Become a TFP Supporter Pool Math Forum Rules Pool School
Results 1 to 19 of 19

Thread: Question on Ozone

  1. Back To Top    #1

    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Location
    Chandler, Arizona
    Posts
    24

    Question on Ozone

    I have an ozone generator on my pool (I know some don't recommend this but I have it and plan to keep it). The problem is that I am getting excessive air in the filter. I did have a leak around the cap of the filter but used some PTFE to fix that. I believe the seal is now good but still getting air in the filter.
    My next bet is the ozone generator. I'm guessing there is nothing to stop air coming in this way. So I've been thinking of adding a bleed kit feeding the air past the other equipment. Is this advisable? Is this a common issue with ozone generators?
    Thanks in advance for any advice.
    12,000gal Venetian glass tile. 4 Pentair Whisperflow (2x1HP, 2x1.5Hp), 1xPentair Waterfall pump (1HP), Triton II sand filter, MiniMax NT 400 heater, PC2000 in floor cleaner, Resilience A5 SWG, pHtek automated acid system, Paramount Clear O3 Ozne Generator.

  2. Back To Top    #2
    JasonLion's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    Silver Spring, MD
    Posts
    37,879

    Re: Question on Ozone

    A properly installed and working ozone system will not let air into the filter. The ozone injection point should be after the filter, and ozone should only be injected when the pump is running, so no ozone should ever get into the filter while the pump is running regardless of the condition of the ozone system. It is possible for an ozone system to be broken so that it lets air into the plumbing when the pump is off. If that was happening you would tend to lose prime on the pump. Usually that would be very noticeable, however some pumps are able to regain prime on their own, so you might not notice this.

    There are many other ways for air to get into the filter. The ozone system is not the first place I would look. What makes you suspect the ozone system? Have you checked that the pump strainer basket lit is sealing well and that the sealing ring is clean and free of nicks and cuts? Also check the water level in the skimmer and make sure that the water level is high enough that no vortex is forming (a vortex might draw air into the plumbing).
    19K gal, vinyl, 1/2 HP WhisperFlo pump, 200 sqft cartridge filter, AutoPilot Digital SWG, Dolphin Dynamic cleaning robot
    Creator of PoolMath and Pool Calculator. Other handy links: Support this site, TF Test Kits, Pool School

  3. Back To Top    #3

    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Location
    Chandler, Arizona
    Posts
    24

    Re: Question on Ozone

    The pump doesn't seem to lose prime although water level falls a bit when off . I just end up with a lot of air in the filter. I'm going to be replacing the gaskets in the direction valve on the sand filter this week. I guess it could still be letting air in the filter lid even if it's not leaking anymore?
    The only reason I focused on the ozone is because it feeds a
    Ozone gas in to the system at the filter basket.
    12,000gal Venetian glass tile. 4 Pentair Whisperflow (2x1HP, 2x1.5Hp), 1xPentair Waterfall pump (1HP), Triton II sand filter, MiniMax NT 400 heater, PC2000 in floor cleaner, Resilience A5 SWG, pHtek automated acid system, Paramount Clear O3 Ozne Generator.

  4. Back To Top    #4
    JasonLion's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    Silver Spring, MD
    Posts
    37,879

    Re: Question on Ozone

    One test that would narrow things down a great deal is: does air get into the filter only when the pump is off, or does it get into the filter only when the pump is on. That would help us narrow down the candidates for where the leak might be quite a bit.
    19K gal, vinyl, 1/2 HP WhisperFlo pump, 200 sqft cartridge filter, AutoPilot Digital SWG, Dolphin Dynamic cleaning robot
    Creator of PoolMath and Pool Calculator. Other handy links: Support this site, TF Test Kits, Pool School

  5. Back To Top    #5

    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Location
    Chandler, Arizona
    Posts
    24

    Re: Question on Ozone

    A bigger issue is that the PC2000 in pool cleaner pump is also getting air into it, This one is completely draining from one day to the next and will not prime. both only draw air when they are off They do not seem to be pulling air when on.
    The PC2000 pump drives a valve in to 6 different pipes connected to the cleaning heads. I took this apart to check for leaks and when I reassembled I found a crack in the lid. I bought a new lid and gasket, installed and the pump is still losing water when it is off. I also disassembled the pump and replaced all gaskets - no success.
    12,000gal Venetian glass tile. 4 Pentair Whisperflow (2x1HP, 2x1.5Hp), 1xPentair Waterfall pump (1HP), Triton II sand filter, MiniMax NT 400 heater, PC2000 in floor cleaner, Resilience A5 SWG, pHtek automated acid system, Paramount Clear O3 Ozne Generator.

  6. Back To Top    #6
    JasonLion's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    Silver Spring, MD
    Posts
    37,879

    Re: Question on Ozone

    Letting air in only when off means a pressure side leak. The same spot that leaks should leak water when the pump is running, so one thing to try is to search for a small water leak when the pump is on.
    19K gal, vinyl, 1/2 HP WhisperFlo pump, 200 sqft cartridge filter, AutoPilot Digital SWG, Dolphin Dynamic cleaning robot
    Creator of PoolMath and Pool Calculator. Other handy links: Support this site, TF Test Kits, Pool School

  7. Back To Top    #7

    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Location
    Chandler, Arizona
    Posts
    24

    Re: Question on Ozone

    I looked everywhere but no leak, unless it's under ground. Also both pumps have separate output paths but a common input path - they both pull from the skimmer/ bottom drain.
    12,000gal Venetian glass tile. 4 Pentair Whisperflow (2x1HP, 2x1.5Hp), 1xPentair Waterfall pump (1HP), Triton II sand filter, MiniMax NT 400 heater, PC2000 in floor cleaner, Resilience A5 SWG, pHtek automated acid system, Paramount Clear O3 Ozne Generator.

  8. Back To Top    #8

    In the Industry
    Pool Clown's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    Silicon Valley, CA
    Posts
    1,636

    Re: Question on Ozone

    The Paramount 03 units do draw air into the system via the filter pump, and can accumulate air in the filter tank if the internal bleeder is plugged, or missing, creating problems with air. If you are a diy'er, you can probably make the same thing Paramount sells to remedy the problem.

    There are, unfortunately factors that work against you with these systems.

    First, they were first introduced just before variable speed pumps were. The system relies on enough flow or velocity through the filter tank to pass this air/ozone. And VS pumps are most economical if they are run as slow as you can, you can see the problem there. It looks like you don't have one of those pumps so you should be OK in that department. Just be sure that when you are cleaning the filter (at least twice a year) that the internal air bleed is clean and intact.

    The second is that the ozone you need is in the form of a gas(air). The more air, the better the ozone amount, and of course the less air, the less ozone. So you want air as opposed to no air. That in itself goes against the theory of efficient pool filtration systems. The unit has a meter on it to adjust the amount of air that gets drawn in. So you do have some control. Something else to check regarding air. If you have Sta-Rite, or whisper flow pumps, there is a little plug at the bottom of the strainer pot (where the basket goes) and that plug's oring will develop a crack that will allow it to leak air in, and not necessarily leak water out.

    Here is the bleed kit. Note: this is not the only place to get this. I just linked the first one that came up for informational purposes.

    http://www.poolsupplyworld.com/param..._-waAlZF8P8HAQ

    Like i said earlier, you can probably make your own for cheaper, better.
    Factory Warranty Station for:
    Jandy/Zodiac, Pentair, Sta-Rite, Raypak, Polaris,
    and Paramount pool cleaning systems.

  9. Back To Top    #9

    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Location
    Chandler, Arizona
    Posts
    24

    Re: Question on Ozone

    I think I solved most of my issues, but I have one quick question : how are the pipes typically fixed in to the pumps? I have a very small leak where the output of the pump connects to the pipe - it only dribbles a little water when the pump is turned on /off. It seems the pipe is not glued but just sealed with a putty like material. Can i seal this with a general purpose outdoors silicon sealent or is there a special sealer I would need?
    12,000gal Venetian glass tile. 4 Pentair Whisperflow (2x1HP, 2x1.5Hp), 1xPentair Waterfall pump (1HP), Triton II sand filter, MiniMax NT 400 heater, PC2000 in floor cleaner, Resilience A5 SWG, pHtek automated acid system, Paramount Clear O3 Ozne Generator.

  10. Back To Top    #10
    pwrstrk's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Location
    Elverson Pa.
    Posts
    4,758

    Question on Ozone

    If this is a threaded connection I would use a liquid paste thread sealant. Make sure it is rated for PVC.
    Some like to use Teflon tape but on large threaded dia fittings I prefer liquid paste thread sealant.
    Jeff
    24'x54" AG Morada RTR (by wilbar) 13'500 gal. Hayward Powerflo Matrix 1hp 2 speed. Hayward Perflex EC65 DE filter.

  11. Back To Top    #11
    JasonLion's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    Silver Spring, MD
    Posts
    37,879

    Re: Question on Ozone

    To fix a leak like that you need to remove the pipe, reapply sealant, and re-install the pipe. Attempts to fix the joint without removing the pipe might hold for a little while, but always start leaking again after not too long.
    19K gal, vinyl, 1/2 HP WhisperFlo pump, 200 sqft cartridge filter, AutoPilot Digital SWG, Dolphin Dynamic cleaning robot
    Creator of PoolMath and Pool Calculator. Other handy links: Support this site, TF Test Kits, Pool School

  12. Back To Top    #12

    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Location
    Chandler, Arizona
    Posts
    24

    Re: Question on Ozone

    OK. Thx. It doesn't look threaded though - usually I would expect to glue such a joint but this is not what was done here - seems to be some sort of putty like I mentioned.
    12,000gal Venetian glass tile. 4 Pentair Whisperflow (2x1HP, 2x1.5Hp), 1xPentair Waterfall pump (1HP), Triton II sand filter, MiniMax NT 400 heater, PC2000 in floor cleaner, Resilience A5 SWG, pHtek automated acid system, Paramount Clear O3 Ozne Generator.

  13. Back To Top    #13
    JasonLion's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    Silver Spring, MD
    Posts
    37,879

    Re: Question on Ozone

    Curious. A photo might help us figure it out.
    19K gal, vinyl, 1/2 HP WhisperFlo pump, 200 sqft cartridge filter, AutoPilot Digital SWG, Dolphin Dynamic cleaning robot
    Creator of PoolMath and Pool Calculator. Other handy links: Support this site, TF Test Kits, Pool School

  14. Back To Top    #14

    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Location
    Chandler, Arizona
    Posts
    24

    Re: Question on Ozone

    I just pulled the WhispaFlow pump manual and perhaps it is actually threaded. The only way I can see to remove this though is to cut the pipe (see pic below) - it's the output of the pump nearest the camera that is leaking.
    IMG_2547.jpg
    12,000gal Venetian glass tile. 4 Pentair Whisperflow (2x1HP, 2x1.5Hp), 1xPentair Waterfall pump (1HP), Triton II sand filter, MiniMax NT 400 heater, PC2000 in floor cleaner, Resilience A5 SWG, pHtek automated acid system, Paramount Clear O3 Ozne Generator.

  15. Back To Top    #15

    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Location
    Friendswood, TX
    Posts
    320

    Re: Question on Ozone

    That is a lot of pumping capability.
    ~Paul
    19x40 IG including 10' BE, 18,000 gal, plaster, 48 SF DE, 1.5HP pump, AquaPure SWCG, Ozonejoe 30MR, Rockwaterfall, LED light, TF-100 Fill date 11/21/2014
    My ODK Build | My Pool Build | If You're From Texas Vote Here

  16. Back To Top    #16

    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Location
    Chandler, Arizona
    Posts
    24

    Re: Question on Ozone

    Quote Originally Posted by Jabooh1 View Post
    That is a lot of pumping capability.
    1 for the filter, 1 for the PC2000 in pool cleaner, 1 for the waterfalls, 1 for a spillway and 1 for the hot tub jets. In hindsight I'm pretty sure this could be done much simpler and the pool designer was just getting carried away lacking up my price, but it is what it is now. Now I prefer to do my own work on the system.
    12,000gal Venetian glass tile. 4 Pentair Whisperflow (2x1HP, 2x1.5Hp), 1xPentair Waterfall pump (1HP), Triton II sand filter, MiniMax NT 400 heater, PC2000 in floor cleaner, Resilience A5 SWG, pHtek automated acid system, Paramount Clear O3 Ozne Generator.

  17. Back To Top    #17
    JasonLion's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    Silver Spring, MD
    Posts
    37,879

    Re: Question on Ozone

    Those are indeed WhisperFlo pumps. The pipe coming out of the pump vertically on top must be threaded and screwed into the female threaded hole in the top of the pump. Most likely the sealing compound has covered up the threads that are above the connection to the pump.

    Unfortunately, you will indeed need to cut the pipe somewhere and then re-connect it after screwing the pipe back into the pump. Some people find this a good moment to add a union close to the pump to make repairs like this one simpler in the future.
    19K gal, vinyl, 1/2 HP WhisperFlo pump, 200 sqft cartridge filter, AutoPilot Digital SWG, Dolphin Dynamic cleaning robot
    Creator of PoolMath and Pool Calculator. Other handy links: Support this site, TF Test Kits, Pool School

  18. Back To Top    #18

    In the Industry
    Pool Clown's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    Silicon Valley, CA
    Posts
    1,636

    Re: Question on Ozone

    If it didn't leak when it was first installed, it (the pump) may have run dry at some point. When that happened, things heated up. If the pipe gets hot enough, it shrinks a bit, causing the leak. You can try to "re-dope" it, but you need to cut the plumbing anyway to do this, so you may as well replace the fitting(s).
    Factory Warranty Station for:
    Jandy/Zodiac, Pentair, Sta-Rite, Raypak, Polaris,
    and Paramount pool cleaning systems.

  19. Back To Top    #19

    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Location
    Chandler, Arizona
    Posts
    24

    Re: Question on Ozone

    The pump had run dry so this probably what caused it- I also had to replace the shaft bearing which was falling to. Leak is very small - nothing comes out under normal operation but air gets in when off. Just beads slightly with constant on /off. I've tried to seal it temporarily and will take apart and fix properly at a later time.
    12,000gal Venetian glass tile. 4 Pentair Whisperflow (2x1HP, 2x1.5Hp), 1xPentair Waterfall pump (1HP), Triton II sand filter, MiniMax NT 400 heater, PC2000 in floor cleaner, Resilience A5 SWG, pHtek automated acid system, Paramount Clear O3 Ozne Generator.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •