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Thread: Refilling the pool and converting to SWG

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    Refilling the pool and converting to SWG

    I'm not sure where the best place to post this question is, but I'll try this forum.
    I was having serious issues with my pool, and without writing a book and referring to previous posts to include all previous postings, cutting to the chase, green water caused by algae turned to green water caused by metals. TA and Ph were way off. Then CH went to >600.
    I have totally drained, pressure washed, sprayed with bleach, patched bad places in the gunite and have now started refilling the pool. At the same time, I have ordered a SWG that is supposed to arrive no later than Friday, so I should have it installed by Sunday at latest.
    My questions: I assume I need to add bleach to the water as it refills, correct? If so, how much should I add? I also assume I will have to test and adjust as needed. If, again, I am assuming correctly, should I be testing for Ph, FC, CC, TA, CH and CYA as I go, or can I just test after the refill is complete? Further, will adding the SWG this coming weekend have any effect on the refilling/testing procedure?
    One last question: Should I turn the pump back on shortly after the main drain is covered with water, or should I wait for a longer period?
    Thanks in advance
    35,000 gallon gunite pool. 1 hp hayward pump. Sand filter. Waterfall. 1 main drain. 2 skimmers. 4 returns. 1 1/2" PVC tubing. Maytronics robot.

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    Texas Splash's Avatar
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    Re: Refilling the pool and converting to SWG

    Hello Kermit! You've been busy! SWG experts will give specifics on that, but yes, you can add bleach initially. Typically it is advised to do so until levels stabilize as to not put too much stress on your SWG. Typically we encourage incorporating some chlorine and CYA during fill-up to keep the water sanitary, and you just did some plaster work, so TA might be an issue others advise you on. The amounts added can be calculated by using the Poolmath calculator (link below).

    One popular question - what test kit are you using to test your water? Yes - The items you mentioned are what you will want to test for primarily.
    Pat (a.k.a. Texas Splash) ~ My Pool: Viking Fiberglass; 17,888 Gal; Waterway Supreme 2-sp/2-hp pump; Hayward Ctg filter; TF-100 w/ Speed Stir
    Vital Links: POOL SCHOOL, RECOMMENDED LEVELS, RECOMMENDED CHEMICALS, Poolmath Calculator, SLAM, Chlorine/CYA CHART.
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    Mod Squad kimkats's Avatar
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    Re: Refilling the pool and converting to SWG

    Pump on after the water is at least 1/3 the way up your skimmer plate.

    You need a good test kit. Look at my siggy for the ones we use and love on TFP. The Tf-100 is the best bang for the buck.

    When you get your test kit and test your fill water as well as your pool water. By testing your fill water you will know what is going into the pool each time you add water.

    I would add some bleach as it fills. You do not want your new water to start to turn green already! Use pool math to see how much to add for you size pool to get it to at least 4ppm. See this link:

    http://www.troublefreepool.com/calc.html

    Let us know when your test kits comes in.

    Kim
    TFP Moderator 33x52 round AG 25,600 gals Sand Filter 1.5hp Pump - 2 Speed, SLAM, Pool School, Recommended Levels, Recommended Chemicals, Pool Math, Chlorine/CYA Chart, TF-100 Test Kit

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    Divin Dave's Avatar
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    Re: Refilling the pool and converting to SWG

    Hi Kermit,
    I remember your other threads and all the troubles you had. Hopefully, all of that is over now.

    Here is how to proceed.
    First, go ahead and test your tap water with your recommended test kit and you can see from that what your CH, TA, pH is going to be, and have whatever chemicals on hand before the pool fills. Also have some bleach and some CYA at the ready.

    Unless it will take DAYS to fill, I would not worry too much about adding chlorine, there will be no CYA in the fill water to protect it from being burned off by UV. If you want to add a little, then no harm in that, but dont add more than a couple of cups full when the pool gets 1/3 full.

    Also, no matter how hard you try, its nearly impossible to kill all the algae from the plaster. It hides in pores and pits, in your filter and pipes and nooks and crannies and everywhere it can and surprisingly is very vigilent. So whatever algae might be left will also help eat up any chlorine you add while filling. so you'll likely need to SLAM as soon as you can anyhow. The good news is, it won't take long to complete it though. However having said this, you might get lucky and be algae free.

    Once the pool is full, first add enough chlorine to get you to 3ppm. (Test 4 hours later to see what your FC and CC is Add more chlorine to get you to SLAM for CYA of 30)
    After adding 3ppm of chlorine, go ahead and immediately add CYA to get to 30ppm.
    After that, adjust your pH to 7.2
    After that, adjust your CH
    After that, adjust your TA, but only if it is REALLY low, and needs to come up. If it is 40 or higher, dont do anything to it.

    If you dont need to SLAM, add salt to get you to the recommended level of the SWG manufacturar, probably about 3400ppm
    If you do need to SLAM, wait till its over to add salt. Otherwise you just backwash the salt you added right back out of the pool.

    DO NOT TURN ON THE SWG until slam is over and until the salt has mixed for a full 24 hours. You can damage the salt cell if you dont wait till the salt is fully mixed.

    After you are sure you are algae free and the salt has mixed for 24hrs, then turn on the SWG.
    Then after that, add more CYA to get you to the recommended level of around 70. Better to add in a couple of small steps so you dont overshoot and get too high.

    After that, enjoy the pool.

    Hope this helps,
    Divin Dave,
    IG Vinyl, 15' x 30', 3 1/2' - 6' deep, Oval, ~15K gal, Intelliclor IC40, Intelliflo VS pump, Clean and Clear 420 Filter, auto-fill-disabled, Retrofit LED Color Light, Dolphin Nautilus Robot, TF100 Test Kit, Taylor K1766 Salt Test Kit, Tftestkit Pressure Gauge.
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    Re: Refilling the pool and converting to SWG

    Wow, Tex, Kim and Dave. THANKS. I have a TF100 test kit and will test tap water in the morning. I suspect it will take at least two full days to fill to the top, but I'm in uncharted territory here and don't really know. I have three hoses from three different spigots running at full bore, so hopefully it will be less.
    I appreciate the virtually step-by-step instructions, Dave. I'll follow them and keep ya'll informed of progress. I got an email from the company I ordered the SWG from this evening and they're now saying it will arrive Wednesday, so I'm glad you warned me off turning the SWG on til after I have slammed.
    35,000 gallon gunite pool. 1 hp hayward pump. Sand filter. Waterfall. 1 main drain. 2 skimmers. 4 returns. 1 1/2" PVC tubing. Maytronics robot.

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    Divin Dave's Avatar
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    Re: Refilling the pool and converting to SWG

    Good deal Kermit.

    Yeah, the SWG is great for producing enough chlorine to prevent an algae bloom. Not so great a killing a bunch that already exists. They just dont produce enough chlorine fast enough to keep the algae from multiplying.

    I didnt notice (my bad), that you have a 35K gallon pool. That will take at least a couple of days to fill up even with 3 hoses I would imagine.
    2 cups bleach per 10,000 gallons of water should keep any algae that you might have left over at bay so it wont get any worse while filing... but dont add any more than that and you should be fine.

    Pour it in and then take a water hose and squirt all over where you poured it in at, so you can mix it up as well as you can with the rest of the water.
    Maybe swish it around a bit with a broom.

    If you have any questions or need anything, just hollar at us and well do what we can to help out.
    Divin Dave,
    IG Vinyl, 15' x 30', 3 1/2' - 6' deep, Oval, ~15K gal, Intelliclor IC40, Intelliflo VS pump, Clean and Clear 420 Filter, auto-fill-disabled, Retrofit LED Color Light, Dolphin Nautilus Robot, TF100 Test Kit, Taylor K1766 Salt Test Kit, Tftestkit Pressure Gauge.
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    Mod Squad pooldv's Avatar
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    Re: Refilling the pool and converting to SWG

    As you are working on balancing your water here is the Water Balance for a SWG Pool
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    Re: Refilling the pool and converting to SWG

    Thanks Pooldv and Dave. Here's my chemistry:
    Ph: 6.5
    FC: 3
    CC: .25
    TA: 60
    CH: 120
    CYA: 0
    Straight from the tap
    35,000 gallon gunite pool. 1 hp hayward pump. Sand filter. Waterfall. 1 main drain. 2 skimmers. 4 returns. 1 1/2" PVC tubing. Maytronics robot.

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    Mod Squad kimkats's Avatar
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    Re: Refilling the pool and converting to SWG

    So what you know right out of the hose is that you will need to raise the PH level and TA. Good job!

    Kim
    TFP Moderator 33x52 round AG 25,600 gals Sand Filter 1.5hp Pump - 2 Speed, SLAM, Pool School, Recommended Levels, Recommended Chemicals, Pool Math, Chlorine/CYA Chart, TF-100 Test Kit

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    Divin Dave's Avatar
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    Re: Refilling the pool and converting to SWG

    Hi Kermit! For straight out of the tap, the FC seems extremely high for tap water. I would expect it to he <.5 Might want to try that again just to be sure.


    pH will need to be raised upon filing
    CH needs to be raised to 250 after you add CYA
    TA good for now. Over time, you will want to lower it to control pH rise. But its not critical.
    CYA as expected as it doen't naturally occur in water. Add 30ppm immediately after adding FC after filling.

    One tip on testing CC's. Immediately after testing FC, add the 5 drops of R0003. If you let the FC test solution sit for more than maybe 10 or 15 seconds, the solution will begin to turn back to pink, and result in a False High CC test.

    Quote Originally Posted by kermit7012 View Post
    Thanks Pooldv and Dave. Here's my chemistry:
    Ph: 6.5
    FC: 3
    CC: .25
    TA: 60
    CH: 120
    CYA: 0
    Straight from the tap
    Divin Dave,
    IG Vinyl, 15' x 30', 3 1/2' - 6' deep, Oval, ~15K gal, Intelliclor IC40, Intelliflo VS pump, Clean and Clear 420 Filter, auto-fill-disabled, Retrofit LED Color Light, Dolphin Nautilus Robot, TF100 Test Kit, Taylor K1766 Salt Test Kit, Tftestkit Pressure Gauge.
    www.tftestkits.net Experience- it's what's learned just after you needed it most !!

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    Re: Refilling the pool and converting to SWG

    Dave, I too was shocked at the chlorine level. So I checked it twice. 6 drops x .5 = 3FC. I just went back and measured again. This time, maybe 4 hours later, FC now measures 7. Yes, 7. (14 drops til clear). CC still measures what would probably be a little less than .5. (5 drops R0003 turned it from clear to just slightly pink. Then one additional drop of 0871 cleared it up immediately).
    What do you think? I'll measure it again in a couple hours.
    Straight from the tap.
    35,000 gallon gunite pool. 1 hp hayward pump. Sand filter. Waterfall. 1 main drain. 2 skimmers. 4 returns. 1 1/2" PVC tubing. Maytronics robot.

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    Mod Squad kimkats's Avatar
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    Re: Refilling the pool and converting to SWG

    I wonder if you town has added extra chlorine for the rains/floods? Do you know your neighbors enough to ask to test their water?

    Kim
    TFP Moderator 33x52 round AG 25,600 gals Sand Filter 1.5hp Pump - 2 Speed, SLAM, Pool School, Recommended Levels, Recommended Chemicals, Pool Math, Chlorine/CYA Chart, TF-100 Test Kit

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    Re: Refilling the pool and converting to SWG

    Call the city... Or water supply company fast
    14,750 GAL IG Fiberglass (16 x 33) NE Ohio || Jandy 1HP 2 speed Pump || Waterco MultiCyclone 16 Centrifugal pre-filter (removed due to not working with sand filter) || 30" 575 Lb. Sand Filter || AquaCal 140K BTU Heat Pump || Solar Cover || Inter-fab Adrenaline Slide || GLI Monsoon Solar Cover Reel || K-2006C Test Kit || BBB with Liquid Chlorine Stenner Injection || Rayner Mighty Mesh Winter Cover

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    Re: Refilling the pool and converting to SWG

    Hi Kim---Knoxville hasn't had nearly as much rain as parts of Tennessee to our west, but that doesn't mean they haven't boosted the chlorine level. To you and toofast, I just got off the phone with the utility company and they are "dispatching a crew" to investigate.
    I'll let you know the outcome
    35,000 gallon gunite pool. 1 hp hayward pump. Sand filter. Waterfall. 1 main drain. 2 skimmers. 4 returns. 1 1/2" PVC tubing. Maytronics robot.

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    Divin Dave's Avatar
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    Re: Refilling the pool and converting to SWG

    any news yet?
    Divin Dave,
    IG Vinyl, 15' x 30', 3 1/2' - 6' deep, Oval, ~15K gal, Intelliclor IC40, Intelliflo VS pump, Clean and Clear 420 Filter, auto-fill-disabled, Retrofit LED Color Light, Dolphin Nautilus Robot, TF100 Test Kit, Taylor K1766 Salt Test Kit, Tftestkit Pressure Gauge.
    www.tftestkits.net Experience- it's what's learned just after you needed it most !!

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    Mod Squad pooldv's Avatar
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    Re: Refilling the pool and converting to SWG

    +1 on raising PH with Borax and leaving TA alone at 60 for a while to see how it goes. Sometimes having TA around 60 in a saltwater pool is good to avoid PH rise. It is important to keep PH between 7.2 and 7.8.

    Here are the Recommended Pool Chemicals and how to add them.
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    2012 build and pics, 20k gal gunite, black onyx pebblesheen, OK flagstone, IntellifoVS, cart filter w/Pleatco, IC40 SWG, Solartouch, 5 12'x4' solar panels, HP50HA heat pump, 8mil solar cover, borates, TF-100 test kit, SONOS, Doheny's Discovery Robot, hot tub on bleach

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    Re: Refilling the pool and converting to SWG

    Disquieting news, actually. Utility company just left. While my FC reading this morning had gone down to 3.5, his reading was 2.1. We both rechecked using the TF100 kit and both got readings again of 3.5. He has pretty sophisticated testing equipment so I'm assuming his reading with his tester is correct. I know my chemicals are less than two years old...and really think I re-ordered last year but I have been known to forget one or two things in my life. I ordered some R0010 and a couple other replacement chemicals on-line last night. Guess I need to order more chlorine testing chemicals, too. Bad timing to find out now that my readings are incorrect. This will make slamming before installing the new SWG (that just arrived) a bit more difficult.
    35,000 gallon gunite pool. 1 hp hayward pump. Sand filter. Waterfall. 1 main drain. 2 skimmers. 4 returns. 1 1/2" PVC tubing. Maytronics robot.

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    Re: Refilling the pool and converting to SWG

    I have borax and will add now. Adding bleach to get to 3ppm. Can I go ahead and add cya?
    35,000 gallon gunite pool. 1 hp hayward pump. Sand filter. Waterfall. 1 main drain. 2 skimmers. 4 returns. 1 1/2" PVC tubing. Maytronics robot.

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    Re: Refilling the pool and converting to SWG

    My CH is at 120. Am I reading PoolMath correctly and I need to add about 50# calcium chloride?. If so, should I "sneak up on it" by adding maybe 10# over a 5 day period or just go ahead and add 50?

    - - - Updated - - -

    Dave,et al: I have added one and a half gallons of 8.2% bleach, about one and a half pounds of 20 Mule Team, 7 and a half #s of stabilizer.
    Is there any way to determine whether or not I have any algae or should I just go ahead and SLAM before installing the SWG?
    Thanks
    35,000 gallon gunite pool. 1 hp hayward pump. Sand filter. Waterfall. 1 main drain. 2 skimmers. 4 returns. 1 1/2" PVC tubing. Maytronics robot.

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    Mod Squad pooldv's Avatar
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    Re: Refilling the pool and converting to SWG

    Yes, it is OK to add CYA any time. CH range is 300-400, no need to sneak up on that one, just target 300. To check for organic material you can Pool School - Perform the Overnight FC Loss Test (OCLT)

    Pool School - Recommended Pool Chemicals
    Pool School - Recommended Levels
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