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Thread: Multi Questions

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    Question Multi Questions

    I have a 2418 oval again vinyl liner pool new this summer. 2 weeks ago I slacked on maintenance and algae built up a bit on the bottom (No chlorine) but water was still Chrystal clear. Once I vacuumed the pool all **** broke loose with dark green water. I been shocking with lots of bleach and quickly killed the algae but haven't made any progress on the blue cloudiness.

    my cartridge filter been cleaned and it doesn't seem to be collecting anything. The pressure doesn't change.

    Anyways my cya levels were non existing so I bought a 4 lb bucket and read somewhere that my pool size (12 gallons) would need about 6 lb to reach 40 ppm so I went and added the entire 4 lb bucket.... yeah I'm way over 100 now (just received by k-2006).

    My questions are should I / could I cover the pool as is? Or should i drain off half and refill to lower cya and work until water is clear?
    PH is 7.6 FC is 20 (shocking) CC is less then .5 and CH is 70-80 TO 60

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    Re: Multi Questions

    Well I went ahead and draining the water. I calculate getting it down to 17 inches deep will be 60% removed. It's at 28" now and it's still cloudy (blue). I been vacuuming to waste as well at sub pump and I can see bottom and there really isn't anything there. I had to quit due to rain but I added 2 Oz of some clarifier I just picked up at the drug store. 2 Oz is for 5,000 gallons as per the bottle. I'll return in the morning and have a look.

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    FlyAU98's Avatar
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    Re: Multi Questions

    If your CYA is really 100 you need a FC level of 39 for a proper SLAM.
    http://www.troublefreepool.com/conte...art-slam-shock
    15.5K gal, concrete, 1HP AO Smith pump, Hayward C1200 cartridge filter, Zodiac T5 Duo auto cleaner, 8 panel solar heater controlled by Hayward Aqua Solar GL-235

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    Mod Squad tim5055's Avatar
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    Re: Multi Questions

    You may need to drain more. 100 is the limit of the CYA test, so you have to do a diluted test. While the full instructions are in the Pool School, here is the short version. Mix 50% pool water with 50% tap water. Use this mixed sample as your test water. If still at a 100 you will need to dilute more. Here is a great chart by JamesW to explain dilution rates and what you multiply the results by to get an approximation of your CYA level.

    Pool water......Tap or distilled water.........Multiply result by

    ....1...................1................................2
    ....1...................2................................3
    ....1...................4................................5

    We do not "shock" our pools, we follow the SLAM Process when there is a problem.

    Once you get a good CYA number you can decide if you are going to drain and SLAM or just close the pool and work on it in the spring.
    TFP Moderator 39 X 18 23,000(ish) freeform gunite; built 2007ish; Pentair Triton II TR100 600lb Sand filter; 2 HP Pentair pump with 2.2 HP AO Smith single speed motor; 2 skimmers, 1 main drain, 4 returns w/waterfall, Stenner 45MHP2 3GPD running@ 60% - 15 gal Tank; heated by the sun CYA 200+ when I started - 50 now. Dolphin Supreme M5 Pool Cleaner. Hot Springs SX Spa, 285 gallon

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    Richard320's Avatar
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    Re: Multi Questions

    Welcome!

    How are you getting those readings? Test strips, pool store, ColorQ, Taylor drop test, or some other?

    You probably added 40-50 CYA to whatever was there. Most tests can't read well below 30, so worst case, you shouldn't be much more than 80 CYA. Which is why I wonder how you got those test results.

    100 CYA will make it extremely difficult to get a complete kill on all the algae, but before you start draining, you need to be sure of the CYA level. It's critical to the Shock Level And Maintain process.
    16K freeform gunite with spa; Pentair 4000 DE filter; Century Whisperflow 1 HP; Pentair Minimax heater.
    Troublefree does not mean Maintenancefree. It's like brushing your teeth: You can spend a couple minutes a day and pennies a week or go to the dentist once a year and spend several thousand dollars.
    A pool is like a pet - you have to feed it every day, even the days you don't want to play with it!

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    Re: Multi Questions

    Quote Originally Posted by Richard320 View Post
    Welcome!

    How are you getting those readings? Test strips, pool store, ColorQ, Taylor drop test, or some other?

    You probably added 40-50 CYA to whatever was there. Most tests can't read well below 30, so worst case, you shouldn't be much more than 80 CYA. Which is why I wonder how you got those test results.

    100 CYA will make it extremely difficult to get a complete kill on all the algae, but before you start draining, you need to be sure of the CYA level. It's critical to the Shock Level And Maintain process.
    I used to maintain the pol with a cheap drop kit from home depot. My pool was flawless all summer, but since this algae issue I just ordered and received the Taylor K-2006 so I can see whats going on with my shock levels of chlorine. My free chlorine was right about where I figured it was based on what I been adding, all other readings are pretty much in spec.

    PS this CYA was just added 2 days ago that's why I didn't correct my shock levels for 100 + CYA

    I do plan do lower the water more then 60%. There is no point filling the pool up and finding levels over 40 and not being happy. Id rather be at 30 and allow for creeping.

    I probably should have just covered the pool and dealt with it in the spring.

    - - - Updated - - -

    PS the black dot is NOT visible at all before the cloudy water even gets close to 100... I put the water back in the bottle and re checked numerous times and best I can get is 100.

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    Re: Multi Questions

    Today I started some cya small scale tests. 1 cup pool water and 1 cup hose water still had me around 60. I added one more cup of hose water and reached for the second vile of r-0013 and it's bad! Green gunk inside the cap and the liquid is the color of tea! Fuming right now...
    Guess I'll drain the pool down further then I planned...

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    Mod Squad tim5055's Avatar
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    Re: Multi Questions

    Quote Originally Posted by pelletpat View Post
    Today I started some cya small scale tests. 1 cup pool water and 1 cup hose water still had me around 60. I added one more cup of hose water and reached for the second vile of r-0013 and it's bad! Green gunk inside the cap and the liquid is the color of tea! Fuming right now...
    Guess I'll drain the pool down further then I planned...
    Well, if you got a 60 reading with a 1 - 1 dilution you are in the neighborhood of 120. Sorry about your reagent problem. You can order up some replacments from TFTestkits.net and have them in a couple of days. If you order today they will ship tomorrow from Raleigh, NC so it should be quick to NJ.

    No more clarifier or other stuff. Chlorine is your friend.
    TFP Moderator 39 X 18 23,000(ish) freeform gunite; built 2007ish; Pentair Triton II TR100 600lb Sand filter; 2 HP Pentair pump with 2.2 HP AO Smith single speed motor; 2 skimmers, 1 main drain, 4 returns w/waterfall, Stenner 45MHP2 3GPD running@ 60% - 15 gal Tank; heated by the sun CYA 200+ when I started - 50 now. Dolphin Supreme M5 Pool Cleaner. Hot Springs SX Spa, 285 gallon

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    Re: Multi Questions

    If you just bought the K-2006, the seller should certainly do something about your reagent problem!

    Still a good idea to get a larger container of the reagent from some other source; the K-2006 doesn't allow for a lot of CYA tests, as you've seen.
    18' x 48" ring top pool (Summer Escapes); 5500 gallons; set up June - October, stored during winter; Intex 2500 gph pump (B size cartridge filter) Hayward 21" sand filter + 1.5 hp single speed Powerflo Matrix pump (upgrade October 2016) *** K-2006 test kit, refills from tftestkits

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    Re: Multi Questions

    Welcome to the forum Pelletpat

    Please add your pools info to your signature as outlined here - - > http://www.troublefreepool.com/conte...etting-started
    '70s IG Vinyl 32K gal, Lazy L, Hayward SuperPump 1.5hp 120V, S240 Sand Filter W/DE
    Solar Blanket, Well Water, Borax Added, TF-100 tester. ? too cold
    1979, 275gal Conway Emerald Spa P-100-2, ES-2 Spa Pack, bromine floater, indoor
    TF-100, Best test kit - TFTestkits.net
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    Re: Multi Questions

    Today I started adjusting the freshly filled pool I drained it to 15 inches. Here were my initial results
    FC 1.2
    CC 0
    PH 7.0 and 2 drops to bring to 7.4 - 7.6
    TA 70
    CH 70
    Cya less than 50 but unknown do to bad agent in kit.

    I added 10 Oz of sodium carbonate by weight and ran the filter for about 30 min while topping off more fresh water.
    Now the PH is showing 8 I figured the added water would bring it down so I went ahead and added three 96 Oz bottles of 6% bleach and kept filtering but it's still giving me a pH of 8 and 2 drops to bring it down to 7.4

    I know I should not have added chlorine until pH was fixed but I felt uncomfortable with such low chlorine. The added bleach brought me to 12 FC and 0 CC

    now I'm not sure what I should do. I do have sodium bisulfate to lower ph and sodium bicarbonate to raise alkalinity but should I just leave it alone until the chlorine comes down?

    PS I have a bottle on cya reagents in the mail...

    - - - Updated - - -

    Link doesn't work for signature comment above....

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    Re: Multi Questions

    1. Here is what you need to put into your signature:

    Signature
    Please put the following information in your signature.

    The size of your pool in gallons
    If your pool is an AG (above ground) or IG (in ground)
    If it's IG, tell us if it's vinyl, plaster/pebble, or fiberglass
    The type of filter you have (sand, DE, cartridge) and, if you know, the brand and model of the filter.
    If you know, please tell us the brand and model of the pump, and mention if is it a two speed or variable speed pump.
    Date of pool build/install, particularly important if less then a year old.
    What kind/model of water test kit you are using
    Other significant accessories or options, such as a spa , SWG, or cleaner

    2. The PH test will falsely read high whenever your FC is above 10. Test PH whenever your FC levels get lower. Post the results so we can guide you.

    3. With a CYA of 50, your FC shock level is 20. http://www.troublefreepool.com/conte...art-slam-shock

    4. Test FC and CC hourly and add more bleach to bring your FC back up to shock levels. Run your pump 24 hours a day.
    Karen
    33K IG w spa plaster, Pentair 1HP Whisperflo, DE Filter, SWG CircuPool RJ-60, Dolphin Triton Plus, Raypak Dig 336K BTU, TF-100.
    Pool Math Chlorine / CYA Chart SLAM - Shock Level And Maintain
    2017 replaster/retile

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    Mod Squad tim5055's Avatar
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    Re: Multi Questions

    OK, here is the signature link

    If I am reading your sequence of events correctly you read pH of 8.0 BEFORE you added the bleach to take you above 10. If this is correct you can assume the 8.0 is a valid reading and use your sodium bisulfate to bring it down. I would say use Pool Math and figure how much you would need to bring it to 7.4 so you don't overshoot the low end as you can't properly test for it right now.

    Then SLAM away.
    TFP Moderator 39 X 18 23,000(ish) freeform gunite; built 2007ish; Pentair Triton II TR100 600lb Sand filter; 2 HP Pentair pump with 2.2 HP AO Smith single speed motor; 2 skimmers, 1 main drain, 4 returns w/waterfall, Stenner 45MHP2 3GPD running@ 60% - 15 gal Tank; heated by the sun CYA 200+ when I started - 50 now. Dolphin Supreme M5 Pool Cleaner. Hot Springs SX Spa, 285 gallon

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    Re: Multi Questions

    It was reading 7.0 then I added 10 ounces of sodium carbonate which is like half of what the calculator said to add but it jumped up to 8 but I assumed it would go down so I added bleach.

    I'm confused with your suggestions to slam and run filter 24/7
    The pool is Chrystal clear and bottom is vacuumed spotless and my goal is to put the cover on.

    Never mind I guess this needs to be done to make sure it's stable?
    24'18' above ground oval pole pool with vinyl liner.
    Cartridge filter (specs will be added later)

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    Re: Multi Questions

    Quote Originally Posted by pelletpat View Post
    It was reading 7.0 then I added 10 ounces of sodium carbonate which is like half of what the calculator said to add but it jumped up to 8 but I assumed it would go down so I added bleach.

    I'm confused with your suggestions to slam and run filter 24/7
    The pool is Chrystal clear and bottom is vacuumed spotless and my goal is to put the cover on.
    Well, I thought we were still dealing with the green pool. If you have already completed the SLAM disregard. Even with a water drain you will still have some residual algae around. At least do an Overnight FC Loss Test (OCLT) if you haven't already.

    If we are sure that the algae is a thing of the past I'd get teh pH in order before you put the cover on for the winter.
    TFP Moderator 39 X 18 23,000(ish) freeform gunite; built 2007ish; Pentair Triton II TR100 600lb Sand filter; 2 HP Pentair pump with 2.2 HP AO Smith single speed motor; 2 skimmers, 1 main drain, 4 returns w/waterfall, Stenner 45MHP2 3GPD running@ 60% - 15 gal Tank; heated by the sun CYA 200+ when I started - 50 now. Dolphin Supreme M5 Pool Cleaner. Hot Springs SX Spa, 285 gallon

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    Re: Multi Questions

    Thanks much. The real stress is that the pool is at my house what was destroyed by hurricane sandy and rebuilt but Sept first we had to move into an apartment because they are going to elevate my house and they needed to disconnect the gas.

    This means I been going back to the house at lease 2 times a day for this **** pool. I just want it covered at this point.
    24'18' above ground oval pole pool with vinyl liner.
    Cartridge filter (specs will be added later)

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    Re: Multi Questions

    I'm so sorry that you lost your house. I can't image having to start all over and may your recovery go as smoothly as possible.

    You could make sure that you PH is in a good spot, cover the pool now to reduce chlorine demand, run the pump a few hours a day and add a little bleach twice a week to bring to shock levels. You can close in a few weeks as the temperatures drop. While this suggestion won't be 100% sanitary, it should protect your equipment and keep you from opening the pool next year to a nightmare.

    Best of luck!
    Karen
    33K IG w spa plaster, Pentair 1HP Whisperflo, DE Filter, SWG CircuPool RJ-60, Dolphin Triton Plus, Raypak Dig 336K BTU, TF-100.
    Pool Math Chlorine / CYA Chart SLAM - Shock Level And Maintain
    2017 replaster/retile

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    Re: Multi Questions

    So I'm back at the house filter been running all day.
    FC is now 5.5 and PH is between 7.4 and 7.6 which is where my added sodium carbonate should have landed it.

    Again the water is crystal clean and when I was draining it to to only 15" remaining a lot of that removal was from vacuuming to waste. Once it was 15" I clearly saw and sucked up remaining spots on bottom.

    I only have 1 96 Oz bottle of 6% left so I'm going to dump in after I add a little sodium bicarbonate to raise the alkalinity and I'll see where I am tomorrow.

    Edit
    I only have 34 Oz and the book says 4 lb to raise 30ppm.
    I'm at 70 so I guess this will leave me around 85 I guess it's better to do little at a time anyway.
    24'18' above ground oval pole pool with vinyl liner.
    Cartridge filter (specs will be added later)

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    Re: Multi Questions

    Does it make sense that 1 96 Oz bottle of 6% took me from 5.5fc to 12 FC ?
    24'18' above ground oval pole pool with vinyl liner.
    Cartridge filter (specs will be added later)

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    Re: Multi Questions

    Quote Originally Posted by pelletpat View Post
    I'm at 70 so I guess this will leave me around 85 I guess it's better to do little at a time anyway.
    Not sure what you are raising, so I can't comment.

    Quote Originally Posted by pelletpat View Post
    I only have 34 Oz and the book says 4 lb to raise 30ppm.
    Again, not sure what you are raising.

    If you are talking about TA, a TA of 70 is okay. TA helps keep PH from swinging wildly. Here is a list of recommended levels:
    http://www.troublefreepool.com/conte...mmended-levels

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by pelletpat View Post
    Does it make sense that 1 96 Oz bottle of 6% took me from 5.5fc to 12 FC ?
    We would need the size of your pool in gallons... please add your pool size in gallons to your signature. For help in determining pool volume refer to the "Estimating pool volume" at the bottom of pool math: http://www.troublefreepool.com/calc.html
    Karen
    33K IG w spa plaster, Pentair 1HP Whisperflo, DE Filter, SWG CircuPool RJ-60, Dolphin Triton Plus, Raypak Dig 336K BTU, TF-100.
    Pool Math Chlorine / CYA Chart SLAM - Shock Level And Maintain
    2017 replaster/retile

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