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Thread: Emptied and refilled pool. How best to get water balanced?

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    Emptied and refilled pool. How best to get water balanced?

    Hoping this is the correct thread.

    We have been having a very tough time in the last year and a half getting the algae under control in our pool. Nothing I did seemed to keep it at bay. Turns out after I took apart and cleaned the filter elements, I put everything back together and our main pump would prime for 30 seconds and trip the breaker and it sounded like the motor was going out. So, after two weeks of waiting ( meanwhile dumping gallons of Cl in the pool ); Finally got the pump replaced with a new Hayward Ecostar VS.

    I could see the algae clinging for dear life to our pebble sheen surface. So I drained the pool and pressure washed the surface of the pool. Glad I did - it was absolutely disgusting. Anyhow. Filled the pool. Starting from ground zero.

    I have the TF-100 kit. Here are my numbers:

    FC: ZERO ( obviously )
    CC: 0.5
    Ca Hardness: 50ppm
    TA: 40
    CYA: ZERO
    pH: 8.2+

    I checked the recommended numbers in this forum - so I have those - and I used the pool chem calc...

    So now what do I do FIRST?

    Can I just follow the pool calc recommendations... and stagger the addition of the chemicals?

    Assistance is appreciated.

    Thanks.
    Pool built by Pools by Nelson / Hayward TriStar single speed 1.5hp pump for sheer descent / Hayward Ecostar VS for main pump / Hayward 400k Natural Gas Heater / Hayward four cartridge vertical standing filter / PebbleSheen pool surface with concrete deck, spa spill over into pool / TF-100 test kit / Approx: 23200 gallons

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    Charlie_R's Avatar
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    Re: Emptied and refilled pool. How best to get water balanced?

    Chlorine and pH first. Get those under control, then start on the CYA.
    15'x48" 4500 gallon Intex pool, buried 1.5 ft. Pac-Fab Dynamo 3/4 hp pump. Hayward S180T sand filter, bought used. Taylor K-2006 test kit. Rocket mass heater based wood fired pool heater.

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    Patrick_B's Avatar
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    Re: Emptied and refilled pool. How best to get water balanced?

    I'd like to double check some numbers. It's a bit suspect to have the 8.2 + pH with a 40 TA. CH is low and unusually soft for your part of the country (CA) as best I recall. Do you remember having soft, low alkaline fill water? I hate asking you to re run the tests but I think it's warranted. Just do pH, TA, and CH. Make sure to use a 25ml sample size.

    Do you have Muriatic Acid, Bleach, and CYA on hand and ready?
    TFP Moderator
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    JasonLion's Avatar
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    Re: Emptied and refilled pool. How best to get water balanced?

    For order:

    Adjust the PH down first. Start adding CYA. Adjust TA to the low end of the normal range. Start raising CH, however, only go only about 1/3 of the way on the CH at first and wait for the rest of the CH till everything else is stable.

    Add 2 ppm of chlorine each evening until 24 hours after you add CYA. Then switch to targeting an appropriate FC level for your CYA level.
    19K gal, vinyl, 1/2 HP WhisperFlo pump, 200 sqft cartridge filter, AutoPilot Digital SWG, Dolphin Dynamic cleaning robot
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    Patrick_B's Avatar
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    Re: Emptied and refilled pool. How best to get water balanced?

    I searched up Modesto Water, and your numbers may not be out of line based on the variances I saw. Follow Jasons advice first, then post a new set.
    TFP Moderator
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    Just did a complete drain, scrub, and refill

    I too just did a complete drain, scrub, and refill and here are my initial results using the TF 100 kit.

    chlorine: 0
    CC: 0.5
    Ca Hardness: 50ppm
    TA: 40
    CYA: 0
    pH: 8.2+

    I have been using generic chlorine from grocery store. After refill I put in 2 gal of chlorine on Friday, 2 on Sat and two more today... Chlorine level today is still zero. Will test again. Not sure how much chlorine to add. According to the pool calculator I should add 196 oz -- I have far exceeded this qty. What am I doing wrong?
    Pool built by Pools by Nelson / Hayward TriStar single speed 1.5hp pump for sheer descent / Hayward Ecostar VS for main pump / Hayward 400k Natural Gas Heater / Hayward four cartridge vertical standing filter / PebbleSheen pool surface with concrete deck, spa spill over into pool / TF-100 test kit / Approx: 23200 gallons

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    Re: Emptied and refilled pool. How best to get water balanced?

    Will do complete test again. I followed the directions in the box of the test kit. I don't recall it suggesting I use a 25ml water sample... if so how much of the reagents should I be using with the 25ml?

    I went through and added the numbers into the pool calc and for starters it said add 143 oz of chlorine ( I have generic grocery store chlorine - 8.5% IIRC )... I added 2 gal on Friday, retested on Sat ( Chlorine still zero ), added 2 on sat, then tested on Sun and added 2 more gallons ... will test in a few hours....

    I have muriatic acid on hand.

    Based on my initial numbers the following is what the pool calc recommended - question--- do the numbers seem right? Can the calc be followed? As of now - the Chlorine qty recommended- I have exceeded at this point - so I am questioning the numbers given.

    143 oz of chlorine
    18oz muriatic acid
    324 oz by weight of baking soda
    715oz by weight CaCl
    123 oz by weight CYA

    Do these seem out of line? Did I input the original numbers incorrectly. I won't be able to get the above in the pool until wednesday. However, I do have chlorine on hand and muriatic acid.

    Where is the best place to get CYA and CaCl and baking soda?

    Thanks in advance.
    Pool built by Pools by Nelson / Hayward TriStar single speed 1.5hp pump for sheer descent / Hayward Ecostar VS for main pump / Hayward 400k Natural Gas Heater / Hayward four cartridge vertical standing filter / PebbleSheen pool surface with concrete deck, spa spill over into pool / TF-100 test kit / Approx: 23200 gallons

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    Re: Emptied and refilled pool. How best to get water balanced?

    Note: I am totally 'new' to the TFP way. I was reliant upon Leslies until I found this forum last late summer. So this is all very new to me. So any and all help is appreciated.

    As requested I re-ran the TF-100 test as per the enclosed directions - here are the numbers -- note: I added two gallons of Chlorine about 1.5 hours ago. As my initial Chlorine test showed ZERO before I added the two gallons.

    Chlorine ( from the blue box ): 5+
    pH ( blue box ): 8.2+
    FC: 8 ppm
    CC: 0.5
    TC: 8 + 0.5 = 8.5
    Ca Hardness: 75 ppm
    TA: 50
    CYA: WATER TOTALLY CLEAR ( FILLED TUBE )

    So... now what ? And how do I do it...

    Thanks in advance.
    Pool built by Pools by Nelson / Hayward TriStar single speed 1.5hp pump for sheer descent / Hayward Ecostar VS for main pump / Hayward 400k Natural Gas Heater / Hayward four cartridge vertical standing filter / PebbleSheen pool surface with concrete deck, spa spill over into pool / TF-100 test kit / Approx: 23200 gallons

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    Re: Emptied and refilled pool. How best to get water balanced?

    CYA=balancer or stabilizer You can buy it at walmart or any big box store like Lowes or Home Depot. The pool store will have it but I have no idea how their costs run compared to Walmart.

    baking soda-you can get a BIG bag of it at Walmart also! Sams has it as well.

    I am not sure what the other one is so cannot say.......

    I would get your PH down with the Muratic Acid.
    -test PH
    -Use Pool Math to find out how much to add
    -let pump run for 30 mins.
    -retest

    Redo the above until your PH hits 7.5 or so.

    CYA-Use pool math to see how much you will need to get you to 30.

    Add enough to get you there using this method
    -put CYA in a tube sock leaving enough room to tie something (rope, bungee cord) around it
    -hand it into the pool in front of your return
    -give it a squeeze as you think about it to speed it up. I will tell you that I just squeezed my sock until it was all dissolved
    -do NOT test for a week. It takes that long to show up on the test.

    I have you going a little low on the CYA as it is easier to put more in than taking it out (draining water)

    I would do a SLAM on your pool for a few days just to be on the safe side in case you missed a tiny piece of algae.

    Good luck!

    Pool math link:

    http://www.troublefreepool.com/calc.html

    SLAM link:

    http://www.troublefreepool.com/conte...tain-shockingl


    Kim
    TFP Moderator 33x52 round AG 25,600 gals Sand Filter 1.5hp Pump - 2 Speed, SLAM, Pool School, Recommended Levels, Recommended Chemicals, Pool Math, Chlorine/CYA Chart, TF-100 Test Kit

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    Re: Just did a complete drain, scrub, and refill

    Because your CYA is zero, you will lose all of your chlorine to sunlight each day.

    Start by lowering the PH to around 7.2 to 7.4.

    Then start raising the CYA level to around 30 to 40.

    This evening add 2 ppm of chlorine. Then starting 24 hours after you start adding CYA, start targeting the correct FC level for your target CYA level.

    Once things settle down a little you can fine tune the remaining numbers.
    19K gal, vinyl, 1/2 HP WhisperFlo pump, 200 sqft cartridge filter, AutoPilot Digital SWG, Dolphin Dynamic cleaning robot
    Creator of PoolMath and Pool Calculator. Other handy links: Support this site, TF Test Kits, Pool School

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    JasonLion's Avatar
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    Re: Emptied and refilled pool. How best to get water balanced?

    You didn't say what kind of pool surface you have. Calcium is most important for plaster, not needed at all for vinyl. Deal with calcium last, if it is needed at all.

    Raise TA to around 70, but only after the PH is adjusted and TA retested.
    19K gal, vinyl, 1/2 HP WhisperFlo pump, 200 sqft cartridge filter, AutoPilot Digital SWG, Dolphin Dynamic cleaning robot
    Creator of PoolMath and Pool Calculator. Other handy links: Support this site, TF Test Kits, Pool School

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    Re: Emptied and refilled pool. How best to get water balanced?

    Pebble Sheen surface.
    Pool built by Pools by Nelson / Hayward TriStar single speed 1.5hp pump for sheer descent / Hayward Ecostar VS for main pump / Hayward 400k Natural Gas Heater / Hayward four cartridge vertical standing filter / PebbleSheen pool surface with concrete deck, spa spill over into pool / TF-100 test kit / Approx: 23200 gallons

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    Re: Emptied and refilled pool. How best to get water balanced?

    Looks like my pH is decreasing on its own - 7.8 now. pool calc said to add 15oz.
    Pool built by Pools by Nelson / Hayward TriStar single speed 1.5hp pump for sheer descent / Hayward Ecostar VS for main pump / Hayward 400k Natural Gas Heater / Hayward four cartridge vertical standing filter / PebbleSheen pool surface with concrete deck, spa spill over into pool / TF-100 test kit / Approx: 23200 gallons

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    JasonLion's Avatar
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    Re: Emptied and refilled pool. How best to get water balanced?

    Pebble Sheen gets treated as a plaster surface, because there is plaster between the pebbles. So you do want to add calcium as soon as everything else settles down. When adding calcium it is best to break the addition up into two or three steps, rather than adding it all at once.
    19K gal, vinyl, 1/2 HP WhisperFlo pump, 200 sqft cartridge filter, AutoPilot Digital SWG, Dolphin Dynamic cleaning robot
    Creator of PoolMath and Pool Calculator. Other handy links: Support this site, TF Test Kits, Pool School

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    Re: Emptied and refilled pool. How best to get water balanced?

    Thanks.

    I retested again today.

    pH 7.2
    Clorine 1
    Bromine 2

    FC 2 ppm
    CH 50 ppm
    TA 40
    CA - zero
    CC - zero

    I ran the numbers through pool calc - it says to add the following - what I need to know is in what order and how long do I wait between what I am adding... these numbers are by volume not by weight - see volumes below:

    72 oz bleach
    17 oz soda ash
    259 oz baking soda
    571 oz CaCl
    128 oz Stabilizer CYA


    So in what order, and how fast do I add the materials ( do I dump in the large volumes all at once around the pool ? ) etc... and how long do I wait in between each... minutes, hours, days... etc...

    Thanks in advance.
    Pool built by Pools by Nelson / Hayward TriStar single speed 1.5hp pump for sheer descent / Hayward Ecostar VS for main pump / Hayward 400k Natural Gas Heater / Hayward four cartridge vertical standing filter / PebbleSheen pool surface with concrete deck, spa spill over into pool / TF-100 test kit / Approx: 23200 gallons

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    Re: Emptied and refilled pool. How best to get water balanced?

    Wingman,

    This is gonna' sound like a scold but it is only intended to help.

    Your pH will not decrease from 8+ to 7.2 in a couple of days. You have a testing error unless you added acid without telling us.

    Your TA test is just a bit suspect. Did you continue to add drops until there is absolutely no further color change?

    That's what we'll need to adjust first so respond and we'll get started.

    read "The ABC's of Pool Water Chemistry" up in Pool School. It will be a big help to you.
    Dave S.
    42k vinyl and concrete pool, 1.5hp pump, 140gpm filter
    TFTestkits , PoolMath , Pool School

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    How to distribute CYA

    I added about 5lb into socks into skimmer. Starting from ground zero with my refill. Hoping my cya will increase so I can stop adding CL every day.
    Pool built by Pools by Nelson / Hayward TriStar single speed 1.5hp pump for sheer descent / Hayward Ecostar VS for main pump / Hayward 400k Natural Gas Heater / Hayward four cartridge vertical standing filter / PebbleSheen pool surface with concrete deck, spa spill over into pool / TF-100 test kit / Approx: 23200 gallons

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    Re: how to distribute CYA "conditioner"?

    I guess i went the expensive way and just bought the liquid cya...and it was kind of expensive now that i recall - but thats when i didnt know jack, and the pool store told me what i needed. doh!
    12000g pool + 1000g spa. Jandy 2.0hp epump + separate Jandy pump for Sheer Descent. Jandy CV Cartridge Filter. Jandy Lxi gas heater. Tropical Breeze PebbleTec. Aqualink. Aquapure SWG. Nature 2. The Pool Cleaner 2x. Taylor K-2005.

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    Re: Emptied and refilled pool. How best to get water balanced?

    added CYA - about 5 lbs into socks - into skimmer today - now my pH is 6.8 - approx.

    adding soda ash and baking soda tonight - will see how it goes.
    Pool built by Pools by Nelson / Hayward TriStar single speed 1.5hp pump for sheer descent / Hayward Ecostar VS for main pump / Hayward 400k Natural Gas Heater / Hayward four cartridge vertical standing filter / PebbleSheen pool surface with concrete deck, spa spill over into pool / TF-100 test kit / Approx: 23200 gallons

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    Re: Emptied and refilled pool. How best to get water balanced?

    Yes - read the ABCs - no offense taken.

    Thus far I have done the following based on the TF-100 test results that have remained relatively consistent through several days of testing:

    Yes - added 15 oz of Muriatic acid - mentioned above - sorry it wasn't clear.
    Added in baking soda and ash tonight - I assume I can add one then the other. Added approx 20lb of Baking Soda ( pool calc says to add 324oz - I added a bit less ).
    Added 19 oz soda washing soda - per pool calc
    Added approx 5.5lb stabilizer to get cya to approx 30 -

    I tested the water with the TF-100 on more than one occasion over the last several days - TA has remained unchanged as of right now.

    Will leave pump run overnight will retest on thursday with tf-100
    Pool built by Pools by Nelson / Hayward TriStar single speed 1.5hp pump for sheer descent / Hayward Ecostar VS for main pump / Hayward 400k Natural Gas Heater / Hayward four cartridge vertical standing filter / PebbleSheen pool surface with concrete deck, spa spill over into pool / TF-100 test kit / Approx: 23200 gallons

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