYA test, so, again, you'll want one of the recommended test kits to do your own testing at home.
    25000-gallon semi-public IG concrete/plaster pool, Triton II sand filter
    750-gallon semi-public IG concrete/plaster spa, cartridge filter
    Volunteer pool caretaker for my condominium complex

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    Richard320's Avatar
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    Re: High Phosphate!

    Little known fact: The makers of Phosfree specify that it shouldn't be added to a pool with algae. Click on the instructions and scroll down to the last note and see for youirself.

    Sort of makes you wonder about what else the pool store is getting wrong just to make sales, huh?

    google cloudy after phosfree or something like that and you'll get lots of hits.

    The money spent on phosfree could be better spent on a proper test kit. And all you need to kill algae is bleach, brishing, and patience.

    Some inspirational threads. work backwards up the list to see the most recent ones. Your pool can't look worse than some of those before pictures.
    16K freeform gunite with spa; Pentair 4000 DE filter; Century Whisperflow 1 HP; Pentair Minimax heater.
    Troublefree does not mean Maintenancefree. It's like brushing your teeth: You can spend a couple minutes a day and pennies a week or go to the dentist once a year and spend several thousand dollars.
    A pool is like a pet - you have to feed it every day, even the days you don't want to play with it!

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    Re: High Phosphate!

    Thanks everyone, I'm on it. Returning the Phosfree and investing in test kit, chlorine and brush! I'll let you know how it works out in a few days
    I have a free form in ground 20,000 gallon pool. Pebble Tec, Jandy variable pump with ultra violet technology and chlorine tab.
    Installed Sept. 2014. No overhead tree's but we do have Oak Tree (fuzz) bloom that can be pretty bad in the spring.

  7. Back To Top    #7
    Beens's Avatar
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    Re: High Phosphate!

    Congratulations! You're on your way to taking control of your pool. Wait until you see just how easy it can be. Definitely come and post your test results here when your new kit arrives. There's plenty of people here waiting to help!
    18' x 48" (42" water depth) Intex Metal Frame 6,700 Gallons
    Hayward Power-Flo LX 1.0 HP pump
    Hayward Pro Series S166T Sand Filter
    Original Intex Floating Skimmer

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    Re: High Phosphate!

    Just as an aside... There are some pool treatments (such as for removing metal stains) that require you to let your chlorine level to drop to almost 0. This is pretty much the only time you need to consider using PhosFree and/or a copper-free algaecide to prevent an algae bloom. So, yes, PhosFree does have occasional value. You just don't need it right now.
    25000-gallon semi-public IG concrete/plaster pool, Triton II sand filter
    750-gallon semi-public IG concrete/plaster spa, cartridge filter
    Volunteer pool caretaker for my condominium complex

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    Re: High Phosphate!

    Thanks to everyone for your input, I've returned the Phosfree, I now have my TF100 and here are my results.
    CHL 3ppm
    FC 3
    CC 0.5
    Ph 7.5
    CYA 50
    Calc 275
    ALK 90
    I also just learned (by accident) that my UV system was not turned on and my Fusion 2 mineral system needed a cartridge replacement.
    My Algae problem has decreased a little since the UV was started, I'll see if the mineral cartridge helps too (once it gets here), BTW it was very expensive
    I was instructed by the pool guy who did the start-up last Sept. (who also didn't connect the UV) that I need to keep my chlorine at 2ppm. I have the Tab system
    so I can just turn the dial up to 3 or 4 when we have a lot of swimmers
    As for the alkalinity of 90 I am trying to follow the Pool math help tool so I will follow the suggestion of Baking Soda or Borax? Any preference?
    I have a free form in ground 20,000 gallon pool. Pebble Tec, Jandy variable pump with ultra violet technology and chlorine tab.
    Installed Sept. 2014. No overhead tree's but we do have Oak Tree (fuzz) bloom that can be pretty bad in the spring.

  10. Back To Top    #10
    Richard320's Avatar
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    Re: High Phosphate!

    If your pool is outdoors in the sun, you don't need UV. The sun will give you plenty for free. No need to fill the coffers of PG&E.

    The mineral pack is also unnecessary and undesirable. Given time, metal levels will build up and you might start seeing stains on the walls and green-haired swimmers. Alternative sanitizers and pools--The Truth!!

    PS: Your readings right now look good, aside from FC below minimum. I wouldn't touch pH or TA.
    16K freeform gunite with spa; Pentair 4000 DE filter; Century Whisperflow 1 HP; Pentair Minimax heater.
    Troublefree does not mean Maintenancefree. It's like brushing your teeth: You can spend a couple minutes a day and pennies a week or go to the dentist once a year and spend several thousand dollars.
    A pool is like a pet - you have to feed it every day, even the days you don't want to play with it!

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    Mod Squad tim5055's Avatar
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    Re: High Phosphate!

    I would not use that tab feeder, but would start using liquid chlorine products or investigate a Salt Water Chlorine Generator. Your CYA is now at the top of the recommended range for a non-salt pool and each tab continues to add chlorine.

    Additionally, I would return the mineral cartrdge. As Richard pointed out, Mineral = metals Copper can stain the pool surfaces and can turn blonde hair green.

    Read the directions on SLAMing your pool in the How To section of Pool School and follow that procedure completely to the end.

    CC is 0.5 or lower;
    You pass an OCLT (ie overnight FC loss test shows a loss of 1.0 ppm or less);
    The water is clear

    When all three are true, you are done SLAMing and can allow the FC to drift down to normal levels.

    How much Pool School have you read? We need to un-learn some of the stuff pool stores have taught you over the years. Start with these:
    ABCs of Water Chemistry
    Recommended Pool Chemicals
    How to Chlorinate Your Pool
    TFP Moderator 39 X 18 23,000(ish) freeform gunite; built 2007ish; Pentair Triton II TR100 600lb Sand filter; 2 HP Pentair pump with 2.2 HP AO Smith single speed motor; 2 skimmers, 1 main drain, 4 returns w/waterfall, Stenner 45MHP2 3GPD running@ 60% - 15 gal Tank; heated by the sun CYA 200+ when I started - 50 now. Dolphin Supreme M5 Pool Cleaner. Hot Springs SX Spa, 285 gallon

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    DaninFLA's Avatar
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    Re: High Phosphate!

    Quote Originally Posted by Shannonrn2 View Post
    Thanks everyone, I'm on it. Returning the Phosfree and investing in test kit, chlorine and brush! I'll let you know how it works out in a few days
    wow, congrats! I wish more people would be as open minded and willing to break the pool store cycle as you are. you are quickly on your way to an algae free, crystal clear pool!
    Dan
    9,000 gallon in-ground Saltwater pool, plaster, cartridge filer, 1.0 hp pump, Hayward T-15 SWCG, TF-100
    Pool School - Chlorine / CYA Chart; Pool School - Test Kits Compared;

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