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Thread: Infloor System actuator valve to control simmer and drain...

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    Infloor System actuator valve to control simmer and drain...

    Hi,

    I have a new pool and spa which uses the EasyTouch 4, has the PV3 infloor system. When the floor system is on, it doesn't skim the pool well. When I turn off the floor and have it go tot he returns, it skims well (after adjusting the jets). Now what I'd like to do is put an actuator on the skimmer/drain valve and the infloor / return valves. Setup the cleaner scheduler where the drain gets most of the suction and the floor system is on (return is off), then another schedule that the skimmer gets most of the suction and the return is on (floor is off). I presume that can be done via the EasyTouch (there are 2 valves connections left). I'm not sure how you associate a valve with a schedule, that's a question for later (unless you know). If I put the actuator on the drain/skimmer, I' was thinking that I should adjust the cams so it doesn't turn one side all the way off (always some suction on the other source). So my question is, how does that affect when I will need to vacuum? I presume I'll still need to vacuum sometimes, typically turning off the drain completely, but with the actuator on there, I don't have as much control of it? Do you think using the actuators and dual schedules is good? (clean bottom and top)? Do you think it will cause a problem trying to vac if main drain still has some suction? Is there a better thing to do?

    TIA!!

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    pwrstrk's Avatar
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    Re: Infloor System actuator valve to control simmer and drain...

    Welcome to TFP !
    Sorry I can't answer your question, but somebody should be able to help ya out.
    Hope you enjoy the forum !
    Jeff
    24'x54" AG Morada RTR (by wilbar) 13'500 gal. Hayward Powerflo Matrix 1hp 2 speed. Hayward Perflex EC65 DE filter.

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    Mod Squad Jimrahbe's Avatar
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    Re: Infloor System actuator valve to control simmer and drain...

    I suggest you post a picture of your current set up showing all the plumbing at your equipment pad. Your basic idea seems correct to me.. In-floor to Main Drains or Returns to Skimmers.. This could be automated using your Easy Touch, but I would think you'd want the valves fully on or fully off, not sure why you want them in between. Since I can't "see" your set up, I can't understand your vacuum question. Let's hope someone with more experience comes along that can better answer your questions.

    Thanks,

    Jim R.

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    JayBauman's Avatar
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    Re: Infloor System actuator valve to control simmer and drain...

    Does your in-floor system have its own separate pump, or does your various pool equipment share a single pump?
    23' x 37' IG 18.5k gallon SWG w/ raised spa, Build Thread -->Here
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    JasonLion's Avatar
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    Re: Infloor System actuator valve to control simmer and drain...

    Welcome to TFP!

    The two mode top/bottom approach can work well if setup correctly. Vacuuming should work alright in "top" mode as long as the main drain isn't getting too much suction. It may take some fiddling to get that to work well.

    Sometimes you can get this all to work with a single mode, other times not. The in-floor system requires a certain minimum pressure to work correctly. You can't always achieve the needed pressure if the jets are getting enough flow to cause a circulation pattern that is good for the skimmers. On the other hand, if you can balance things so that works, it is simpler and more reliable long term than automating the valves. Using smaller diameter return jet fittings can sometimes help this work, other times there is nothing for it but to have two modes.
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    Re: Infloor System actuator valve to control simmer and drain...

    It's a single pump system.

    Here's the pictures.


    DSCN3910_web.jpg

    DSCN3911_web.jpg

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    Re: Infloor System actuator valve to control simmer and drain...

    So say I hook up the actuators to aux1 and 2, how do I setup the schedule to control the valves ?

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    JasonLion's Avatar
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    Re: Infloor System actuator valve to control simmer and drain...

    Pick an available aux circuit to control the valves. In the Settings Menu: Valves assign the two valves both to that aux circuit. Then schedule that aux circuit to come on at the appropriate time while the pump is running.
    19K gal, vinyl, 1/2 HP WhisperFlo pump, 200 sqft cartridge filter, AutoPilot Digital SWG, Dolphin Dynamic cleaning robot
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    Mod Squad Jimrahbe's Avatar
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    Re: Infloor System actuator valve to control simmer and drain...

    dfattfp,

    First a disclaimer.. Although I have an Easy Touch, I have not tried to add additional valves, as my pool is not yet finished.

    I suggest that you not use the Aux controls as they are intended to be used for controlling external devices with the Easy Touch relays. The Easy Touch has 4 dedicated valve connections, two of which you are already using for your two current valves. Connect your two new valves to PCB valve connections marked for Valve A and B. Under Menu Settings, scroll down to Valves, select valve A and then across and select Feature 1 (or the next Feature that is not in use). Select valve B in the same way. Go back to the main menu which should save everything. Under Menu select Schedules and scroll down to Feature 1 and then enter the day(s) and time you want feature 1 to be on. You can manually turn the Feature on or off in the Feature Menu. I can't guarantee this will work, but I'm pretty sure it is close.

    Where does your vacuum hose connect? Can you shut your vacuum port off? If so, I don't see the valve in your pics.

    Thanks,

    Jim R.

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    JasonLion's Avatar
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    Re: Infloor System actuator valve to control simmer and drain...

    Jimrahbe: You need to think the way Pentair thinks to understand the EasyTouch. "Aux control are intended to be used for controlling external devices with the Easy Touch relays" is very definitely not the way Pentair thinks. Aux circuits are for controlling things, all kinds of things, relays, valves, lights, pool cleaners, etc regardless of how they are connected to the EasyTouch. Don't let the similarity in the names of "Aux Circuit" and "Aux Relay" confuse you, they do have a relationship, but it isn't nearly as straightforward as one tends to assume.
    19K gal, vinyl, 1/2 HP WhisperFlo pump, 200 sqft cartridge filter, AutoPilot Digital SWG, Dolphin Dynamic cleaning robot
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    Mod Squad Jimrahbe's Avatar
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    Re: Infloor System actuator valve to control simmer and drain...

    Jason,

    If I thought like Pentair thinks, I doubt I would able to find my way to work in the morning..

    I have a lot to lean for sure. I had "assumed" that if you use say, AUX2, that when scheduled, the AUX2 relay would be on. Is this not true? I get this from the manual which says "Unlike an Auxiliary relay circuit, a "Feature" circuit does not connect directly to a relay." I was not trying to say you could not use an AUX circuit, but that on an Easy Touch 4 you really only have three unused relays, and that an alternate way to control the valve would be using a Feature circuit and not use up a relay. If you are saying the scheduling AUX2 does not turn on the AUX2 relay then I am full of BS as you suggest..

    Please let me know if I'm on the wrong track here, as I plan to install my valves in the next couple of weeks (assuming my pool gets done) and it would help if I only have to do it once.

    Not trying to argue, as I'm mentally unarmed, but am really trying to learn

    Thanks for your help.

    Jim R.

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    JasonLion's Avatar
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    Re: Infloor System actuator valve to control simmer and drain...

    Two points. First, not all units have feature circuits, only the newer ones.

    Second, and more complexly: I am not disagreeing about using a feature circuit if you have one, certainly one would usually want to do that. I was specifically addressing the one statement I quoted: "Aux control are intended to be used for controlling external devices with the Easy Touch relays". Thinking that way will lead you into mistaken assumptions. Aux circuits are virtual on/off "things" designed to control any of a wide variety of devices which might be connected in any of a wide variety of ways. Yes, they are associated with a physical relay, but that is not the only way to use them and thinking of them as "only" being a relay will prevent you from understanding their full potential.
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    Mod Squad Jimrahbe's Avatar
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    Re: Infloor System actuator valve to control simmer and drain...

    Jason,

    Thanks for the learning opportunity.. I understand your point and fully agree.

    Jim R.

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    Re: Infloor System actuator valve to control simmer and drain...

    I got those wired - not installed yet. Does it matter which direction they are mounted? I know you'd have to get it to move the only way the valve should move, but does the big part always have to go over the pipe in the 3 way connection or can it be on the other end just as well?

    I connected them to Aux7 - pressed the Aux 7 button and they work. Cool, I'll attach them and schedule them tomorrow. So now I'm grasping the concepts here but had a general question. Is there any advantage to using an Aux vs Feature or Feature vs Aux? Or are the the same except an Aux takes up a relay (is it that a relay can only be assigned to an aux or is there a physical connection that is an "aux" that is used?).

    Also for the record, I put the drain valve partial off (not all the way), then stuck my hand by the skimmer where I'd attach the vacuum and it hurt a little so there is enough suction for vacuuming with the drain still on partial.

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    JasonLion's Avatar
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    Re: Infloor System actuator valve to control simmer and drain...

    An Aux is always associated with a relay, so if you use an Aux you won't be able to use the relay for something else.

    It doesn't really matter how the actuator is mounted. As long as you setup the stop cams after mounting it will all work out.
    19K gal, vinyl, 1/2 HP WhisperFlo pump, 200 sqft cartridge filter, AutoPilot Digital SWG, Dolphin Dynamic cleaning robot
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