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Thread: Closing Nightmare (again!) - Paramount SDX

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    Closing Nightmare (again!) - Paramount SDX

    Hi all, trying to close up for the season, and as usual, I am struggling with how to plug my Paramount SDX sidewall drain. For the record, this system has been my arch nemesis and I hate it! Every year it is a challenge to close because of this sidewall drain. I have had countless calls and emails with the folks at Paramount, and while they have been responsive and attempted to help, nothing ever seems to work. Rubber compression plugs don't hold and they just pop out when up I try to install then and blow the line out. Last year, I got a3" PVC (clean out) plug and it seemed to work with lots of Teflon tape. Much to my chagrin, this was the last step of the process before the cover and therefore everything else was done for the closing, so I could not undo everything and keep the pool running, so had to cover up and will have to pull the cover off if I can find a new SDX solution for this year. Not sure why, but the Teflon route on the drain plug is not working (tried 5 times today!). Does anyone have any ideas?? I was wondering if anyone makes a 3" PVC plug with an o ring (like a standard return plug)? Appreciate any help, especially for those who own or have serviced this wall drain. Thanks!
    10k gallon fiberglass freeform pool, Paramount SwingJet system, Dolphin DX5 robot, Pentair 48" Tagelus sand filter with glass media, WhisperFlo 1 HP pump, Hayward H200FDN natural gas heater, TF-100 Test Kit, and, of course, Margaritaville Tahiti blender!

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    n240sxguy's Avatar
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    Re: Closing Nightmare (again!) - Paramount SDX

    Any pictures of this demon fitting? Is it just a 3" threaded fitting? Does a 3" clean out fitting fit? Does that fitting have a lip that would hold an oring?
    30K gallon IG vinyl. 1.5HP 2-speed Waterway Mustang pump. 600 lb sand filter. Polaris 280. Circupool SI-60+. TF-100

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    Re: Closing Nightmare (again!) - Paramount SDX

    Hi. Thanks for the reply. I can post a pic, not sure if the pics are still in my post from last year on this topic? The 3" clean out is what I used last yr and tried again many times yesterday, but without success. There is no lip on the clean out plug I have and I have not been able to find one online which has one to accommodate a no ring.

    This is so frustrating every year, and on top of it, my PB didn't plumb it correctly with the bottom drain so there is very little debris which actually gets pulled into it which means the 3 openings are not only an aesthetic eyesore but functionally useless, yet I have to go through this pain of closing this every year!
    10k gallon fiberglass freeform pool, Paramount SwingJet system, Dolphin DX5 robot, Pentair 48" Tagelus sand filter with glass media, WhisperFlo 1 HP pump, Hayward H200FDN natural gas heater, TF-100 Test Kit, and, of course, Margaritaville Tahiti blender!

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    Re: Closing Nightmare (again!) - Paramount SDX

    Hi all, Sorry for the delay. Had to find my pics from last year. Here are the pics of the SDX sidewall drain with the safety cover removed.
    Attached Images Attached Images
    10k gallon fiberglass freeform pool, Paramount SwingJet system, Dolphin DX5 robot, Pentair 48" Tagelus sand filter with glass media, WhisperFlo 1 HP pump, Hayward H200FDN natural gas heater, TF-100 Test Kit, and, of course, Margaritaville Tahiti blender!

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    Re: Closing Nightmare (again!) - Paramount SDX

    Update: Had a few emails and phone calls with Paramount today. Apparently, they have a new plug which just came of the line within the last week or so, it's a 3" threaded plug with a schrader valve in it. You need to load it up with teflon, but sounds like this should do the trick. I am waiting on a reply from Paramount (again, they've been very responsive and helpful), as my assumption is that I would cap the sidewall drain, blow air 'wet' from inside the pool out into the deck canister, and then blow from the deck canister back into those lines (as the sidewall drain and bottom drain - Paramount MDX) are tied together before terminating into the deck canister. Hoping this works!
    10k gallon fiberglass freeform pool, Paramount SwingJet system, Dolphin DX5 robot, Pentair 48" Tagelus sand filter with glass media, WhisperFlo 1 HP pump, Hayward H200FDN natural gas heater, TF-100 Test Kit, and, of course, Margaritaville Tahiti blender!

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    Re: Closing Nightmare (again!) - Paramount SDX

    Hi all, It is with much disappointment (and frustration!) that I provide a negative update to this post. After waiting a few weeks to get the new plug (the retailer I ordered from had to order from Paramount, and then sent me someone else's order!). I finally had a chance to install it (note, it was 40 degrees today in New England, and you can imagine how cold the pool water is now, so I had a patio heater running to warm my arms and i have sleeve length rubber gloves, but they only provide so much protection). The new plug is essentially a 3" PVC clean out plug with a schrader valve in the middle (not overly high tech). Paramount recommends 9 layers of teflon tape (!). Well, tried it with no tape, 6 layers, 9 layers, 12 layers, 15 layers, etc. etc. Differering levels of tightening the plug into the sidewall opening. Remember, every iteration means sticking my arms in the freezing water for a few minutes. Not fun. I tried having the lines blown from the deck canister and capping the SDX line with the new plug. This did not work well I think the force of the air coming out of the sidewall drain interferes with the teflon tape. I also tried capping the SDX side wall, and then blowing the line 'wet' from the new plug back to the deck canister (and bottom drain). No luck, could not get a bubble from the bottom drain, and the plug still leaked. No matter what I tried, there would still be an intermittent air bubble coming from the opening/plug (the best we got it to was when a bubble come up once every 30-45 seconds. At this point, I have no idea what to do. I am going to send another email to the folks at Paramount, but I have had countless calls and emails with them, and this is the new plug that's suppose to work.
    10k gallon fiberglass freeform pool, Paramount SwingJet system, Dolphin DX5 robot, Pentair 48" Tagelus sand filter with glass media, WhisperFlo 1 HP pump, Hayward H200FDN natural gas heater, TF-100 Test Kit, and, of course, Margaritaville Tahiti blender!

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    n240sxguy's Avatar
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    Re: Closing Nightmare (again!) - Paramount SDX

    Worst case, I would blow it from the pad to clear out all the water, put about 5-6 turns of tape on the new plug, get it to seal as good as I could, and fill the line with antifreeze. With that much antifreeze there's not much of a chance water would get in, and hopefully not much antifreeze would leak out into the pool since it would only have the head pressure of the antifreeze to push. Since its thicker than air, not as much would come through. Like I said, worst case scenario.


    30K gallon IG vinyl. 1.5HP 2-speed Waterway Mustang pump. 600 lb sand filter. Polaris 280. Circupool SI-60+. TF-100

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    Re: Closing Nightmare (again!) - Paramount SDX

    Hi. Thanks for the reply and suggestions. Unfortunately, those aren't possible. The MDX bottom drain and SDX sidewall drain are plumbed together via a T and then feed into the deck canister, which then feeds back to the pump/filter. I have blown out the line from the bottom of the deck canister that runs to the pump, plugged it and fillted the canister with anti-freeze, so all set there. There is not way to put antifreeze in the line and have it solely feed the SDX line, it will get comingled with the MDX bottom drain. Attaching a labeled pic so you can see how it's plumbed. The ideal approach is to use a rubber compression plug with schrader valve in the canister, blow air back to the SDX (path of least resistance), cap it (with the new plug!), which will then blow air to the MDX bottom drain to create the air lock. This approach, of course, only works if you can effectively plug the SDX sidewall drain without letting air out (water in).
    Attached Images Attached Images
    Last edited by DOMO; 11-16-2014 at 07:12 PM. Reason: Add attachment
    10k gallon fiberglass freeform pool, Paramount SwingJet system, Dolphin DX5 robot, Pentair 48" Tagelus sand filter with glass media, WhisperFlo 1 HP pump, Hayward H200FDN natural gas heater, TF-100 Test Kit, and, of course, Margaritaville Tahiti blender!

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    n240sxguy's Avatar
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    Re: Closing Nightmare (again!) - Paramount SDX

    Will a rubber plug fit in the sidewall fitting?


    30K gallon IG vinyl. 1.5HP 2-speed Waterway Mustang pump. 600 lb sand filter. Polaris 280. Circupool SI-60+. TF-100

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    Re: Closing Nightmare (again!) - Paramount SDX

    Hi. Just uploaded the pic. Have tried a rubber compression plug with a schrader in the past (provided by Paramount, and that doesnt work either). For some reason, no matter how much you tighten it, it doesnt create a seal and worse, it pops out!
    10k gallon fiberglass freeform pool, Paramount SwingJet system, Dolphin DX5 robot, Pentair 48" Tagelus sand filter with glass media, WhisperFlo 1 HP pump, Hayward H200FDN natural gas heater, TF-100 Test Kit, and, of course, Margaritaville Tahiti blender!

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    Re: Closing Nightmare (again!) - Paramount SDX

    The answer should be simple; make the same plug but with an O ring, just like a standard return plug. After dealing with this the last couple years and having lots of emails and calls with Parmount (who have been responsive), the answer I got this year was that making such a plug was not cost effective/profitable.
    10k gallon fiberglass freeform pool, Paramount SwingJet system, Dolphin DX5 robot, Pentair 48" Tagelus sand filter with glass media, WhisperFlo 1 HP pump, Hayward H200FDN natural gas heater, TF-100 Test Kit, and, of course, Margaritaville Tahiti blender!

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    n240sxguy's Avatar
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    Re: Closing Nightmare (again!) - Paramount SDX

    Not cost effective? But it is cost effective to make a fitting that can't be winterized? Those should hand in hand. The plug should've been designed when the fitting was designed. Did the rubber plug only contact the threads? A long one should be able to make contact with the smooth pipe. Blow it from the pad, and plug it with one of those. May be an option if you can find a long plug that size. It is unnerving to try to tighten pvc tight enough to make a seal using only Teflon tape.


    30K gallon IG vinyl. 1.5HP 2-speed Waterway Mustang pump. 600 lb sand filter. Polaris 280. Circupool SI-60+. TF-100

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    Re: Closing Nightmare (again!) - Paramount SDX

    I hear ya. Looked up my email with them and the explanation was "the demand is not there (to have a version made with an O ring) because only vinyl and fiberglass pools need this plug, for the expense of a mold, especially since a 3" plug that we sell that has a schrader valve on it for a compressor fitting is available, ... which is what most pool companies that do winterizing use".

    Interesting and good suggestion on the longer plug. Does anyone know if this kind of thing is available? I would think it would need to be a #11 (to fit a 2" pipe). The next challenge would be can I reach down and into the SDX that far (as it's not possible to get into the water now).

    That said, the whole system still can't be blown from the pad, it must be blown out from the deck canister.
    10k gallon fiberglass freeform pool, Paramount SwingJet system, Dolphin DX5 robot, Pentair 48" Tagelus sand filter with glass media, WhisperFlo 1 HP pump, Hayward H200FDN natural gas heater, TF-100 Test Kit, and, of course, Margaritaville Tahiti blender!

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    n240sxguy's Avatar
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    Re: Closing Nightmare (again!) - Paramount SDX

    I can't find an extended #11 plug. Best I can find is a #11 with a schrader valve, which I believe you said you already tried. I can see them not making a new kind of plug if the other style actually worked.


    30K gallon IG vinyl. 1.5HP 2-speed Waterway Mustang pump. 600 lb sand filter. Polaris 280. Circupool SI-60+. TF-100

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    Re: Closing Nightmare (again!) - Paramount SDX

    Hi. Thanks for looking. I looked too but only found a tapered #7 to #10 and I don't think that will work. If I can reach down and into the SDX maybe I could fit a #11 into the opening at the pipe. May try that next as I haven't heard back from Paramount yet.
    10k gallon fiberglass freeform pool, Paramount SwingJet system, Dolphin DX5 robot, Pentair 48" Tagelus sand filter with glass media, WhisperFlo 1 HP pump, Hayward H200FDN natural gas heater, TF-100 Test Kit, and, of course, Margaritaville Tahiti blender!

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