Mix n' Match Pool Components? aka Frankenpool.

platipus · Mar 15, 2015

OK, so I am in the final stretch of my pre-planning phase. I am now mostly down to making some equipment choices so I can keep the bids more uniform and comparable.

I am really intrigued by Hayward's OmniLogic 4 and so would like to use that as the core component that will then drive the other choices. If it weren't for that system and the control interface, I would almost certainly be looking at Pentair. Everything I've read here though makes it sound like Pentair has no plans they've even hinted at of improving their interface. Regardless, I am a month or two out from signing with a builder and OmniLogic is what's available now.

So given that, what makes the most sense here?

I am thinking Hayward for the SWG and Cartridge filter for sure to get me to 3 core components and a (possible?) extended warranty.

I'd probably also then go with Hayward pump(s) even though it seems Pentair has the slight edge here. Would there be any issues going with Pentair pumps on a Hayward controlled system?

Heater will be a Raypak. This seems to be the winner every time someone asks the question.

I am going to try and get solar. Leaning towards Heliocol here.

I'd like an acid dosing system. No ORP, but I'd like pH sensing with the ability to just have it go to a pre-set dosing if/when the pH sensing proves to be a problem.

Where I get lost though is aesthetic features. I'd like LOTS of LED lighting (budget permitting), LED Laminar jets, Bubblers (possibly LED but I am reading enough issues with these that I'm not sure LED is worth the risk even though I'd really like that) and an LED sheer descent.

Can you run Pentair LED Laminars with Hayward automation and get all the normal features? How about Pentair LED bubblers?

What about other brand LED lighting? Any issues controlling colors etc.. from OmniLogic? Is it just better to go all Hayward here?

Lastly, am I missing any major components that I need to consider still?

Thanks
plat.

JasonLion · Mar 15, 2015

Keep in mind that while OmniLogic looks really wonderful, it is very early in it's product cycle and we don't really know how it works out in practice just yet.

For pumps, a single speed pump or dual speed pump can be freely mixed across brands. But for a variable speed pump it is much better to stick with the same brand as the automation system. The Hayward EcoStar pump is more efficient than the Pentair IntelliFlo at low speeds, which is good, but it has scattered reports of tripping CGFI breakers unnecessarily, which is not so good.

The color changing commands for LED lights are easier to manage when sticking with the same brand automation system. All of the lights can be turned on/off by any automation system, but things like going straight to a specific color usually only work with a same brand automation system.

pooldv · Mar 15, 2015

I'm going to have to go do some reading and comparing. I always thought/heard that Pentair Intellitouch did everything under the sun.

platipus · Mar 15, 2015

@pooldv
Intellitouch does do everything under the sun from what I can tell. It's the user interface of the OmniLogic that looks like the winner and with automation systems, that is the swaying factor if the backend capabilities are similar. The front end of an automation system should be customizable, intuitive and provide a rich built in feature-set. Keep in mind, I am only going by reviews and opinions. This (pool tech) is all new to me. Maybe the OmniLogic tech is just overhyped? That is why I am asking these questions.

I already run z-wave (Vera) for home automation and it's a great thing for me personally. Lights go on and off when I want them just at the right time, my blinds are open in the morning, close when the sun is coming in at just the right time, then open and then close again for the night. I can put the house into vacation mode so it looks like someone is home. I can turn on/off lights while away and check cameras. It provides a very high level of convenience once set-up. Plus it has a "neat" factor to it. The first time new people come over and the lights or blinds adjust on their own is always kind of funny to watch.

I would like a similar level of convenience and control over the pool since it's a big investment and a focal point of the backyard. I am definitely not making the statement that one system is inferior. It's just that one seems to be a better fit for what I am looking for.

Also, keep in mind. If you are a Pentair fan, I am helping you. Three months after I spend the money on OmniLogic, Pentair will release a better, cheaper and more reliable system that does everything and more. Then I can kick myself....

@JasonLion
Do you have an opinion on Hayward water features? LED lights and bubblers? How about Laminars, do they even make any? If not, I am curious how Hayward OL would handle integration of them, but it does sound like this probably won't work (color control from the Hayward OL app).

Thanks!
plat.

wildta · May 8, 2015

Plat, what did you end up going with? I'm thinking about Omnilogic in addition to Hayward filter, pump and heater. Might switch to a Raypak thought after reading through everything today. I'm also going to avoid ORP and just stick with a PH sensor.

platipus · May 8, 2015

Things have changed a bit. We received the last of the bids this week (was supposed to be 4 bids but ended up being 3 after one dropped out. This was after contacting 7 total companies to begin with). We most likely will stick with a single vendor solution to get the extended warranty bonus. We actually got different vendor proposals for each of them; Hayward, Pentair and Jandy. Probably in about 2 weeks I'll have a selected bid proposal to post and ask for feedback on.

cowboycasey · May 9, 2015

platipus said:
I already run z-wave (Vera) for home automation and it's a great thing for me personally. Lights go on and off when I want them just at the right time, my blinds are open in the morning, close when the sun is coming in at just the right time, then open and then close again for the night. I can put the house into vacation mode so it looks like someone is home. I can turn on/off lights while away and check cameras. It provides a very high level of convenience once set-up. Plus it has a "neat" factor to it. The first time new people come over and the lights or blinds adjust on their own is always kind of funny to watch.
plat.

I thought I would add to your delima

Since you like Z-wave you may look into the intermatic wireless control system, everything can be controlled the same way you do everything else... everyone says it IS NOT easy setting them up but I can tell you I spoke to a live person from the US within 3 minutes when I had a question and he had the answer within 30 seconds.. I have not connected it yet as my pool build has been postponed with all the rain and storms coming through...

http://www.intermatic.com/en/Products/Pool_and_Spa/Electronic_Controls/MultiWave.aspx

wildta · May 20, 2015

platipus said:
Things have changed a bit. We received the last of the bids this week (was supposed to be 4 bids but ended up being 3 after one dropped out. This was after contacting 7 total companies to begin with). We most likely will stick with a single vendor solution to get the extended warranty bonus. We actually got different vendor proposals for each of them; Hayward, Pentair and Jandy. Probably in about 2 weeks I'll have a selected bid proposal to post and ask for feedback on.

Now I'm leaning towards keeping it super simple with just the basics: filter, pump, heater, SWCG and no sensors or automation. I thought automation would save me time and costs on general pool maintenance but it sounds like that's not the case the more I read about it.