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Thread: Raypaks internet policy

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    Raypaks internet policy

    I am shopping online for pool heater, and pretty much decided on the raypak 400k btu unit, until I read the internet sales policy. While they do not come right out and say your warranty will be void if you purchase online, they certainly hint at it and are openly opposed to an internet retail sale. They say "An internet purchase can affect your warranty." Check this out at http://www.raypak.com/Support/Internet%20Sales%20Policy. What do you folks think? Do I buy it anyway and hope for the best? Is this just a lame attempt to support their retail outlets or do they refuse to support products sold online? Should I worry about spending $2k and wind up with an unsupported product? When you get right down to it whats the difference, if I bought it from a local retailer, they would just order it online themselves and tack on quite a few dollars and have the unit delivered to my home. Are other manufacturers like this? Thanks for letting me rant as bit. (Yes, I am having a licensed plumber bring the gas line over and install the unit)

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    Divin Dave's Avatar
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    Re: Raypaks internet policy

    This is not entirely uncommon. There are other manufacturers in the mix also.

    I dont know the specifics of the Raypak warranty, so I can't comment on that.
    The Brick and Mortar stores are taking a beating because they just cant compete in price. The stores and PBs have been lobbying the manufacturers to support them and so, this is one way of doing it.

    Generally, if purchased online and installed properly, your chances of not needing warranty is pretty good. But there is always a a small chance that you will need it.

    So the question, is, what is the warranty worth to you? Only you can answer that question.
    Divin Dave,
    IG Vinyl, 15' x 30', 3 1/2' - 6' deep, Oval, ~15K gal, Intelliclor IC40, Intelliflo VS pump, Clean and Clear 420 Filter, auto-fill-disabled, Retrofit LED Color Light, Dolphin Nautilus Robot, TF100 Test Kit, Taylor K1766 Salt Test Kit, Tftestkit Pressure Gauge.
    www.tftestkits.net Experience- it's what's learned just after you needed it most !!

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    Re: Raypaks internet policy

    Quote Originally Posted by Divin Dave View Post

    Generally, if purchased online and installed properly, your chances of not needing warranty is pretty good. But there is always a a small chance that you will need it.

    So the question, is, what is the warranty worth to you? Only you can answer that question.
    Thanks for the response.
    I think the one year warranty really isn't all that valuable if you think about it. I am in NY and optimistically my swim season is June to Labor Day. After that the pool is closed until next year, when my warranty runs out. So to me the most important part of the warranty is when I open the shipping crate and plug it in. To get a unit thats defective from the factory, however unlikely, would be the ultimate kick in the ..., if you know what I mean.

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    Re: Raypaks internet policy

    Standard consumer protection laws should protect you for the first 30 days from things like dead on arrival regardless of the warranty.
    19K gal, vinyl, 1/2 HP WhisperFlo pump, 200 sqft cartridge filter, AutoPilot Digital SWG, Dolphin Dynamic cleaning robot
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    Re: Raypaks internet policy

    Most of the equipment companies are doing the same thing with their warranties. Raypak, while they don't sell direct to consumers, has one of the better units on the market today. As long as you are knowledgeable on plumbing/gas and electrical, you can surely hook it up yourself and not have to worry about any issues. What you could do is buy it on the net and then find a licensed person to install it for you. Although depending on where you purchase, the cost plus install might put you close to a purchase and install from someone local. Then the wouldn't be any question on the warranty. The key is though, a licensed professional(if your state requires people to be licensed for this).

    I've been exclusively installing Raypak's/Rheem heaters for a very long time and it is a solid unit.
    Paul
    http://www.gastekservices.com A word of caution: When working with gas and electrical you might want to consider a licensed contractor. Consider the value of your life and others around you. If you would like to provide a review of the help I provided, please use the following link to leave a review. gastek - Google Search,

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    Re: Raypaks internet policy

    I recently had a problem with my warranty on a Raypak heater. I had to replace the control board and I bought one on-line. A few months later, I discovered a soldering problem on the board that was affecting one of the connectors. It eventually pulled away from the board rendering the control board useless. I had had the board for about 6 months of the one-year warranty. I contacted Raypak who said that I needed to go through the online store for warranty. They explained that the on line store could return the board to their distributor for credit. I contacted the on line store, who told me that they can only take the board back for the first 30-days. After that, they said I had to deal with the manufacturer.

    I ended up asking the online store to talk directly to the manufacturer. Raypak finally agreed to take the board back and the online store even paid for shipping. I would think twice before going through all that again. Especially if I was going to spend thousands of $.
    30,000 plaster in-ground pool with spa; 2.5HP single speed Centurion pump; Raypak RP2100 propane heater; Polaris 280 with pump, waterfall with separate pump, Triton II commercial sand filter; TF-100 test kit w/ SpeedStir

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    Re: Raypaks internet policy

    Quote Originally Posted by Billrector View Post
    I recently had a problem with my warranty on a Raypak heater. I had to replace the control board and I bought one on-line. A few months later, I discovered a soldering problem on the board that was affecting one of the connectors. It eventually pulled away from the board rendering the control board useless. I had had the board for about 6 months of the one-year warranty. I contacted Raypak who said that I needed to go through the online store for warranty. They explained that the on line store could return the board to their distributor for credit. I contacted the on line store, who told me that they can only take the board back for the first 30-days. After that, they said I had to deal with the manufacturer.

    I ended up asking the online store to talk directly to the manufacturer. Raypak finally agreed to take the board back and the online store even paid for shipping. I would think twice before going through all that again. Especially if I was going to spend thousands of $.

    Thanks for sharing your experiences. That's a good learning point for me.
    23' x 37' IG 18.5k gallon SWG w/ raised spa, Build Thread -->Here
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    Re: Raypaks internet policy

    I went through this whole thought process over the winter as our heater died last fall. I was quoted a price $1200 higher from a pool store than what you see online. However they offered a 3 year warranty on the heater through them. I didn't get into the details of what that warranty included but I am willing to wager it was thorough as it is long standing family business with a handful of stores in the area.

    That being said I have decided to go direct through the Internet. Before doing that I had the uncomfortable conversation with the pool store to see if they would install in this case. The pool store was willing to do the plumbing/electric install portion for $350, but of course any warranty issue will be my responsibility.

    We shall see how it goes. For my situation I felt that since the pool season is so short the warranty really is not as valuable as the money saved.

    Curious if anyone has any numbers for issues with defects in new heaters or service issues in the first year? That number has to be low for a new Raypak heater I would think. Either that or I'm a bit of a gambler!
    16'x32' 14k Vinyl IG built in 1997, Marathon imPower 1.25 2 speed pump, Hayward S220T sand filter, Raypak 400k, Circupool Si-45+, FloVis Flow Meter, TF-100 Test Kit w/ SpeedStir.

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    Re: Raypaks internet policy

    I bought a replacement Raypak two seasons ago off the internet. Install was easy except they moved the power inlet about a foot higher on the side which caused me some miner modifications and a few runs to the hardware store. No problems so far and we saved about $1500 from what a pool company had qouted us and I got the cupro nickel exchanger upgrade. Once these bad boys start to go they cost a lot in parts. I know the control board was about $400 bucks to replace on the last one. I should have replaced mine about a year before I did..being the old one lasted about 11 years.
    Inground 22k gallon gunite 15x31 main pool, 15x7 wading pool/sunning deck, hot tub/with overflow (9' octagon with limestone top) & slide NSWG, Aqua Blue Pebble Sheen
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    Re: Raypaks internet policy

    Quote Originally Posted by texflood View Post
    Curious if anyone has any numbers for issues with defects in new heaters or service issues in the first year? That number has to be low for a new Raypak heater I would think. Either that or I'm a bit of a gambler!
    I install hundreds of Raypak's a year. I get zero(0) call backs on the units I've installed with in the first year. Outside of the first year the call backs are very low and most times it's a user issue or something like a snake or tree frog took up residence inside and caused issues.

    As for other brands, well I see calls on some within 18 months of install date. Bad boards and leaks are the main issues.
    Paul
    http://www.gastekservices.com A word of caution: When working with gas and electrical you might want to consider a licensed contractor. Consider the value of your life and others around you. If you would like to provide a review of the help I provided, please use the following link to leave a review. gastek - Google Search,

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    Re: Raypaks internet policy

    Quote Originally Posted by Billrector View Post
    I recently had a problem with my warranty on a Raypak heater. I had to replace the control board and I bought one on-line. A few months later, I discovered a soldering problem on the board that was affecting one of the connectors. It eventually pulled away from the board rendering the control board useless. I had had the board for about 6 months of the one-year warranty. I contacted Raypak who said that I needed to go through the online store for warranty. They explained that the on line store could return the board to their distributor for credit. I contacted the on line store, who told me that they can only take the board back for the first 30-days. After that, they said I had to deal with the manufacturer.

    I ended up asking the online store to talk directly to the manufacturer. Raypak finally agreed to take the board back and the online store even paid for shipping. I would think twice before going through all that again. Especially if I was going to spend thousands of $.
    It's very common for the manufacturer to have the consumer to go thru where it was purchased especially in this industry. The online store should have done the replacement work without any hassle. Especially since the manufacturer will replace it for them at no cost. To me, that's just good business practice.

    I know you pay a little more for a local person to come replace the item/part, but in can make a difference in situations like this. The relationships I have with my vendors sometimes allows me to take products back even past a year after purchase. Even if it broke due to the consumer.
    Paul
    http://www.gastekservices.com A word of caution: When working with gas and electrical you might want to consider a licensed contractor. Consider the value of your life and others around you. If you would like to provide a review of the help I provided, please use the following link to leave a review. gastek - Google Search,

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    Re: Raypaks internet policy

    In my opinion, manufacturers will need to understand that more and more people are buying off the internet. In my case, no one locally is going to stock a control board for a 15 year old heater. If they have t order it also, they really add no value to me. Any manufacturer should provide a warranty regardless of where it is purchased. After all, they control the distribution. Those who decide to make life more difficult for Internet purchasers may see their business decrease going forward.
    30,000 plaster in-ground pool with spa; 2.5HP single speed Centurion pump; Raypak RP2100 propane heater; Polaris 280 with pump, waterfall with separate pump, Triton II commercial sand filter; TF-100 test kit w/ SpeedStir

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    Re: Raypaks internet policy

    Quote Originally Posted by Billrector View Post
    In my opinion, manufacturers will need to understand that more and more people are buying off the internet. In my case, no one locally is going to stock a control board for a 15 year old heater. If they have t order it also, they really add no value to me. Any manufacturer should provide a warranty regardless of where it is purchased. After all, they control the distribution. Those who decide to make life more difficult for Internet purchasers may see their business decrease going forward.
    These new policies are in response to more people ordering them online. 90% of internet warranty dispatch calls we get are bogus. Usually from improper installation, water chemistry issues, or improper operation. If a manufacturer has to spend $200 on every product they sell for warranty where is the value to them? At some point the profits from increased volume get destroyed by warranty and return issues (both can get expensive). The difference is that you have people that (hopefully) have been trained on installing, diagnosing, and repairing issues with their product.

    As far as Raypak is concerned, they make a decent unit, but aren't very good dealing with warranties for their dealers. They even worse when it comes to direct to consumer products.

    If I needed a warranty on any product a heater would be #1 because its the most likely to have an issue.
    20X40 30,000 gallon gunite pool

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    Re: Raypaks internet policy

    I guess it all depends on the relationship you have with your local rep.

    I don't know of any company in the pool industry that sells direct to consumers, heaters, control systems, or even pumps.
    Paul
    http://www.gastekservices.com A word of caution: When working with gas and electrical you might want to consider a licensed contractor. Consider the value of your life and others around you. If you would like to provide a review of the help I provided, please use the following link to leave a review. gastek - Google Search,

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    Re: Raypaks internet policy

    Quote Originally Posted by racket View Post

    If I needed a warranty on any product a heater would be #1 because its the most likely to have an issue.
    This is the reason I m concerned about the purchase and support. Sure, for me the 1 year warranty is only good for 3 months due to my short season. But I do want a someone nearby who will repair and get parts for me in the years to come. This is why I decided to buy the unit through my installer. I havn't gotten the estimate yet, but if it is reasonable I'll spend the extra money and hope he will look out for my interests should a repair be needed.

    Thanks for all the opinions and information, I thinks it's been a very helpful thread.
    Long Island, NY. 18x36 vinyl liner pool installed 1992. (new liner about 2012.) 1.5 hp whisperflo pump (new 2015) with a hayward de filter (new 2005). Rheem natural gas heater 336k btu (new 2015). I'm rebuilding it a piece at a time.

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    Re: Raypaks internet policy

    The final decision- I am buying the raypac unit through and having it installed by a local business that is a factory rep. Sure its costing a few hundred more but its worth getting the factory warranty, a professional install and a warm pool in June. The deciding factor was the guy who came to estimate the job knew what he was talking about. When you get right down to it, that's what you need with a gas install. Thanks to all.
    Long Island, NY. 18x36 vinyl liner pool installed 1992. (new liner about 2012.) 1.5 hp whisperflo pump (new 2015) with a hayward de filter (new 2005). Rheem natural gas heater 336k btu (new 2015). I'm rebuilding it a piece at a time.

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