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Thread: They told me to drain it

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    They told me to drain it

    I have a 27k gallons pool. For the past 3 weeks (after a big storm) I can't get the water clear. The water is green and while it looks better (I can see the stairs) the pool is unusable. I tried everything from backwashing once a day, to pouring 8 gallons of chlorine, 3 bags of extra shock, algaecide, chlorine tablets and running the pool (on vacuum) 12 hours a day. Nothing worked

    Here are the latest water results done by NPS Pool & Spa Supply
    *Total Chlorine 1.2
    *Free Chlorine 0.9
    *Ph 7.4
    *Total Alkalinity 105
    *Calcium Hardness 750
    *Stabilizer 130
    *Total Diss. Solids 5100 -------- they say I have to drain it and refill it with clean water because this number is high. Leslie gave me the same advice
    *Phosphate 200
    *Shock Treatment 0.3

    I don't want to drain the pool after I spent so much on chemicals but I honestly have no idea what to do anymore.
    The pump is a sand pump

    Thank you for any advice, help

  2. Back To Top    #2
    Mod Squad jblizzle's Avatar
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    Re: They told me to drain it

    Welcome to TFP!!!

    First realize that we do not trust pool store test at all. If you want to truly take control, you must invest in one of the Recommended Test Kits. And we can not offer much advice until you have one and post good test results.

    The only reasons to have to drain and replace some water are a CYA that is too high or a CH that is too high ... well, if those results are correct, your CYA is much too high and the CH is getting up there too. So at least some water replacement is very likely in your future. If you do not want to run into this problem again (at least for the CYA), then you should continue reading here and learn about maintaining your pool correctly.

    TDS is meaningless. Phosphates are meaningless. Shock Treatment ... no idea WTH that even means.

    BTW, with our hard water and high evaporation rates, replacing water every 4-6 years is almost required due to the climbing CH levels.
    Jason, TFP Moderator
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  3. Back To Top    #3
    Divin Dave's Avatar
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    Re: They told me to drain it

    Hi Binar,
    what Jblizzle says is true. If CYA and/or CH is too high, a partial drain may be in order.

    You dont have to drain the whole thing though. The first thing you need to do is get a reliable test kit. It will without a doubt be the best investment you ever make in your pool. Pool store testing along with their advice is horrendous.
    Divin Dave,
    IG Vinyl, 15' x 30', 3 1/2' - 6' deep, Oval, ~15K gal, Intelliclor IC40, Intelliflo VS pump, Clean and Clear 420 Filter, auto-fill-disabled, Retrofit LED Color Light, Dolphin Nautilus Robot, TF100 Test Kit, Taylor K1766 Salt Test Kit, Tftestkit Pressure Gauge.
    www.tftestkits.net Experience- it's what's learned just after you needed it most !!

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    Isaac-1's Avatar
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    Re: They told me to drain it

    I suspect the dry shock was on their advice too? Depending on the type of dry chlorine product you will get in addition to FC (Chlorine) either an increase in CYA stabilizer or an increase in CH, You live in an area with high levels of evaporation, which over time further concentrates these levels as well as naturally high CH fill water, Therefore you should never use dry chlorine that contains Cal-Hypo which raises CH, and only under certain rare situations, like after a large amount of rain and splash out use dichlor or trichlor which add CYA, and then only after careful consideration of your current levels.
    Indoor 20x40 35,000 gallon vinyl pool with 1.5 HP 2 speed Jandy FloPro pump, Hayward EC75 Perflex DE filter, 11 4x12 Techno-Solis solar panels w/ Aquasolar controller, Aquabot Turbo T Robot Cleaner. Also LMI metering chlorine dispenser pump and HotSpring Jetsetter
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  5. Back To Top    #5

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    Re: They told me to drain it

    Thank you for your answers. I can get my hands on a LaMotte 2056 ColorQ Pro 7 Digital Pool Water Test Kit for free. Is not one of the recommended test kits so I was wondering if I should get it or stick to the list.

    http://www.lamotte.com/en/pool-spa/d...lorq/2056.html

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    Mod Squad tim5055's Avatar
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    Re: They told me to drain it

    Quote Originally Posted by Binar View Post
    Thank you for your answers. I can get my hands on a LaMotte 2056 ColorQ Pro 7 Digital Pool Water Test Kit for free. Is not one of the recommended test kits so I was wondering if I should get it or stick to the list.

    http://www.lamotte.com/en/pool-spa/d...lorq/2056.html
    Stick with the list. The ColorQ has issues. HERE is a post from 2012 where a comparison was made between the ColorQ and one of the recommended kits.

    Here is a quote from the author
    So, what did I find from all this?
    The consistency of the TF100 results are reassuring to me. The ColorQ results are, to say the least, frightening! That the chlorine would change reading in that short of the time (I had seen this before but it was after a sample sat closed, out of the sunlight between samples), just makes me thing I'd be better off guessing. The pH was inconsistent (although that fluctuation doesn't bug me as much) and the TA was almost 50% higher!

    The irony of all this is that the ColorQ is supposedly known for CYA being the least accurate, yet that was almost spot on with what the TF100 gave me. Even taking into account the tolerances of the ColorQ (per LaMotte, posted below for reference).

    My conclusion from all of this, for what it's worth, is that the ColorQ is essentially worthless to me. I'm obviously tremendously disappointed and of course there may yet be some learning curve for me on the TF100 (although I've been taking other taylor measurements via some Leslie's stuff). I had hoped the ColorQ would serve the purpose of it *not* being necessary to squint and tell which color it's closest to. But as long as I can convince myself that the colors are close enough to work to, I think I'm better off putting the ColorQ away and chalking this up to a learning experience. Obviously, your mileage may vary, but anyone else considering the ColorQ, please keep all this in mind.
    TFP Moderator 39 X 18 23,000(ish) freeform gunite; built 2007ish; Pentair Triton II TR100 600lb Sand filter; 2 HP Pentair pump with 2.2 HP AO Smith single speed motor; 2 skimmers, 1 main drain, 4 returns w/waterfall, Stenner 45MHP2 3GPD running@ 60% - 15 gal Tank; heated by the sun CYA 200+ when I started - 50 now. Dolphin Supreme M5 Pool Cleaner. Hot Springs SX Spa, 285 gallon

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    Mod Squad jblizzle's Avatar
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    Re: They told me to drain it

    Maybe that is why it is free
    Jason, TFP Moderator
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    Mod Squad pooldv's Avatar
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    Re: They told me to drain it

    Welcome to TFP!

    With that much chlorine consumption, the high CYA and the low FC level I think you have early stage algae bloom.

    Get a good test kit and read up on SLAMing Your Pool
    TFP Moderator
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    Re: They told me to drain it

    Quote Originally Posted by jblizzle View Post
    Maybe that is why it is free
    Touché

    I went ahead and ordered TAYLOR K-2006..I'll let you know once I have the kit and some results.
    Thank you again

  10. Back To Top    #10
    Mod Squad pooldv's Avatar
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    Re: They told me to drain it

    Alright!
    Here are some intro Pool School articles to read while you wait for your test kit
    TFPC for Beginners
    ABC's of Pool Water Chemistry

    Here are the Recommended Levels for your pool.
    Here are the Recommended Pool Chemicals
    Use PoolMath to figure out how much to add.
    TFP Moderator
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    2012 build and pics, 20k gal gunite, black onyx pebblesheen, OK flagstone, IntellifoVS, cart filter w/Pleatco, IC40 SWG, Solartouch, 5 12'x4' solar panels, HP50HA heat pump, 8mil solar cover, borates, TF-100 test kit, SONOS, Doheny's Discovery Robot, hot tub on bleach

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    Re: They told me to drain it

    I got my test and my first results.
    *Free Chlorine 0.2 ppm
    *PH 7.4
    *Combined Chlorine 0.2 ppm
    *Total Alkalinity 140 ppm
    *Calcium hardness ---- could not make the test turn blue no matter how many drops I added ( as high as 32)
    *Cyanuric Acid well over 100 (100 is the max the test grades for)

    The test used is TAYLOR K-2006

    What's the next step now?

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    Isaac-1's Avatar
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    Re: They told me to drain it

    You need to get the CYA down, which means replacing over 50% of the water. Depending on the type of pool you have you may need to do this in stages 20-30% of the water then refill and repeat.
    Indoor 20x40 35,000 gallon vinyl pool with 1.5 HP 2 speed Jandy FloPro pump, Hayward EC75 Perflex DE filter, 11 4x12 Techno-Solis solar panels w/ Aquasolar controller, Aquabot Turbo T Robot Cleaner. Also LMI metering chlorine dispenser pump and HotSpring Jetsetter
    I use and endorse TFtestKits TF-100 from http://tftestkits.net
    ~Remember TFP counts on your donations to keep this site ad free~

  13. Back To Top    #13

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    Re: They told me to drain it

    Quote Originally Posted by Isaac-1 View Post
    You need to get the CYA down, which means replacing over 50% of the water. Depending on the type of pool you have you may need to do this in stages 20-30% of the water then refill and repeat.
    Let's say I don't plan swimming in it..I just want the pool to look clear from the emerald green color it got now. Is there anyway to make the pool look clear without draining it?

  14. Back To Top    #14
    n240sxguy's Avatar
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    Re: They told me to drain it

    With CYA over 100, could be 150 or it could be 300+, you'll have a very hard time keeping enough chlorine in it to do any good. With that much chlorine the ph test will also not read correctly. You need to replace a bunch of water before you can clear it up.


    30K gallon IG vinyl. 1.5HP 2-speed Waterway Mustang pump. 600 lb sand filter. Polaris 280. Circupool SI-60+. TF-100

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    Re: They told me to drain it

    I'm in Phx, Az and the heat just started. We should hit 100 degrees in a week or so. I really don't want to damage the pool by draining even 50%...You don't think if I dump a lot of liquid chlorine I might be able to get it back on track or clear it a bit? At this point I 'm willing to try anything....as long as it doesn't damage the pool.

    Again my test results are:

    *Free Chlorine 0.2 ppm
    *PH 7.4
    *Combined Chlorine 0.2 ppm
    *Total Alkalinity 140 ppm
    *Calcium hardness ---- could not make the test turn blue no matter how many drops I added ( as high as 32)
    *Cyanuric Acid well over 100 (100 is the max the test grades for)

    The test used is TAYLOR K-2006

  16. Back To Top    #16
    n240sxguy's Avatar
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    Re: They told me to drain it

    You can do smaller drain/addition cycles. Start draining in the late afternoon, and let it fill back up over night. It will take longer and use more water, but you mitigate the risk of damage.
    It is unrealistic to try to maintain it with cya really high. Here's some numbers to think about. Since we don't know how high the cya actually is, there are a couple scenarios. All these come from pool math and assume using 121oz bottles of 8.25% bleach. If you lower cya to 50, it will take 6.6 bottles of 8.25% bleach to reach shock level of 20. You'll have to keep adding bleach to maintain that level until the slam is done. Afterward you will need around 80oz of chlorine a day to maintain the FC level assuming average losses of 2ppm FC per day. That one stays the same in all the scenarios.
    If your cya is 100, the initial dose to reach shock level of 39 is 13 bottles. At 200, you need 26 bottles to reach 79FC. At 300, you need 37 bottles to reach 111FC. You can see where the money can really get flowing just to get to a high enough FC level. On top of that, you will never be able to get an accurate ph reading.


    30K gallon IG vinyl. 1.5HP 2-speed Waterway Mustang pump. 600 lb sand filter. Polaris 280. Circupool SI-60+. TF-100

  17. Back To Top    #17
    Mod Squad jblizzle's Avatar
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    Re: They told me to drain it

    You can also drain from one end while filling from the other. You will use more water, but will eliminate your worry about the plaster.
    Jason, TFP Moderator
    18k IG pebblesheen pool, Hayward ProLogic P4 w/ T-15 SWG, Pentair 1HP 2-speed Superflo, Hayward 6020 DE filter
    500 sqft Heliocol solar panels, ThePoolCleaner, TF-100 test kit w/ SpeedStir
    Pool School + Test Kit + PoolMath = A TROUBLE FREE POOL
    If you found TFP helpful and we saved you money ... Become a TFP Supporter!

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