Bonding concern

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grottoguy

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Aug 24, 2014
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NJ
We passed bonding inspection in which the bonding wire had to be 4 to 6 inches below grade. In addition, one of the bonding wires ran underground to the equipment pad. Since then we have started to build a grotto and slide and the contractor poured concrete behind the grotto to support the slide and the grotto rocks. When they poured the concrete it went over the pipes and the bonding wire. If we ever have to access those pipes it will obviously be a problem, but my concern now is whether concrete over the copper bonding wire somehow affects the bonding potential of the wire?

I appreciate any responses.

Thanks
 
We may be within three feet. They have footings for the slide where they tied some rebar and I think they are going to connect that to the bonding wire. But when they poured the concrete into the ditch they dug, they had no rebar. Please see pictures. One of tehm shows inside teh round tube wehre teh footings are. Now I am very concerned.IMG_1884.jpgIMG_1877.jpgIMG_1891.jpg

Please explain the issue . Thanks
 
There will be rocks. We are building a grotto with a waterfall. The contractor is telling me if he put rebar inside the cement he would need to bond it but since he did not he doesn't need to. He is bonding all of the metal parts underneath the slide. (You can see those parts in the above pictures). My big question is based on these facts does the cement need to have rebar inside it and if so why? Thanks everyone.
 

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I'm not an electrician, I don;t play one on TV and I didn't sleep at a Holiday Inn Express last night, so my advice is worth what you paid for it.

Not only do the metal parts need to be bonded, but the bonding grid should surround the pool 3' on all sides. If he doesn't have re-bar in the concrete he should have #8 bare copper under there. You don't' eliminate the need for Equipotential Bonding by eliminating re-bar. Article 680-30 (2) of the National Electrical Code says:
(2) Perimeter Surfaces. An equipotential bonding grid must
extend 3 ft horizontally beyond the inside walls of a pool, outdoor spa, or outdoor hot tub, including unpaved, paved, and poured concrete surfaces.
Click to expand...

You can see expamples in Mike Holt’s Illustrated Guide to Understanding the NEC® Requirements for Article 680 Swimming Pools, Spas, Hot Tubs, Fountains, and Similar Installations

He may be right, but I would want him to prove it. He can't just say that's the way I do it, or I've already passed the bonding inspection.
 
Thanks Tim. Just to be clear, my original bonding inspection passed because I did have a bonding grid around the pool, inclduign behind where the grotto will be. And that same grid is still there. It is on top of that concrete. In other words, after I passed inspection, they dug up the area behind where the grotto will be and poured concrete. But the grid behind the grotto is still 6 inches below grade, which is above the concrete. If you look at the above picture, which is sideways, you can see ther grid above the concrete. Does this change your thinking?
 
What are they going to do with the wire? Again, I'm not an electrician/expert but it is my understanding that this must be a complete circle around the pool and attached to any metal objects around the pool and attached to any objects that contact the water (heaters, pumps ect.). The idea is that if everything is connected together there can be no potential difference between someone standing on the slab and touching the slide and getting a shock.

Will that concrete be the finished product, or are they going to add something on top of the concrete that the wire will be imbedded in like sand with pavers?
 
Tim,

There will be a complete circle around the pool. That already exists. And the wire around the pool is also attached to all equipment on the pad. In addition, the metal under the slide (see picture of metal in footings) will all be attached to that bonding wire. I think I may have confused some people, but what has happened today is that they dug up behind the grotto and poured concrete behind the grotto, underneath that bonding wire. Esentially, imagine your pool with the bonding wire around it, buried 4-6 inches below grade. Then imagine that you dug a ditch immediately behind the pool and filled it with concrete. On top of the concrete you put rocks, and the bonding wire remains around the pool 4-6 inches deep.

Do you or Jason or anyone else think the concrete needs to have had REBAR for electrical reasons? I am not sure why they didn't use REBAR to support it (for construction purposes), but am primarily concrend now with any electrical issues.

Thanks
 
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