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Thread: New Fr. Gray install, problem?

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    New Fr. Gray install, problem?

    Hi everyone, i am having my pool renovated and I wanted to share some photos of my new medium french gray plaster install, to make sure it was done correctly. I am aware that some discoloration, streaking, mottling, etc. is common in colored plaster, but it seems really pronounced on my project, and I wanted to make sure that the installation was done right. Thanks.
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    JasonLion's Avatar
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    Re: New Fr. Gray install, problem?

    If that is supposed to be finished plaster, it is very nearly the worst unevenness I have ever seen.

    Some splotchiness/mottling is inevitable, especially with darker colors. But this is way way beyond what is typical.
    19K gal, vinyl, 1/2 HP WhisperFlo pump, 200 sqft cartridge filter, AutoPilot Digital SWG, Dolphin Dynamic cleaning robot
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    Re: New Fr. Gray install, problem?

    Thanks Jason, I called the guy and he said it normally looks that way and it will look better once its filled. I'm sure it will be marginally better, but the streaking seams to still be visible under the water line of the now filling pool. If there are any pool professionals in this forum, I would like to know: should i withhold payment? Is this a substandard installation? I'd hate to waste $1000 in water if its obvious that this needs to be redone.

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    Kpag's Avatar
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    Re: New Fr. Gray install, problem?

    I don't think you will like how that looks when it's filled! I do like how you coordinated the plaster color with the waterline tiles. And your coping looks nice.
    IG ~12000 gallon 1988 freeform pool with IG spa, Hayward equip, Ecostar pump. Remodel done: NPT Arctic 1x2 tile in Lagoon w/ gray thinset & Light Pewter grout, French Gray PebbleSheen w/ grey fittings, Leuders buff eased edge limestone coping w/ Light Buff mortar, buff mastic

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    Re: New Fr. Gray install, problem?

    What type of plaster finish is this? Is is plain marcite that was colored? If so, what did they use to color it?

    Ours was marcite with one bag of Diamond Brite Onyx (black) per batch.

    The link below (go to post 56) is to pictures of our pool late on the day plaster was applied so it is fairly dry. It shows substantial mottling similar to yours (probably a bit less), though a bit more random with the white versus gray areas.

    With water in the pool, it will blend together more and not be that noticable - though not so much if the water is still. I really like the mottled look and they prepped us that it would be obvious so we were prepared. If you have any type of "purchased"/manufactured colored or pebble plaster finish, I'd say this is a bad installation of it. But if it's just colored marcite, though on the extreme side, not entirely unexpected.

    http://www.troublefreepool.com/threa...altimore/page3
    18'x38' Rectangle (3'-8 1/2' deep w/ diving board) - 27K gal. w/ gray plaster
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    Patrick_B's Avatar
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    Re: New Fr. Gray install, problem?

    I have to agree with Jason. We see a lot of new plaster photos here and that is really unacceptable. That's the worst one I remember seeing here.

    If it were mine, I wouldn't accept it, and certainly not fill or pay until this was resolved.
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    Re: New Fr. Gray install, problem?

    Can you show us some pics with it full of water and still and also with the water moving? Mostly just for my own interest as doesn't really change anything.
    18'x38' Rectangle (3'-8 1/2' deep w/ diving board) - 27K gal. w/ gray plaster
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    Re: New Fr. Gray install, problem?

    thankyou, everyone, for responses. I'm not sure what type the plaster is, i've been kinda arguing with the contractor, didn't ask. I was thinking of stopping fill, but he assured me it was only a couple hundred bucks in water and that I would be compensated if they had to drain the pool to fix the problem. Normally, I would give the guy the benefit of the doubt, but the steps are also crooked, and they plastered over one of the jets, which will need to be drilled out, or something. If anyone has done a gray plaster install, and has pics posted, please share with me. I'm going to try to compile a portfolio of other installs, vs. mine, if he says that this level of unevenness is normal.

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    Patrick_B's Avatar
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    Re: New Fr. Gray install, problem?

    If you look around you find plenty that look better. Doesn't sound like it went that well with all you mention.

    The price of 1000 dollars for water does sound way out of line. I would be very surprised if it was anywhere near 500.

    He's thinking if it gets filled, you'll let it go. Just my gut feeling on it, could be wrong.
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    Re: New Fr. Gray install, problem?

    Here's one from TFP a while back - much less mottling than yours and probably less than mine too. Gray tinted marcite. There seem to be MANY more premixed gray colored pools here than tinted marcite. I would avoid comparing to any of the premix varieties, stay apples to apples. Not downplaying your mottling in any way...it's clearly above average.

    http://i627.photobucket.com/albums/t...20Pool/076.jpg
    18'x38' Rectangle (3'-8 1/2' deep w/ diving board) - 27K gal. w/ gray plaster
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    Re: New Fr. Gray install, problem?

    I had Finest Finish Grey done last fall, and the color was very consistent before filling. It was only after it was under water that you could see any mottling. Your pool is much, much worse.
    36' x 18' 20k in ground, Finest Finish grey plaster, Pentair Tagelus 100D sand filter, Hayward Northstar 2hp pump, Jandy LRZ125EN heater, spill over spa, iaqualink controlled automation, Stenner chlorination, natural rock and flagstone coping, 1" glass mosaic waterline tile, SR Smith Vortex slide.

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    Re: New Fr. Gray install, problem?

    Off the subject, but your pool fill will likely cost around $5/1000 gallons
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    Re: New Fr. Gray install, problem?

    Quote Originally Posted by smracing View Post
    I had Finest Finish Grey done last fall, and the color was very consistent before filling. It was only after it was under water that you could see any mottling. Your pool is much, much worse.
    Note to OP - Finest Finish is a premixed product, so not apples to apples (if you indeed have just tinted marcite) - though good to hear it was consistent for SMR.

    You will need to know what you have in order to compare. What does your contract say it is? You also should be able to find this out from your PB, even if you are fighting with him. Find a business-like way to communicate with them and get that information. It's key to your argument.
    18'x38' Rectangle (3'-8 1/2' deep w/ diving board) - 27K gal. w/ gray plaster
    Hayward equipment (cartridge filter, 2-speed pump, SWCG, automation) View Our Build
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    Re: New Fr. Gray install, problem?

    thanks again guys. it just says colored plaster on the contract. I asked him if it was tinted marcite, and he texted, "yes, colored plaster". I'll try to post some more photos soon, my comp is being a pain. Does anyone know if they can just put another coat of plaster on, or would they have to demo out again in order to fix it?

    - - - Updated - - -

    Also, is tinted marcite an inferior product? should something else have been used?

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    Re: New Fr. Gray install, problem?

    So you definitely do not have a premixed product of any type. I'd recommend only looking at tinted marcite/colored plaster installation pictures to help understand the level of your mottling relative to it's peers. However, even for tinted marcite, yours seems clearly to be on the far side what is normally seen.

    Marcite has the shortest expected lifespan of the plaster family of finishes. Is it inferior? I wouldn't use that term. It is the option with the lowest cost and shortest lifespan. What that lifespan is, is dependent on installation quality, water quality maintenance and finish maintenance. More expensive finishes last longer, generally, all else being equal.

    Redoing new plaster would likely involve chipping it out where it meets the tile and any fittings. The rest should be bonded well to the shell and a bonding agent can be applied to the plaster before recoating. Not sure how that works given it's new though.

    Or they could chip the whole thing - more labor - just like new, though they may mess up some tile and need to redo that as well.

    Or they could do acid washing, though I have no idea how well that would work in this situation - maybe not well at all.

    However, if a redo is in order, who's to say the same people doing the same product won't yield the same result? Maybe consider a premixed (quartz/pebble) product if it goes down that road for an upgrade charge? Sometimes an issue like this gives you more knowledge and ultimately leads to a product better suited for your tastes/needs/wants, if not necessarily for your pocket-book.

    I wish you future happiness - because I'm sure you don't have that now.
    18'x38' Rectangle (3'-8 1/2' deep w/ diving board) - 27K gal. w/ gray plaster
    Hayward equipment (cartridge filter, 2-speed pump, SWCG, automation) View Our Build
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    Lershac's Avatar
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    Re: New Fr. Gray install, problem?

    Man not to pile on, but thats just awful!
    (DIY):16K Gal 20X30 rectangular IG Gunite, w/spa, CCP 520 filter,2 Pentair VS pumps, 400KBTU Pentair gas heater, Heat Pump for cooling, **update5.25.2013** added an intellichem with acid pump that will control existing SWG. My Build Thread Here

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    Re: New Fr. Gray install, problem?

    This is our french grey diamond brite.uploadfromtaptalk1426824242169.jpg

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    Re: New Fr. Gray install, problem?

    Hate to see someone get shaft'ed like this. Not to pile on either but it looks like the distressed paint job the wife did to our bathroom cabinets. You need some satisfaction for your money and you are not getting now.

    On a good note, using this http://www.swbno.org/custserv_inform...ates_water.asp you will pay $114.98 for 20k gallons of water plus the meter fees. You don't say how much water your pool holds but i think the price of the water is small potatoes to that finish. Good luck, hope you get some satisfaction out of this.
    12K gal, custom flipped kidney bean with spillover spa. All Pentair equipment, Whisperflo 1 1/2 HP, 400K BTU heater, Intellichlor IC 40 SWG, CCP-320 Cartridge filters, Kreepy Krauly pool cleaner with bootster pump, QuartzScapes in Aruba Sky blue, LED lights and travertine tiles for decking and stones on rear edge for landscaping. TF-100 test kit w/ SpeedStir

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    Re: New Fr. Gray install, problem?

    need to acid wash

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    Re: New Fr. Gray install, problem?

    Is it possible that the plaster sat too long before the fill? Is it imperative that the pool to be filled quickly for the plaster to cure properly? Based on other peoples pics, it seems like it shouldn't matter, but I'd like to be fully informed. Thanks again, great forum. I think my pool is about 15k gallons. I have kinda put the water costs aside for now, especially since it seems to be common opinion that stopping the fill can ruin the finish.

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