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Thread: Gearing up for Ascorbic Acid Treatment

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    Gearing up for Ascorbic Acid Treatment

    I am posting pool stats so I can do this correctly. I have read all the topics here on the forum(you'all are a gold mine of information) and have the general idea, but would appreciate some guidance as the chemistry fails to stay in my head. I guess you could say I know enough to know I don't know enough. I have ordered the Ascorbic Acid and will purchase polyquat 60, Jack's Purple Stuff (plaster), and bleach. I know to lower the chlorine to 0 and the ph to 7.0. We have had over 10 in" rain in the last 2 weeks so I need to deal with the CYA and TA.
    I don't know the correct order in which to correct the water. Do I raise the CYA and then the TA, or just the opposite? And then lower FC and ph? The water is clear and sparkling, just those dang stains.

    FC 6
    CC 0
    TC6
    TA 50
    Ch 500
    CYA 20
    ph 7.5
    Borates 50
    Water Temp 70 degrees F
    17,000 gal., 3 waterfalls
    Cartridge Filter, SWG
    IG
    Plaster
    1 1/2 H.P.

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    JasonLion's Avatar
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    Re: Gearing up for Ascorbic Acid Treatment

    You can raise TA and CYA in either order without waiting. They don't really interact. If you raise CYA, wait 24 hours after than and retest the PH before adjusting the PH.
    19K gal, vinyl, 1/2 HP WhisperFlo pump, 200 sqft cartridge filter, AutoPilot Digital SWG, Dolphin Dynamic cleaning robot
    Creator of PoolMath and Pool Calculator. Other handy links: Support this site, TF Test Kits, Pool School

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    Re: Gearing up for Ascorbic Acid Treatment

    Thanks Jason for the quick supply. I have put the CYA in a sock in one of the skimmers, aiming for 70, I will keep checking the level, as I know it is slow to dissolve. Meantime I will keep watch on all the other levels. Am I correct that with SWG that the level of Chlorine can be a little bit lower?Hopefully by the time my supplies arrive I will be ready. I am also going to check the levels of my fill water. Our water comes from a community well, its treated, however it is very hard water.
    Will be checking in again.
    Chris
    17,000 gal., 3 waterfalls
    Cartridge Filter, SWG
    IG
    Plaster
    1 1/2 H.P.

  4. Back To Top    #4
    JasonLion's Avatar
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    Re: Gearing up for Ascorbic Acid Treatment

    Yes, when using a SWG the day to day FC level can be a little lower. Both PoolMath and the table in Pool School show you exactly how much lower.

    There is no real point in testing the CYA level frequently. That will just use up your test reagent. Give it a week and then test it.
    19K gal, vinyl, 1/2 HP WhisperFlo pump, 200 sqft cartridge filter, AutoPilot Digital SWG, Dolphin Dynamic cleaning robot
    Creator of PoolMath and Pool Calculator. Other handy links: Support this site, TF Test Kits, Pool School

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    Re: Gearing up for Ascorbic Acid Treatment

    Here's where the pool is today. Do I need to raise the CYA more in order to proceed. I do know I have to lower the Chlorine to 0 and the Ph to 7.2 before starting the ascorbic acid treatment.
    Supplies I have on hand.
    polyquat 60
    Jacks Purple Stuff
    Borax
    Arm & Hammer Washing Soda
    Bleach
    muriatic acid

    FC 5
    CC 0
    TC 5
    TA 70
    Ch 500
    CYA 35
    ph 7.7
    Borates 50
    Water Temp 70 degrees F

    So Im going to lower ph and chlorine and hopefully get stain removal process tomorrow.

    Thanks for all the hand holding, I don't want to goof and make it worse.

    Chris
    17,000 gal., 3 waterfalls
    Cartridge Filter, SWG
    IG
    Plaster
    1 1/2 H.P.

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    JasonLion's Avatar
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    Re: Gearing up for Ascorbic Acid Treatment

    CYA is fine where it is for now. When the whole AA process is complete you might want to bump the CYA level up a little more, but no need to do anything right now.

    With CYA at 35, the FC level should come down on it's own fairly quickly.
    19K gal, vinyl, 1/2 HP WhisperFlo pump, 200 sqft cartridge filter, AutoPilot Digital SWG, Dolphin Dynamic cleaning robot
    Creator of PoolMath and Pool Calculator. Other handy links: Support this site, TF Test Kits, Pool School

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    Re: Gearing up for Ascorbic Acid Treatment

    Yes, just what I wanted to hear. I am just going to lower the ph now wait for the chlorine to drop and then proceed. I will keep posting, just in case I get into trouble.

    Chris
    17,000 gal., 3 waterfalls
    Cartridge Filter, SWG
    IG
    Plaster
    1 1/2 H.P.

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    Re: Gearing up for Ascorbic Acid Treatment

    Well, I lied, I was going to pick up the polyquat 60 this afternoon. So far, none to be found. Not Walmart, Leslies, Lowes. Guess ordering online will be the solution. I am in the SW Houston area, just FYI.
    17,000 gal., 3 waterfalls
    Cartridge Filter, SWG
    IG
    Plaster
    1 1/2 H.P.

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    Re: Gearing up for Ascorbic Acid Treatment

    Nearly any algaecide that is sold in a 60% concentration is actually polyquat. A fair number of the 30% concentration algaecides are as well.

    The active ingredient you are looking for is Poly[oxyethylene(dimethyliminio)ethylene(dimethyliminio)ethylene dichloride].
    19K gal, vinyl, 1/2 HP WhisperFlo pump, 200 sqft cartridge filter, AutoPilot Digital SWG, Dolphin Dynamic cleaning robot
    Creator of PoolMath and Pool Calculator. Other handy links: Support this site, TF Test Kits, Pool School

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    Re: Gearing up for Ascorbic Acid Treatment

    Thanks Jason,
    I did see some 30% I think but I was so fixed on 60%, it didn't register, and I didn't realize it could be a substitute. Anyway, I did find some after going to Home Depot, Lowe's, an independent pool store, and 3 different Leslie's. Unfortunately, it was the last Leslie's, so the pool store did get my money. I did learn that Lowe's is in process of changing So now I have ph7.2 and total chlorine at 5. Just waiting for chlorine to lower to begin getting rid of stains.
    Chris
    17,000 gal., 3 waterfalls
    Cartridge Filter, SWG
    IG
    Plaster
    1 1/2 H.P.

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    Re: Gearing up for Ascorbic Acid Treatment

    Sorry I didn't complete a sentence in last post. Lowe's is changing over to Chlorox brand pool chemicals.
    17,000 gal., 3 waterfalls
    Cartridge Filter, SWG
    IG
    Plaster
    1 1/2 H.P.

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    Re: Gearing up for Ascorbic Acid Treatment

    I am still waiting for the Chlorine to drop, it is about 3-4, maybe tomorrow it will go down more. Also the ph continues to drift upwards, it is 7.5 this morning. I am not sure what to do, continue to add muriatic acid and wait for chlorine to drop, or just leave ph alone till chlorine drops and then lower the ph. I cannot wait to see the stains disappear.
    Chris
    17,000 gal., 3 waterfalls
    Cartridge Filter, SWG
    IG
    Plaster
    1 1/2 H.P.

  13. Back To Top    #13

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    Re: Gearing up for Ascorbic Acid Treatment

    So the chlorine this morning was about 2 and the ph 7.5. So I lowered ph to 7.0, waited an hour with pump and waterfalls on. Then I added the ascorbic acid around 1 1/2 pounds around the edge of the pool. Set timer for 1/2 hour came out and the pool was looking pretty good. My stains were a light yellow brown all over the sides and bottom, and now I could see white with drifts of yellow brown. I added another 1/2 pound of ascorbic acid and took the dog on a walk. Now most of the stains are all gone, enough that I have to really look to find them. Added a bit more AA and the polyquat 60%. I letting the water circulate for another half hour, and then will add the Jack's Purple Stuff. For everyone that contributed to the knowledge on this forum, a huge thank you, Mbar in particular, and yes I read every comment on the entire thread, and to Jason for the hand holding as I got up my courage to do chemistry. I did expect it to work considering all the knowledge that is so freely shared, I am delighted with my sparkling white pool!
    17,000 gal., 3 waterfalls
    Cartridge Filter, SWG
    IG
    Plaster
    1 1/2 H.P.

  14. Back To Top    #14
    JasonLion's Avatar
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    Re: Gearing up for Ascorbic Acid Treatment

    19K gal, vinyl, 1/2 HP WhisperFlo pump, 200 sqft cartridge filter, AutoPilot Digital SWG, Dolphin Dynamic cleaning robot
    Creator of PoolMath and Pool Calculator. Other handy links: Support this site, TF Test Kits, Pool School

  15. Back To Top    #15

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    Re: Gearing up for Ascorbic Acid Treatment

    My pool is looking very white and sparkling. I tested the pool water this morning. Here are my results:

    Chlorine 0
    Ph 7.3, color was more orange than 7.5 and less pink than 7.2
    TA 40
    CYA 30

    According to mbar post on Ascorbic Acid Treatment,

    "Bring up your ph and alkalinity, - use arm and hammer washing soda first, it will raise both ph and alk."

    Since my ph is 7.3 wouldn't the Arm and Hammer washing soda raise my ph?
    Should I add muriatic acid to reduce the ph first, and if so how low? 6.8, 7.0?

    I am getting confused here and my better half just wants me to turn on the SWG, and I want to finish this out correctly.
    Chris
    17,000 gal., 3 waterfalls
    Cartridge Filter, SWG
    IG
    Plaster
    1 1/2 H.P.

  16. Back To Top    #16
    JasonLion's Avatar
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    Re: Gearing up for Ascorbic Acid Treatment

    Your PH is higher than was assumed in those directions. The directions were assuming that the PH would be down around 6.8. It is fine to use some baking soda to raise TA up to about 60. That will take care of doing what was intended by that step.
    19K gal, vinyl, 1/2 HP WhisperFlo pump, 200 sqft cartridge filter, AutoPilot Digital SWG, Dolphin Dynamic cleaning robot
    Creator of PoolMath and Pool Calculator. Other handy links: Support this site, TF Test Kits, Pool School

  17. Back To Top    #17

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    Re: Gearing up for Ascorbic Acid Treatment

    Thanks Jason,
    Added the baking soda per instruction and poolmath calculator.
    I'll check water in a bit before preceding.
    Chris
    17,000 gal., 3 waterfalls
    Cartridge Filter, SWG
    IG
    Plaster
    1 1/2 H.P.

  18. Back To Top    #18

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    Re: Gearing up for Ascorbic Acid Treatment

    Reporting in. Test results:

    FC 0.5
    CC 0
    TC 0.5
    TA 70
    Ch 500
    CYA 40
    ph 7.2
    Borates 50
    Water Temp 78 degrees F

    So do I just keep adding bleach slowly. The pool calculator CSI indicates scaling or potential for scaling. Should I be making other adjustments, if so what and in what order? Thanks in advance, Jason.
    Chris
    17,000 gal., 3 waterfalls
    Cartridge Filter, SWG
    IG
    Plaster
    1 1/2 H.P.

  19. Back To Top    #19
    JasonLion's Avatar
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    Re: Gearing up for Ascorbic Acid Treatment

    Keep adding chlorine slowly, trying to bring the FC level up by 1 ppm per day (1 ppm higher than the target for yesterday), until you reach your normal FC target.

    CSI shouldn't be an issue as long as PH stays fairly low.
    19K gal, vinyl, 1/2 HP WhisperFlo pump, 200 sqft cartridge filter, AutoPilot Digital SWG, Dolphin Dynamic cleaning robot
    Creator of PoolMath and Pool Calculator. Other handy links: Support this site, TF Test Kits, Pool School

  20. Back To Top    #20

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    Re: Gearing up for Ascorbic Acid Treatment

    Ok, I have the chlorine up to 1 maybe. However, the ph is now 7.3. Should I ignore it till morning or should I add MA now. I am running the pump all night, the SWG is OFF.
    17,000 gal., 3 waterfalls
    Cartridge Filter, SWG
    IG
    Plaster
    1 1/2 H.P.

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