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Thread: Advice on motor replacement....home warranty involved

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    Advice on motor replacement....home warranty involved

    We had a storm on Saturday and my motor gave out on me. It's a Hayward Super II and I tried replacing the capacitor. I had it tested and it was fried, but no change. It would turn on, sound way louder than it ever has and then shut itself off after about 15 seconds. Same result either way.

    I have a home warranty and my pool is covered. I'm sure they'll find a way to screw me somehow by giving me a crummy replacement or something to that affect, and I don't trust these pool folks at all.

    So....if the pump is shot and they're going to replace it (as opposed to fixing the existing motor), I'll likely have the option to upgrade by paying the difference. I would like a two-speed motor. That said, I'm leery of these folks trying to sell me something I don't need or doesn't mesh well with my existing system. If I stick with what I have, I can probably get out for the cost of a $60 service call.

    What would you do?

    My setup:
    20K in-ground pool with pop-up cleaners/returns, spa on same pump
    Hayward Super II pump (2 hp, 1.25 SF, 230V, 1.55KW, model K48N2N104)
    No auto-vac pool cleaner, but may someday get one (I brush and vacuum old school for now)
    60 series Hayward DE filter
    AquaLogic control unit
    T-15 SWG

    I have a water feature but it runs on a separate pump.

    Any advice would be appreciated. Prepping as the pool company is coming tomorrow. Happy to provide more info as needed.
    19K PebbleTec in-ground with spa, Hayward Super II pump, DE 60 series filter, T-15 SWG
    Water feature, Hayward Northstar pump

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    sargent's Avatar
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    Re: Advice on motor replacement....home warranty involved

    I would get a 2-speed pump, but keep in mind the popup cleaners and spa probably will need more flow than what you will get on low.
    14k gal IG vinyl, Jandy Flopro 1 hp up-rated, 2 spd pump, Hayward 325 sq ft cartridge filter, Circupool Si-40 SWCG

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    Re: Advice on motor replacement....home warranty involved

    Quote Originally Posted by sargent View Post
    I would get a 2-speed pump, but keep in mind the popup cleaners and spa probably will need more flow than what you will get on low.
    Thanks for the reply. I'm a pool noob and this is one of my concerns. The spa I'm not worried about; I wouldn't mind having to kick it to high manually to use it. I am a bit concerned about the pop-up cleaners. They run in six separate groups (I believe it is six), and there are 21 in the pool and six in the spa. If the won't work properly on a lower speed I'm probably wasting my time. I don't have any dedicated returns, my pop-up cleaners are the only way water gets returned to the pool.
    19K PebbleTec in-ground with spa, Hayward Super II pump, DE 60 series filter, T-15 SWG
    Water feature, Hayward Northstar pump

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    sargent's Avatar
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    Re: Advice on motor replacement....home warranty involved

    I think the popups would return the water on low speed, but they wouldn't do a very good job of cleaning. If that is important to you, then you probably would be wasting money going to a two speed.
    14k gal IG vinyl, Jandy Flopro 1 hp up-rated, 2 spd pump, Hayward 325 sq ft cartridge filter, Circupool Si-40 SWCG

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    Mod Squad jblizzle's Avatar
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    Re: Advice on motor replacement....home warranty involved

    One of the mods has a 2 speed with an in floor system. He says he runs on low most of the time and while the pops do not fully open and move the dirt around, you still get circulation. You may want to add a timer to run on high for a few hours for the in-floor system and then on low the rest of the required time.

    This is certainly one of the downsides to those in-floor systems and many that use suction cleaners ... that you have to run on high for them to function properly.
    Jason, TFP Moderator
    18k IG pebblesheen pool, Hayward ProLogic P4 w/ T-15 SWG, Pentair 1HP 2-speed Superflo, Hayward 6020 DE filter
    500 sqft Heliocol solar panels, ThePoolCleaner, TF-100 test kit w/ SpeedStir
    Pool School + Test Kit + PoolMath = A TROUBLE FREE POOL
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    Mod Squad tim5055's Avatar
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    Re: Advice on motor replacement....home warranty involved

    Usually the home warranty companies have a set amount they will pay for a specific part. The pool company coming out can sell you anything you want, but you will pay the difference. The problem is that the pool company will probably have a higher price for a pump than you could find buying direct.
    TFP Moderator 39 X 18 23,000(ish) freeform gunite; built 2007ish; Pentair Triton II TR100 600lb Sand filter; 2 HP Pentair pump with 2.2 HP AO Smith single speed motor; 2 skimmers, 1 main drain, 4 returns w/waterfall, Stenner 45MHP2 3GPD running@ 60% - 15 gal Tank; heated by the sun CYA 200+ when I started - 50 now. Dolphin Supreme M5 Pool Cleaner. Hot Springs SX Spa, 285 gallon

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    Re: Advice on motor replacement....home warranty involved

    Thanks for all of the replies. tim5055, you're correct. (I'll rant about home warranty companies in a different thread) sargent and jbizzle have addressed my concerns and I'm still on the fence about what to do. The pool guy was out just a bit ago and the motor is fried.

    My options are:
    - Have the home warranty replace what I have with a remanufactured motor of similar specs for $60 (the cost of the service call...essentially the deductible).
    - Take the cash replacement value, which will probably be $190 ($250 minus the service call)

    If I take the cash, I can get whatever I want. That also means I either have to pay to get it installed or do it myself. If I accept the replacement I don't have to do anything.

    This decision shouldn't be this hard but I'm really struggling with it. I would normally welcome a project such as this because I think jobs like this are fun, but I bought this house six months ago and it's been a nightmare. I've been fixing things non-stop and shelling out piles of cash...I'm tired of it. That makes me lean towards replacement because I don't have to do the work.

    That said, I am energy and checkbook conscious and the appeal of a two-speed is strong. My concerns there are will it even work? I fear on low speed the pop-ups may not even engage (this may be an unfounded fear) and then I'd have a more expensive motor that can only do what the original could. One other factor is I would LOVE to have a quiet motor. My control board is already setup to handle multiple timers so I wouldn't have to invest in anything other than an additional wire.

    Can someone please sway me?
    19K PebbleTec in-ground with spa, Hayward Super II pump, DE 60 series filter, T-15 SWG
    Water feature, Hayward Northstar pump

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    Mike_W's Avatar
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    Re: Advice on motor replacement....home warranty involved

    If the lightning caused the motor failure, it might be covered by your homeowners insurance. I'd ask your agent.
    Mike
    ~17' x 34' IG pool with attached spa - 20500 gallons - Gunite with a "pebblesheen"-ish finish
    Jandy iAqualink with iPad and Jandy PDA remote - Pentair IntelliFlo VS 11018 Pump
    AquaRite SWCG - Pentair SMBW 4060 DE Filter - Really Old Raypak heater
    "Wall-E" an Arneson-Hayward Navigator - A couple of Jandy/Zodiac WaterColors LED Lights - Blue-White F-1000 Flow meter

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    Mod Squad tim5055's Avatar
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    Re: Advice on motor replacement....home warranty involved

    Quote Originally Posted by kchacker View Post
    Thanks for all of the replies. tim5055, you're correct. (I'll rant about home warranty companies in a different thread) sargent and jbizzle have addressed my concerns and I'm still on the fence about what to do. The pool guy was out just a bit ago and the motor is fried.

    My options are:
    - Have the home warranty replace what I have with a remanufactured motor of similar specs for $60 (the cost of the service call...essentially the deductible).
    - Take the cash replacement value, which will probably be $190 ($250 minus the service call)

    If I take the cash, I can get whatever I want. That also means I either have to pay to get it installed or do it myself. If I accept the replacement I don't have to do anything.

    This decision shouldn't be this hard but I'm really struggling with it. I would normally welcome a project such as this because I think jobs like this are fun, but I bought this house six months ago and it's been a nightmare. I've been fixing things non-stop and shelling out piles of cash...I'm tired of it. That makes me lean towards replacement because I don't have to do the work.

    That said, I am energy and checkbook conscious and the appeal of a two-speed is strong. My concerns there are will it even work? I fear on low speed the pop-ups may not even engage (this may be an unfounded fear) and then I'd have a more expensive motor that can only do what the original could. One other factor is I would LOVE to have a quiet motor. My control board is already setup to handle multiple timers so I wouldn't have to invest in anything other than an additional wire.

    Can someone please sway me?
    Look at it this way a week ago would you have said I think I'm going to switch to a two speed motor? Take the replacement and worry about a two speed later when you can do the proper research and you have the time for the project.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Mike_W View Post
    If the lightning caused the motor failure, it might be covered by your homeowners insurance. I'd ask your agent.
    Mike
    I doubt if it would even top most small deductibles. It is not uncommon for insurers to drop policies for too many claims. Check out Clark Howard's thoughts on homeowners insurance.
    TFP Moderator 39 X 18 23,000(ish) freeform gunite; built 2007ish; Pentair Triton II TR100 600lb Sand filter; 2 HP Pentair pump with 2.2 HP AO Smith single speed motor; 2 skimmers, 1 main drain, 4 returns w/waterfall, Stenner 45MHP2 3GPD running@ 60% - 15 gal Tank; heated by the sun CYA 200+ when I started - 50 now. Dolphin Supreme M5 Pool Cleaner. Hot Springs SX Spa, 285 gallon

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    Re: Advice on motor replacement....home warranty involved

    Quote Originally Posted by tim5055 View Post
    Look at it this way a week ago would you have said I think I'm going to switch to a two speed motor? Take the replacement and worry about a two speed later when you can do the proper research and you have the time for the project.
    A very level headed and reasonable response, and that was already the way I was leaning. I think my mind is made up. Thank you for the shove...it is appreciated more than you know.

    Now I'll get back to repairing the spa in the master bath, the leaky window and the busted yard lights. Or maybe I'll just jump out of a plane with no parachute.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Mike_W View Post
    If the lightning caused the motor failure, it might be covered by your homeowners insurance. I'd ask your agent.
    Mike
    I won't call my agent for anything unless it's really serious. I've been a homeowner for 15 years and made one claim, and that was on the advice of one of my golfing buddies who works for an insurance company and assured me my claim would be approved without question (and it was) and would also not impact my individual policy. The only special exemption I carry is for my golf clubs. I'd rather someone stole my car.
    19K PebbleTec in-ground with spa, Hayward Super II pump, DE 60 series filter, T-15 SWG
    Water feature, Hayward Northstar pump

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    Mod Squad tim5055's Avatar
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    Re: Advice on motor replacement....home warranty involved

    Quote Originally Posted by kchacker View Post
    A very level headed and reasonable response, and that was already the way I was leaning. I think my mind is made up. Thank you for the shove...it is appreciated more than you know.

    Now I'll get back to repairing the spa in the master bath, the leaky window and the busted yard lights. Or maybe I'll just jump out of a plane with no parachute.
    Nah, it will all be good. I'm on month 10 of a "new" 10 year old house. The projects are now starting to slow down so I can enjoy it.

    Don't beat yourself up too much take time to enjoy life. Pack a lunch, put every one in the car and take a ride up to Slide Rock State Park. Splash in the water, eat lunch and relax for a day. The projects will still be there when you get back. Ten years form now you will remember the good day of fun, the projects not so much.....
    TFP Moderator 39 X 18 23,000(ish) freeform gunite; built 2007ish; Pentair Triton II TR100 600lb Sand filter; 2 HP Pentair pump with 2.2 HP AO Smith single speed motor; 2 skimmers, 1 main drain, 4 returns w/waterfall, Stenner 45MHP2 3GPD running@ 60% - 15 gal Tank; heated by the sun CYA 200+ when I started - 50 now. Dolphin Supreme M5 Pool Cleaner. Hot Springs SX Spa, 285 gallon

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    Mike_W's Avatar
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    Re: Advice on motor replacement....home warranty involved

    Quote Originally Posted by kchacker View Post
    I won't call my agent for anything unless it's really serious. I've been a homeowner for 15 years and made one claim, and that was on the advice of one of my golfing buddies who works for an insurance company and assured me my claim would be approved without question (and it was) and would also not impact my individual policy.
    I wasn't suggesting that you file a claim - just that you enquire if it was covered (a replacement pump not just the motor), how much would be covered and the consequences to your premium. It sounds like you have a better source for insurance info than your agent, and you get to golf at the same time.
    Mike
    ~17' x 34' IG pool with attached spa - 20500 gallons - Gunite with a "pebblesheen"-ish finish
    Jandy iAqualink with iPad and Jandy PDA remote - Pentair IntelliFlo VS 11018 Pump
    AquaRite SWCG - Pentair SMBW 4060 DE Filter - Really Old Raypak heater
    "Wall-E" an Arneson-Hayward Navigator - A couple of Jandy/Zodiac WaterColors LED Lights - Blue-White F-1000 Flow meter

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    Re: Advice on motor replacement....home warranty involved

    Is it not possible to replace just the motor with a two speed one? Keeping the wet end. No plumbing required.
    chiefwej
    Tucson, AZ
    16x36 rectangular (19k) Pebble Tec play pool/spa, Pentair Intelliflo VS 011018, Super II 2hp (spa), Aqua Rite T-15 SWG, Pro Grid 60 DE, Hayward H400 & Heliocol Solar heating, A&A infloor system, fill water w/high CH and TA, 50 ppm borates,TF-100 test kit

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    Re: Advice on motor replacement....home warranty involved

    I suppose you could, but in my case, the seal plate was cracked, making full replacement cost effective.
    Pool size: 24000gal inground Vinyl-Taylor k-2006 and k-1766 test kits and-speed stir
    Intermatic P1353ME digital timer w/freeze sensor
    CircuPool Si-45 SWCG System
    Polaris 280 vacuum/Polaris PB4-60 boost pump
    Pentair IntelliFlo VS 3hp Pump--Pentair sand filter

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    Re: Advice on motor replacement....home warranty involved

    Quote Originally Posted by Mike_W View Post
    I wasn't suggesting that you file a claim - just that you enquire if it was covered (a replacement pump not just the motor), how much would be covered and the consequences to your premium. It sounds like you have a better source for insurance info than your agent, and you get to golf at the same time.
    Mike
    I do have a better source, which is fortunate on my part (the golf thing doesn't hurt either). If you do some digging, you'll find that even an inquiry can (possibly) hurt you even if you don't end up filing a claim. This varies from state to state, but I'd rather be safe than sorry. IMO, insurance is typically cheap enough that you can bump up your coverage and never use it, being out only a couple $K over the long run...but if I need it, I'll be glad I have it. That's why I keep the agent off the speed dial. I'll get quotes on anything and everything prior to calling my agent for anything. My only claim was for a roof after a hailstorm, and I wasn't even sure that particular storm was what damaged it. But I had coverage that didn't matter the cause, only that it was damaged. Had I filed a claim or not, my rates were likely to go up simply because of the wide spread storm. I chose to use it when I could and I knew I would be covered.

    Shorter version - I understand what you're recommending. It's it just unlikely it would have paid off, short or long term.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by chiefwej View Post
    Is it not possible to replace just the motor with a two speed one? Keeping the wet end. No plumbing required.
    Yes, it is. I only need the motor. If there weren't 15 other things wrong with the house I would replace it with a two speed. Circumstances are dictating my sanity at this point, making tim5055's advice even more useful.
    19K PebbleTec in-ground with spa, Hayward Super II pump, DE 60 series filter, T-15 SWG
    Water feature, Hayward Northstar pump

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