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Thread: skimmer placement & light placement 40 x 12 pool with baja-phx

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    skimmer placement & light placement 40 x 12 pool with baja-phx

    it's time for me to okay the CAD for the pb to move ahead with permitting. my neighbor told me to keep the skimmer away from the baja step where the pb drew the placement of the skimmer. she said she hates to be near the skimmer in her pool and avoids it, so with the roaches, scorpians and debree that end up in the skimmer, I'd want the skimmer on the opposite end of the baja step. this pool will be coping only accept for the east side of the pool, which will have a small deck area, about 10 feet by 10 feet of deck. originally i wanted to have the coping detached from all decking so the look will be a coping only pool. i was told that i have to have a bump out for the skimmer, automatic fill, and the in-floor valve because the skimmer is one unit. the skimmer they recommend isn't extendable with a piece of pvc like i imagined. the pool equipment will be about 30 feet south of the pool. so, dollarwise it makes sense to keep the skimmer on the south side of the pool, as close to the east side and i can imagine it's more efficient as well? the baja step is in the southeast corner.

    i read this article http://arizonaswimmingpoolmaintenanc...d-skimmer.html that encouraged 2 skimmers and having one for sure on the east side of the pool due to putting it in the direction the wind blows. that makes sense to me, is the least $ place for me to place it but that is where the baja shelf is so i understand my friend's point of view also.

    should i be asking the pb for 2 skimmers and any suggestions on what to do about this issue? 2 skimmer or 1? my baja will be 4 feet wide (by 10 feet the length of the pool which is east/west), so if i place the skimmer on the east side, closer to the north side of the pool that is my 8 foot lap lane. will that seem far enough from the baja step? i was also going for a coping only pool which if i place the skimmer in that position messes that up but i can give that up if it's the best place for the skimmer. they said i have to have a bumpout with the skimmer they recommend. i was going to have a small deck area there just detaches with some river rock in between the coping and the deck, but if it's most efficient to put the skimmer there and it's not too close to the baja, along with the cost savings, i can make the design difference. my neighbor's thought was that i don't want the skimmer, automatic fill, in floor valve, all of that in the most heavy traffic area if i can help it. good thing is that they use travertine covers so it would't even be that noticable accept for having to change the coping only design.

    pb said the other option is to use 2 spa skimmers when i was trying to keep the skimmers in the 16" coping but they did not recommend it.

    i've never owned a pool. any suggestions appreciated!
    40' x 12' IG shotcrete (3 1/2' 5, 4'), Hayward variable spd pumpSP3400VSP, Paramount PV3 in-floor, venturi skimmer, 14,400 glns, Hayward Turbo salt cell T Cell-15, UV, Hayward DE filter, model DE4820, 2 Hayward Color Logic 320 LED color lights, Hayward P4 w puck. 2" line to in-floor valve (46'), deck mount canister parascoping fountain, leaf canister, Marbella, pebble. new build 6-24-15

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    Re: skimmer placement in phx on a 40 x 12 rectangle pool-wind, scorpian, design facto

    The best location for a skimmer is so the prevailing winds blow toward it. If you could post a picture of the proposed pool layout and your yard that may give us a better idea how to address your situation.
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    Re: skimmer placement in phx on a 40 x 12 rectangle pool-wind, scorpian, design facto

    I don't think one skimmer is enough for a pool that size. But, to have any chance of one skimmer keeping your pool surface clean it has to be downwind. You can put it on the side of the downwind area, you just need to point the pool returns correctly for clockwise or counterclockwise water circulation to help the flow. Post a pic of the layout and we can help with that.
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    Re: skimmer placement in phx on a 40 x 12 rectangle pool-wind, scorpian, design facto

    40' x 12' IG shotcrete (3 1/2' 5, 4'), Hayward variable spd pumpSP3400VSP, Paramount PV3 in-floor, venturi skimmer, 14,400 glns, Hayward Turbo salt cell T Cell-15, UV, Hayward DE filter, model DE4820, 2 Hayward Color Logic 320 LED color lights, Hayward P4 w puck. 2" line to in-floor valve (46'), deck mount canister parascoping fountain, leaf canister, Marbella, pebble. new build 6-24-15

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    Re: skimmer placement in phx on a 40 x 12 rectangle pool-wind, scorpian, design facto

    cad page 2.jpg
    also, any suggestions on:
    1. Baja shelf depth with a telescoping bubbler (we have boys so I may check into a non telescoping bubbler as well
    2. lighting (I don't think the lights will hit the stairs or Baja step where they are placed but I didn't want to swim into the light in the laplane or have the lights facing the house, so seems that was our only option. will I regret not getting a light near the stairs? prob another $500.
    3. comments on equipment location. seems the pad would be much smaller than the others I saw. I want the noise as far away as possible. this was cheaper than the other side of the house which was more ideal, but once we start moving the skimmer... around that will effect the price of where the equipment goes. we're putting it on our busiest side of the house cuz at the time he said it'd save us $1k and best efficiency there. that is the east side, which is where the wind blows, but the Baja is there, too.

    thx much!!!
    40' x 12' IG shotcrete (3 1/2' 5, 4'), Hayward variable spd pumpSP3400VSP, Paramount PV3 in-floor, venturi skimmer, 14,400 glns, Hayward Turbo salt cell T Cell-15, UV, Hayward DE filter, model DE4820, 2 Hayward Color Logic 320 LED color lights, Hayward P4 w puck. 2" line to in-floor valve (46'), deck mount canister parascoping fountain, leaf canister, Marbella, pebble. new build 6-24-15

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    Re: skimmer placement in phx on a 40 x 12 rectangle pool-wind, scorpian, design facto

    You could move the skimmer to the wall opposite of the shelf a few feet from the end wall. Then set the water rotation clockwise and it will carry the debris down the pool and into the skimmer. Lights are usually mounted below the depth of a sunshelf and won't normally light it anyway.
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    Re: skimmer placement in phx on a 40 x 12 rectangle pool-wind, scorpian, design facto

    Although, the skimmer would work better where it is located now. Regarding the comment about skimmers being scary places. That can be somewhat true, we live out in the boonies and I've fished snakes, spiders, frogs, varmints and lots of bugs out of my pool and skimmers. This is not the case while swimming. First thing everyone does before swimming is empty the skimmer baskets, so you will know that there isn't anything hiding in there while you are swimming.
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    Re: skimmer placement in phx on a 40 x 12 rectangle pool-wind, scorpian, design facto

    pooldv, would u say I'd be fine with the one skimmer? if i had 2, where would I place the 2d? i have a feeling the pb will say one is enough. if i wanted to keep the coping only vision that I had, that would mean that the and keeping the skimmer where it's at in the CAD (if PL stands for skimmer). what would i probably see happening? debris ending up in the corner near the baja? the pb said i could put it anywhere i want. i can envision that it would take longer to get everything to the skimmer.
    good idea to empty the skimmer before getting in the pool!

    u mentioned setting the water rotation to go clockwise. is this something i'd need to have the pb set up ahead of time or something that I can handle manually?

    i see 3 valves/bump outs but i thought they mentioned four to me. one is the skimmer, one is the automatic filler, and one is an in-floor valve. all underground, what i was told and all will be covered by a travertine cover. would it make sense to have them all in the same area or is it best to have them in different locations like the pb has them?

    as far as lighting up the baja and steps, is my best solution to put a light on the east side of the pool right over the stairs and the baja? i haven't decided the depth of the baja yet. if i go first step would a light even light it up or do they have to put the light too far under the water in order for it to work?

    has anyone ever regretted not having light on their baja and steps? not sure how often we'd swim with the lights on, but it almost seems it'd be harder to see the steps with the light on only in the rest of the pool.

    the CAD seems light on details. i'm going to ask the pb to make lots of notes with more details like that they r installing the pv3 paramount in-floor (not normally what they install so i don't want a mistake). is it normal to not have the in-floor drawing on the CAD? anything else the CAD seems to be missing?

    thanku!!!
    40' x 12' IG shotcrete (3 1/2' 5, 4'), Hayward variable spd pumpSP3400VSP, Paramount PV3 in-floor, venturi skimmer, 14,400 glns, Hayward Turbo salt cell T Cell-15, UV, Hayward DE filter, model DE4820, 2 Hayward Color Logic 320 LED color lights, Hayward P4 w puck. 2" line to in-floor valve (46'), deck mount canister parascoping fountain, leaf canister, Marbella, pebble. new build 6-24-15

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    Re: skimmer placement in phx on a 40 x 12 rectangle pool-wind, scorpian, design facto

    Our light is on the shelf pointing out into the pool and away from the steps. It is fine for us, there is enough reflected light in the pool to see.

    Pool circulation is done after it is built, it is simply a matter of pointing all the eyeballs on the pool returns in the same direction. If you were going to add another skimmer it should be in one of the opposite corners on the other side of the pool. Whichever corner is opposite of the prevailing wind. For us, winter wind blows from the northwest and summer wind blows from the southwest. You want to place skimmers such that wind helps you the most with pool skimming.
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    Re: skimmer placement in phx on a 40 x 12 rectangle pool-wind, scorpian, design facto

    to make sure i'm clear: 2 skimmers preferred, one skimmer a few feet from the wall where the baja step is (east side of the pool) on the narrow wall and could the 2d skimmer be anywhere on the other end of the pool, on the short or long wall?

    do u think if i place the light on the east side of our pool where the stairs and baja shelf is, would it light up the whole pool or should i stick with what i have chosen at this point? (or a different options). the pb originally wanted to sell us one specific hayward color logic (i think the 4.0 LED) and it didn't get good reviews on amazon. the pb said that's prob cuz people were buying it on amazon and putting it in old pools themselves, but they have great reviews with their customers. i got them to put the 2 less $ lights (color logic 320s) on the long end of the pool pointing across the narrow part of the pool (as shown in the CAD I uploaded here) so that the light wouldn't be in our eyes when swimming or sitting on the opposite end of the pool. a neighbor told me the light should go on the narrow end, to light up the long side, like the pb said, but i read another post or 2 about not putting the light in the end of the swim lane, which makes sense, especially since LEDs r known to not be good to look into. any other tips on this would be great as well. thx!!
    40' x 12' IG shotcrete (3 1/2' 5, 4'), Hayward variable spd pumpSP3400VSP, Paramount PV3 in-floor, venturi skimmer, 14,400 glns, Hayward Turbo salt cell T Cell-15, UV, Hayward DE filter, model DE4820, 2 Hayward Color Logic 320 LED color lights, Hayward P4 w puck. 2" line to in-floor valve (46'), deck mount canister parascoping fountain, leaf canister, Marbella, pebble. new build 6-24-15

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    Re: skimmer placement in phx on a 40 x 12 rectangle pool-wind, scorpian, design facto

    Quote Originally Posted by outdoorsgal View Post
    to make sure i'm clear: 2 skimmers preferred, one skimmer a few feet from the wall where the baja step is (east side of the pool) on the narrow wall and could the 2d skimmer be anywhere on the other end of the pool, on the short or long wall?
    Yes, to all of those questions. If you are going with one skimmer I would leave it as it is on the drawing. Anywhere on the other end is fine, best spot is probably opposite the other one, house side of short wall.

    I like the lights as drawn. Mostly because they face away from the house and seating areas. The light should reflect off the opposite wall enough to light the steps. No experience with LED lights. But, I do not think an LED light could light across 40'. Our 500w incandescent light barely reaches 35'.
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    Re: skimmer placement & light placement 40 x 12 pool with baja-phx

    thanku very much, pooldv!
    40' x 12' IG shotcrete (3 1/2' 5, 4'), Hayward variable spd pumpSP3400VSP, Paramount PV3 in-floor, venturi skimmer, 14,400 glns, Hayward Turbo salt cell T Cell-15, UV, Hayward DE filter, model DE4820, 2 Hayward Color Logic 320 LED color lights, Hayward P4 w puck. 2" line to in-floor valve (46'), deck mount canister parascoping fountain, leaf canister, Marbella, pebble. new build 6-24-15

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    Re: skimmer placement & light placement 40 x 12 pool with baja-phx

    I think the 2nd skimmer is a good idea for redundancy. If one skimmer is full, the pump can still bring water from the pool using the other one. Now this is not to say that a 2nd skimmer allows you to be lazy and not clean them out. Just that the 2nd one allows you to still have good circulation, in case overnight it fills with lets say a critter.

    As far as the LED lights go, I have never heard of them being more dangerous to look at than a regular light. These are LEDs, not lasers. I was worried about 1 500w halogen not being enough light, but as it turns out, no one likes to swim with the light on at all. As for safety lights, rather than using the pool light to light the way, add some small accent lighting around the pool to help with this. One tip that I love to share from my PB, is that if you have lighting around the outside of your pool, replace the normal light with a blue light (normal bulb with a blue cover). The blue lighting is much softer, attracts far fewer bugs, and has a much better ambiance at the pool.
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    Re: skimmer placement & light placement 40 x 12 pool with baja-phx

    thx much, Yev!
    40' x 12' IG shotcrete (3 1/2' 5, 4'), Hayward variable spd pumpSP3400VSP, Paramount PV3 in-floor, venturi skimmer, 14,400 glns, Hayward Turbo salt cell T Cell-15, UV, Hayward DE filter, model DE4820, 2 Hayward Color Logic 320 LED color lights, Hayward P4 w puck. 2" line to in-floor valve (46'), deck mount canister parascoping fountain, leaf canister, Marbella, pebble. new build 6-24-15

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    Re: skimmer placement & light placement 40 x 12 pool with baja-phx

    prevailing wind is tricky. we have a 28x12 rectangle in AZ. Baja on the west end of the pool, skimmer near the NE corner. In the winter the wind blows west to east, but for three solid months of monsoon, it blows from the SE to the West. We have wall returns with rotating heads, so I have the three at the far end (Baja) shooting pretty much sideways, all moving water counter clockwise. The venture skimmer works fine, it's more "can I get the surface of the water moving". After a big storm I'll adjust the return valve to pull more from the skimmer, or if I need to brush, pull more from the floor.

    But the wind will get you at some point of the year either way.
    10,500 gal IG, Topaz Pebble, auto-level
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    Water sheer, 2 wok pots, bubbler stem on the baja step
    ColorLogic Mutlicolor LED lamp. Taylor 2006+speed stir

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    Re: skimmer placement & light placement 40 x 12 pool with baja-phx

    BuckeyeChris. thx much for the info! on a nother note, i see u used calpools and so have a lot of the same, or similar stuff in your pool. is there anything u'd have done differently that u'd be able to share? i'm about to sign the approval of the CAD. thx!
    40' x 12' IG shotcrete (3 1/2' 5, 4'), Hayward variable spd pumpSP3400VSP, Paramount PV3 in-floor, venturi skimmer, 14,400 glns, Hayward Turbo salt cell T Cell-15, UV, Hayward DE filter, model DE4820, 2 Hayward Color Logic 320 LED color lights, Hayward P4 w puck. 2" line to in-floor valve (46'), deck mount canister parascoping fountain, leaf canister, Marbella, pebble. new build 6-24-15

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    Re: skimmer placement & light placement 40 x 12 pool with baja-phx

    besides not go with cal pools? heh. By now you've looked at the salesperson's computer rendering of what your pool will look like in your yard, and maybe you've seen the itemized equipment and stone/tile pricing list for your project, but you must demand to see the final actual architectural drawing that the super is going to use, and distribute to the subs. None of the subs give a lick about your rendering, or what you thought you were buying. They "are just going by the plans". double check all the actual measurements on the engineering drawing. For instance, the spill pot pillars on our pool were not spaced evenly on the plans. and the stem for the Baja fountain was not centered on the step like we had asked. Point out anything which is not exactly how you wanted it, and get the plan updated and finalized before any sub show up to start doing anything. Even something simple like "the two floor jets and main drain are not in a straight line" and "the three steps into the pool are not the same depth" kind of brainless items.

    equipment-wise....we'd probably skip the sheer fountain. It's way too loud to be relaxing. and we got glass tiles on that sheer fountain wall, and in the summer the glass tiles crack due to the heat of the sun, then the cooler water, etc. But nobody mentioned it when we designed the pool.
    10,500 gal IG, Topaz Pebble, auto-level
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    Water sheer, 2 wok pots, bubbler stem on the baja step
    ColorLogic Mutlicolor LED lamp. Taylor 2006+speed stir

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    Re: skimmer placement & light placement 40 x 12 pool with baja-phx

    It's interesting that you have a telescoping fountain. We specifically asked for one, multiple times, for the Baja. After everything is plumbed, we realize we're just getting a PVC pipe with a eyelet thing on the end. Both the designer and the super say "oh we don't install those. Once they break you have to dig up the pebble and gunite just to replace them. We just won't do it."

    oh! and if possible, try not to have the filter drain plug facing right into the foundation of the house.

    also: Not sure what water features you're getting, but the completely round wireless remote is only good for a few things. We ended up with four automated valves and had to upgrade to the remote with the small display to control everything.

    Our travertine coping is fine. The travertine decking was "filled" but that filling is coming out after one year.
    10,500 gal IG, Topaz Pebble, auto-level
    Hayward DE filter, 2HP Ecostar VSP, ProLogic PS-4, GVA actuators
    Cal Pools Wave Force Plus (wall return jets plus 2 floor pop-ups), Venturi Skimmer
    Water sheer, 2 wok pots, bubbler stem on the baja step
    ColorLogic Mutlicolor LED lamp. Taylor 2006+speed stir

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