waterbear said:
Wow...That's low! We've got SWG's that you can run right up to 13000.
Almost every cell here has a min of 3000. That's amazing. You guys
need to catch up
Take Care,
Michael Silvester
White flakes and foam
- Thread starter JeffPenn
- Start date
Wow...That's low! We've got SWG's that you can run right up to 13000.
Almost every cell here has a min of 3000. That's amazing. You guys
need to catch up
Take Care,
Michael Silvester
Michael Silvester said:
Wow...That's low! We've got SWG's that you can run right up to 13000.
Almost every cell here has a min of 3000. That's amazing. You guys
need to catch up
Take Care,
Michael Silvester[/quote:35057thx]
There are units available here that will work in salt concentrations as high as seawater but still recommend running at 3000 ppm (Pool Pilot) but the point is the units that run at lower salt concentrations are less likely to cause corrosion damage. They are actually newer designs than the higher concentration units you are probably used to, such as the WaterMaid. Also, almost all these designs are polarity reversivng or 'self cleaning' and many include automation features such as control of pumps, valves, lights, etc. (Goldline Aqualogic) or the use of ORP contollers and pH elelctrodes to maintain chlorine levels and control pH with peristaltic pumps and acid tanks automatically and automatically adjust cell output to compensate for variations in temperature (Pool Pilot Digital and Total Control systems). Many of these systems include digital readouts that not only tell you the salt level but can also tell you how many pounds of salt you need to add when it gets low or other useful information. I would say that you guys are the ones that need to 'catch up'
Yeah, my SWG turns of when the reading gets around 3600 I believe. Funny thing is when I take my water in to get tested they always say the salt is between 2500 and 2800. I have ordered the TF Salt test strips to compliment my PS233 so I can check for myself .
Waterbear, the plates in my SWG are clean. my PH is usually between 7.4 - 7.6, but it rises very quickly, if i don't add acid every day or two it climes to 7.8 pretty quickly. I was thinking of doing the Borax thing but I really would like some detailed instructions on how much to add (my pool is between 13,000 - 14,000). Anyone think the borax would also help with the flakes?
Lastly, does anyone have any opinions on the Scale-Tek product? I get it at Leslies, 64 oz bottle of pink stuff. It doesn't seem to have any adverse effects to my water. The guys at Leslies have told me that it has phosphates and it has made my phosphate levels quite high in the past.
Waterbear, the plates in my SWG are clean. my PH is usually between 7.4 - 7.6, but it rises very quickly, if i don't add acid every day or two it climes to 7.8 pretty quickly. I was thinking of doing the Borax thing but I really would like some detailed instructions on how much to add (my pool is between 13,000 - 14,000). Anyone think the borax would also help with the flakes?
Lastly, does anyone have any opinions on the Scale-Tek product? I get it at Leslies, 64 oz bottle of pink stuff. It doesn't seem to have any adverse effects to my water. The guys at Leslies have told me that it has phosphates and it has made my phosphate levels quite high in the past.
The PH rise will lessen significantly if you bring your alkalinity down to 70 or 80. Actually doing exactly what you are already doing will bring the alkalinity down slowly.
You can calculate borax and acid amounts using my Pool Calculator. See the link in my signature.
You can calculate borax and acid amounts using my Pool Calculator. See the link in my signature.
The scale will drop as it calcium based. Usually dropping the pH and TA, like waterbear mentioned, will keep your scale under control. However, if your self cleaning mode is not working properly (reverse polarity), you will see the cell scale up in about 5-7 days. At that point, you will need a new circuit board so that the reverse polarity is working properly.
Scale-tec, from what I've heard, works great and really does the job of reducing calcium hardness, or reducing scale formation on the cells.
I wouldn't worry too much about the phosphates, until after you've tried everything else.
Regarding your previous algae issue, what did you use to treat it? (If you used a sodium bromide based product, you probably did more harm than good, temporarity).
Scale-tec, from what I've heard, works great and really does the job of reducing calcium hardness, or reducing scale formation on the cells.
I wouldn't worry too much about the phosphates, until after you've tried everything else.
Regarding your previous algae issue, what did you use to treat it? (If you used a sodium bromide based product, you probably did more harm than good, temporarity).
Michael,
Sorry. I have not welcomed you yet, but have been reading some of your responses.
Can you help me to understand which Aussie systems have automatic temperature compensation and how theirs do it?
Or which Aussie residential system has an optional ORP and pH controller?
Or which one has a display that shows you how much salt is needed to maintain their recommended salt level?
I'm not trying to cause trouble, just looking to educate myself as there are none in Australia that I know of that do these.
And, by the way, Welcome!
Sorry. I have not welcomed you yet, but have been reading some of your responses.
Can you help me to understand which Aussie systems have automatic temperature compensation and how theirs do it?
Or which Aussie residential system has an optional ORP and pH controller?
Or which one has a display that shows you how much salt is needed to maintain their recommended salt level?
I'm not trying to cause trouble, just looking to educate myself as there are none in Australia that I know of that do these.
And, by the way, Welcome!
Poolsean said:
Jaymac's MaxiChlor does as far as i remember.
Those things you mentioned are just bells and whistles build around same old transformer technology.
There is no demand in Australia for them, people here want it as simple as it can be.
When we introduced LCD timer to the market, a lot of people were confused on how to use it, and still preferred to use old style mechanical timers, even though the operation was exactly the same.
More important thing is the power supply itself as it affects the unit's operation, and the length of cell life.
Even PoolPilot (correct me if i'm wrong) still uses transformers.
Whereas we have been using switchmode power supplies for the past 7 years
And it doesn't look like anyone is catching up with us any time soon.
I have a Goldline's unit in my cupboard, gosh it's heavy. I can barely lift it. It's electrically inefficient, dissipates a lot of heat and so on.
Another thing to consider is anode material for the cell plates. Our SM cells here last anywhere up to 10 years. In fact we haven't had a single cell come back with anode material failure during the 7 years we sell them
So looks like you guys over there got some catching up to do
Sorry Socalkc, I cannot respond to Hayward's response. Usually when we can show our product is working, we step back. But there are reasons why we should also help correct problems, because our system is still being affected by water chemistry conditions. Even more reason you should be getting assistance from them.
What is your source water, calcium hardness? If it is too high and the Scale-tek is not working quick enough, you may have to drain and refill water with lower calcium hardness levels, to bring it under control. Like I said, I heard from several dealers in high calcium locations, that tells me this product works! Not like some other "scale reducing" snake oil products that dont do squat but drain your pocketbook.
Strannik, welcome also.
I don't know enough about your system, but I will check into what you're describing. Thanks for explaining.
Sean
What is your source water, calcium hardness? If it is too high and the Scale-tek is not working quick enough, you may have to drain and refill water with lower calcium hardness levels, to bring it under control. Like I said, I heard from several dealers in high calcium locations, that tells me this product works! Not like some other "scale reducing" snake oil products that dont do squat but drain your pocketbook.
Strannik, welcome also.
I don't know enough about your system, but I will check into what you're describing. Thanks for explaining.
Sean
socalkc said:
Karen,
If you take a sample and soak it in a diluted acid and water solution, the flagstone should not bubble and dissolve. Calcium would. This may help determine if it is your flagstone.
Do you use calcium hypo to shock the pool?
Perhaps you can check your reverse polarity to see if that is working. How? The cell cord connects to the power circuit board at screw terminals (I'm almost sure). Using a multimeter, set on DC volts, measure the voltage across the two wires. Wait 100 minutes, their reverse period, then retest with the multimeter probes on the same screw terminals. If reverse polarity is working properly, you should see the electrical polarity reverse direction from your initial test.
Hope this helps.
Because of the chemical extremes inside a SWG cell there is often scaling on some of the plates even when there isn't scaling in the pool. The SWG reverses the polarity to switch which plates are likely to get scaling, which tends to drive any existing scale off of the plates that were scaling the previous time around. The polarity is supposed to be reversed frequently enough that any bits of scale are so small that you can't see them. It is possible for the scale to break off without a polarity reversal, but mostly when polarity isn't reversing any scale will stay in the cell and eventually clog things up enough that you need to manually clean the cell.
From the sound of things the polarity isn't reversing frequently enough given the rate of scaling. A few SWGs let you adjust the frequency of polarity reversals, but most don't. The other option is to try and adjust your chemistry to reduce the rate of scaling by lowering the saturation index (but not by too much).
From the sound of things the polarity isn't reversing frequently enough given the rate of scaling. A few SWGs let you adjust the frequency of polarity reversals, but most don't. The other option is to try and adjust your chemistry to reduce the rate of scaling by lowering the saturation index (but not by too much).
You need to adjust your water balance. If you get this sort of scaling within 100 minutes reversal period (if that's what it's reversal period is), there is something seriously wrong with water in your pool. Going less than 100 min for reversal is not advisable because it will kill the cell in no time.
Try measuring on cell connections if there are no terminals on the unit.
Try measuring on cell connections if there are no terminals on the unit.
by seriously wrong i don't mean that you shouldn't swim in it, just that it's too scale forming. We have some clients who have this problem too, and there is nothing that can be done about it from SWG's side (apart from decreasing reverse interval to something very low which will kill the cell very quickly). That is assuming your SWG is functioning correctly.
It might be just the way the water in your area is.
It might be just the way the water in your area is.
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Hey Solcalkc, do you also have an Aquarite unit? I'm wondering if this problem is more frequent with this brand of SWG? The scaletec seems to help, but for the price it doesn't seem to help enough. keeping ph down between 7.2 -7.4 seems to help more. But it sounds like you have WAY more flakes than us. We also have a raised spa but for some reason don't get the flakes in the spa just under two of the three return jets in the pool.