Hooking up low voltage lighting to Omnilogic

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bobby299

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Aug 1, 2014
6
Eldon, MO
Hi there, since we're on the omnilogic subject, does anybody have experience with hooking up their low voltage landscape lighting to the omnilogic? I am curious to know how that works, where the wires go, etc. Any help would be great! thank you!

Bobby
 
Re: OmniLogic problems

Normally you would just hook the low voltage transformer to a HVR when relay is on power is supplied to the transformer which will power the LVL. If you have a low voltage pool light it will hook up in the same manner as it is
 
If you are hooking up one low voltage light to be controlled by the OmniLogic it is fairly straightforward as jcaaronjr says above.

I have a slightly more complicated situation. Actually, I'm guessing just about anyone with any OmniLogic will have such a situation. I have 3 low voltage lights that I want to control independent of each other. If you use a tranformer for each light it is simple as jcaaronjr indicated. I have also attached the hayward diagram for wiring relays. Low voltage is done the same as high voltage (though the power source would be from the relay instead fo from a breaker usually) and the same high voltage relays are used.

I have a spa light, pool light and landscape light I would like to be controlled by the OmniLogic. All the lights are low voltage. Since they are low voltage they need to get their power from a transformer. One 300w transformer is sufficient for my lights. I currently have it wired such that the transformer is ON/WORKING all the time and then the OmniLogic relays control low voltage only. I don't really like the idea of having the transformer powered at all times. I spoke with Intermatic (transformer mfg) and they couldn't really tell me if it is rated for continuous duty. I have a feeling it will see premature failure if running all the time.

I was thinking about it and it may be possible to set it up so the transformer is only powered when a low voltage light is demanded. I came up with a wiring diagram (forgive my skills - I did it in powerpoint, not autocad). I have attached the diagram. Comments on whether this will work. I believe each leg of the OmniLogic relays is independent. My schematic would put 12v on one side of the relay and 120v on the other. That is one part that concerns me. I'm unsure if that is a legitimate concern. In my schematic a red arrow represents 120v and a black arrow 12v. Hopefully this makes sense.

What do you think? Is this a good way to wire these low voltage lights?
 

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chinatti, thanks for your reply. I understand what you are saying about high and low voltage being in close proximity. Where exactly do you see the problem? The fact they share the same relay? I agree that is a problem, didn't think of that at first. It is particularly problematic since the low voltage lighting doesnt use a GFCI breaker. So if there was an internal failure of the relay high voltage could pass to the low voltage side then to the pool.

I haven't drawn it out, but I might be able to get the high voltage on one relay and the low on a different one then tell the omnilogic to control two relays per light. Or do you see a problem somewhere else?
 
I'm not an electrician, but I think the issue is in general you can't even have them in the same junction box / panel area / conduit without a specific design to isolate them physically. Having them connected to the same relay is certainly a risk (if somehow the relay failed and they shorted), but if a wire got loose (maybe the panel gets physically bumped or damaged) you could also short high->low. Once that happens you would now have high voltage on a wire that was never rated for that capacity. i.e. your low-voltage wire is probably directly buried, with no protection like it would have if it were high voltage, and could damage equipment or more importantly electrocute someone.

You can see in the omnilogic panel how the area to the left (low voltage) is separated by a metal divider from the area on the right (high voltage) - that's to prevent inadvertent shorting, etc., and likely meet the UL requirements.

So would it work? I believe so. Should you do it? I would not. There's usually a good reason for the codes, and saving a few dollars on the extra transformer is probably not worth the risk.

Of course I could be off the mark here, and maybe someone else will chime in with a different answer...
 
chinatti said:
I'm not an electrician, but I think the issue is in general you can't even have them in the same junction box / panel area / conduit without a specific design to isolate them physically. Having them connected to the same relay is certainly a risk (if somehow the relay failed and they shorted), but if a wire got loose (maybe the panel gets physically bumped or damaged) you could also short high->low. Once that happens you would now have high voltage on a wire that was never rated for that capacity. i.e. your low-voltage wire is probably directly buried, with no protection like it would have if it were high voltage, and could damage equipment or more importantly electrocute someone.

You can see in the omnilogic panel how the area to the left (low voltage) is separated by a metal divider from the area on the right (high voltage) - that's to prevent inadvertent shorting, etc., and likely meet the UL requirements.

So would it work? I believe so. Should you do it? I would not. There's usually a good reason for the codes, and saving a few dollars on the extra transformer is probably not worth the risk.

Of course I could be off the mark here, and maybe someone else will chime in with a different answer...
Click to expand...

This is exactly what I wanted to say. The "power" section of Omnilogic enclosure is only for high voltage and is physically separated from low voltage wiring on purpose.
What you could do in theory is to get an Omnilogic expansion box and dedicate it 100% to low voltage power relays. I doubt it would make economic sense vs. just getting a few more transformers or in case you have LED lighting - electronic drivers.
 
Those relays are likely 24vac coils? You could get a plastic or metal enclosure box and mount it next to the panel, then remove those relays and run the coil wires out of the main box via a low voltage runway/knockout/drill one and into the companion box. Then it should be compliant with only low voltage in the raceway, conduit, and box. Leave the 110vac in the main box and have that one relay only turn on the landscape transformer. That may be more easily done by making a "switched" outlet since most transformers are meant to plug in.
 
I think the way they designed the omnilogic to control low voltage was an oversight and not well thought out. If you have the need to control numerous low voltage light stations it isn't accomplished very easily unless you want to use a different transformer for each light station (that could add up to numerous transformers at over $100 each). Using a different transformer will then keep the low voltage wiring out of the high voltage side of the omnilogic (and meet NEC rules). I am told that they have low voltage control module coming out that will solve these problems. I was told by goldline tech support that i could use a colorlogic network control module. But then was told by a local hayward tech that the current network control module will NOT work in the omnilogic. At this point I am not sure who is correct, but i think its the local tech, since there is no mention on the network control module of its compatibility with omnilogic.

Regardless, I am not sure if the network control module will be able to control lights other than Hayward. One person told me for the controller to work the hayward lights need to be the networked ones (which will have an "N" at the end of the part model/name) and a different person told me the control module could be used to control landscape lighting. I guess I will wait and see when that module is said to be compatible with the omnilogic.

Any other ideas for controlling numerous low voltage lights (independently) with the omnilogic. I think adustman's idea may be the best, assuming it is easy to lengthen the control wiring for the relays.
 

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jgarden said:
I am told that they have low voltage control module coming out that will solve these problems.
Click to expand...

Any details on the timeframe for this module? I'm planning on adding some low voltage zones towards the end of this year, and something like this would be a nice option for controlling them.... Also, do you know if they control for this could be coupled with a high voltage relay to feed the transformer input power (i.e. turn on high voltage relay "N" when any of the low voltage relays 1, 2, or 3 are on).
 
I have all Pentair stuff, which I now regret... I have four light zones (relays), 4 transformers. Of course, via iPhone or MobileTouch there is no way to set each to a different color even though they are on 4 relays... so it was a waste... unless I dry off and go inside to my PC Screen logic, then I can set them to different colors...

I had a pool tech (fixing another part failure on my Pentair stuff), tell me that the OmniLogic has addressable lights, that don't use power cycling to select colors... they send power line data signals to tell the light what color to set itself to. is this true? I can't find any info about this in OmniLogic docs... may be I am missing it, or may be it is not out yet.
 
jtech1 said:
I have all Pentair stuff, which I now regret... I have four light zones (relays), 4 transformers. Of course, via iPhone or MobileTouch there is no way to set each to a different color even though they are on 4 relays... so it was a waste... unless I dry off and go inside to my PC Screen logic, then I can set them to different colors...

I had a pool tech (fixing another part failure on my Pentair stuff), tell me that the OmniLogic has addressable lights, that don't use power cycling to select colors... they send power line data signals to tell the light what color to set itself to. is this true? I can't find any info about this in OmniLogic docs... may be I am missing it, or may be it is not out yet.
Click to expand...

My understanding is that if you have the network capable hayward lights and when an "add on module" becomes available the OmniLogic will have this ability. Right now they power cycle to achieve the various colors. (See my post from 6/9 - I think that's what you are talking about.
 
Can someone tell me hoe to hook up low voltage led landscape lights to omnilogic? Are there instructions in the omnilogic manual? My setup is simple. 10 lights in series and on/off all together. Simple instructions are appreciated.

do I need a breaker?
do I need a transformer?
where do these wires go in?
how do I program Omni to know these are lights???
 
First, 120v and 12v wires can be ran in the same conduit and can be in the same enclosure. As long as they are all rated for the higher voltage.
Manufacturers seperate the high and low voltage wires because it is safer and there is less of a chance of 120v getting put into the 24v circuitry.

Second, I don't think your idea will work because your wires on the transformer will all have continuity. So when any relay turns on, all the lights will turn on.

The way to do it is use 4 relays.
1 relay for the 120v feed to the transformer
2 for pool light
3 for spa light
4 for landscape lights
I'm not sure about the omnilogic but I'm sure it's similar to the others I've done. You can program the relays in groups. Program the pool light as relay 1 and 2
Program the spa light as 1 and 3
Etc...
 
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