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Thread: Wiring a 120 volt Stenner to a 240 volt Timer

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    Wiring a 120 volt Stenner to a 240 volt Timer

    I have a similar situation to this one with a 120V Stenner (already purchased) and a 240V pump. Rather than do what has been suggested there, why can't you install a 240V relay that is normally open. When the pool pump is running, it will close the connection which can be a 120V circuit running the Stenner and a timer for the Stenner. When the Stenner timer AND the pool pump are on, the Stenner would run. When EITHER the pool pump or timer is off, the Stenner will not run.

    Anyone know of a relay that could be used to do this?
    30,000 plaster in-ground pool with spa; 2.5HP single speed Centurion pump; Raypak RP2100 propane heater; Polaris 280 with pump, waterfall with separate pump, Triton II commercial sand filter; TF-100 test kit w/ SpeedStir

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    n240sxguy's Avatar
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    Re: Wiring a 120 volt Stenner to a 240 volt Timer

    If you have 120v run to the pad, that is the ideal way to do it. You can find an ice cube relay just about anywhere. RadioShack, Amazon, eBay, and local electrical supply houses all have them. They are usually just a DPDT relay that slips into a base. Shouldn't be more than $15-20 with the base depending on the brand and store you find it at.


    30K gallon IG vinyl. 1.5HP 2-speed Waterway Mustang pump. 600 lb sand filter. Polaris 280. Circupool SI-60+. TF-100

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    n240sxguy's Avatar
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    Re: Wiring a 120 volt Stenner to a 240 volt Timer

    http://www.radioshack.com/nte-r14-11...l#.VKnaSkZOKJJ

    Something like that with a socket that matches it.


    30K gallon IG vinyl. 1.5HP 2-speed Waterway Mustang pump. 600 lb sand filter. Polaris 280. Circupool SI-60+. TF-100

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    Re: Wiring a 120 volt Stenner to a 240 volt Timer

    Thanks for your help. That looks like a great idea!
    30,000 plaster in-ground pool with spa; 2.5HP single speed Centurion pump; Raypak RP2100 propane heater; Polaris 280 with pump, waterfall with separate pump, Triton II commercial sand filter; TF-100 test kit w/ SpeedStir

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    Re: Wiring a 120 volt Stenner to a 240 volt Timer

    There was some potentially dangerous information implied in the link in the first post. If you do not have a separate neutral wire provided in that 240 volt circuit then you can not, by code, derive a 120 volt circuit from it. The ground wire present can not and should not be used for return/neutral current. This potentially energizes every piece of metal in the circuit that is connected to the ground wire. It has been against codes for several code cycles now to have a 3 wire circuit for Electric dryers and ranges for this very reason.
    Unknown make 18' above ground (bought used in 1999) Sparco sand filter. Hayward 100,000 BTu heater. 2 speed pump

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    Re: Wiring a 120 volt Stenner to a 240 volt Timer

    Quote Originally Posted by danpik View Post
    There was some potentially dangerous information implied in the link in the first post. If you do not have a separate neutral wire provided in that 240 volt circuit then you can not, by code, derive a 120 volt circuit from it. The ground wire present can not and should not be used for return/neutral current. This potentially energizes every piece of metal in the circuit that is connected to the ground wire. It has been against codes for several code cycles now to have a 3 wire circuit for Electric dryers and ranges for this very reason.
    Thanks for your input. I'd like to clarify what you are talking about. Into my pool/spa subpanel, I do have two two hot wires, a neutral and a ground. Obviously, all the 240V breakers only have two hot connections. The neutral is used because I have two 120V breakers within the subpanel. So, I would potentially take one hot wire off the pump breaker and combine that with the neutral to get 120V. Is this okay or is this what you are saying to avoid?

    My preferred approach at this point is what n240sxguy recommended and that is to use a 240V relay connected to the pump breaker and have that switch a separate 120V circuit (powered off one of the two 120V breakers) for the Stenner pump.
    30,000 plaster in-ground pool with spa; 2.5HP single speed Centurion pump; Raypak RP2100 propane heater; Polaris 280 with pump, waterfall with separate pump, Triton II commercial sand filter; TF-100 test kit w/ SpeedStir

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    Re: Wiring a 120 volt Stenner to a 240 volt Timer

    The really dangerous thing to do is to use the ground wire as a neutral when there isn't any neutral wire. I believe that is what dank was talking about.

    Using a true neutral wire with one side of the output of a 240 volt breaker is not nearly as dangerous, though it is still not a good idea. If the breaker is a CGFI breaker, which is required by recent versions of the electrical code, it simply won't work.
    19K gal, vinyl, 1/2 HP WhisperFlo pump, 200 sqft cartridge filter, AutoPilot Digital SWG, Dolphin Dynamic cleaning robot
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    Re: Wiring a 120 volt Stenner to a 240 volt Timer

    If it is a true sub panel then there should be no problems as long as, what Jason brought up, there is no GFCI feeding it. Generally, if it is a 240 volt circuit on a GFCI, there will not be a neutral from the panel back to the main. This is because, the neutral is not needed for a 240 volt GFCI to work. In this case the GFCI reads the voltage differential between the two hot legs of the circuit and the pigtailed neutral from the breaker to the neutral bar is only for the test portion of the 240 volt GFCI. If you indeed have a 4 wire service feeding the sub panel then using the neutral to derive a 120 volt circuit is fine. In fact that is why one (neutral) would be there.
    Unknown make 18' above ground (bought used in 1999) Sparco sand filter. Hayward 100,000 BTu heater. 2 speed pump

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    Re: Wiring a 120 volt Stenner to a 240 volt Timer

    Quote Originally Posted by JasonLion View Post
    The really dangerous thing to do is to use the ground wire as a neutral when there isn't any neutral wire. I believe that is what dank was talking about.

    Using a true neutral wire with one side of the output of a 240 volt breaker is not nearly as dangerous, though it is still not a good idea. If the breaker is a CGFI breaker, which is required by recent versions of the electrical code, it simply won't work.
    It may work as long as the neutral is hooked into the GFCI breaker.... For instance portable spas often have many different voltage items that don't draw across both hot legs but will draw through one hot and neutral.
    20X40 30,000 gallon gunite pool

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