Become a TFP Supporter Pool Math Forum Rules Pool School
Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 20 of 31

Thread: Pool bid outside of Boston, thoughts…..

  1. Back To Top    #1

    Join Date
    May 2013
    Location
    Needham, MA
    Posts
    124

    Pool bid outside of Boston, thoughts…..

    I was hoping to be able to post two bids from the builders I liked the best that came out to my house. However, one has been very slow to get back with me and takes their time in answering any questions. They are a very small company in comparison of the two, and have not been around nearly as long as the other company. Looks like they are making my decision easier on who to go with by the day.

    I had five builders come out and give me quotes. They were all within $5000 of each other. This quote is from the builder I liked best. They were the highest in price, but I liked them by far the best. What do you all think?

    * Inground 24x12, polymer walls, vermiculite bottom, vinyl freeform custom pool. We can play with the size of the pool at no additional cost as long as we don't exceed 300 sq feet.
    * 28ml liner sides, 20ml floor.
    * Lifetime structural warranty.
    * 20 year pro rated liner warranty.
    * Contractors CAD drawings and landscape design.
    * Permits from the town.
    * 1 day of allowance of layout and excavate fill.
    * Hydrostatic relief valve and 20 tons of stone allowance.
    * One truckload of processed gravel for backfill.
    * Pentair FNS cartridge filter with polymer tank.
    * Pentair Whisperflo pump, 1HP.
    * AquaPure 1400 SWCG.
    * One skimmer with weir gate, and three surface return lines.
    * Two "Anti Vortex" covered main drains T'd together for safety against entrapment.
    * Pre-Plumbed dedicated line for Polaris.
    * Polaris 280
    * 2 500 watt lights (upgrade available for colored LED)
    * Loop Loc winter cover installed.
    * 12" bull nose rounded paver coping around entire perimeter of pool.

    $37,860.

  2. Back To Top    #2
    Divin Dave's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2013
    Location
    Longview, Texas
    Posts
    4,926

    Re: Pool bid outside of Boston, thoughts…..

    Couple of comments
    Make sure the pump is a 2 Speed pump and not a 1 speed pump.
    You do not need (2) 500 watt lights. 1 will be way more than enough for that size pool.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Couple of comments
    Make sure the pump is a 2 Speed pump and not a 1 speed pump.
    You do not need (2) 500 watt lights. 1 will be way more than enough for that size pool.
    I dont see a booster pump on the list which the Polaris 280 requires. Is the booster pump included with the Polaris?
    Divin Dave,
    IG Vinyl, 15' x 30', 3 1/2' - 6' deep, Oval, ~15K gal, Intelliclor IC40, Intelliflo VS pump, Clean and Clear 420 Filter, auto-fill-disabled, Retrofit LED Color Light, Dolphin Nautilus Robot, TF100 Test Kit, Taylor K1766 Salt Test Kit, Tftestkit Pressure Gauge.
    www.tftestkits.net Experience- it's what's learned just after you needed it most !!

  3. Back To Top    #3
    bulldogz400's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2014
    Location
    Las Vegas
    Posts
    128

    Re: Pool bid outside of Boston, thoughts…..

    Agree with Divin Dave. How much extra to upgrade to LED light(s)?
    IG gunite 32 x 18 on a bachelor budget! Click Here To See

  4. Back To Top    #4

    Join Date
    May 2013
    Location
    Needham, MA
    Posts
    124

    Re: Pool bid outside of Boston, thoughts…..

    Quote Originally Posted by Divin Dave View Post
    Couple of comments
    Make sure the pump is a 2 Speed pump and not a 1 speed pump.
    You do not need (2) 500 watt lights. 1 will be way more than enough for that size pool.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Couple of comments
    Make sure the pump is a 2 Speed pump and not a 1 speed pump.
    You do not need (2) 500 watt lights. 1 will be way more than enough for that size pool.
    I dont see a booster pump on the list which the Polaris 280 requires. Is the booster pump included with the Polaris?
    The cut sheet that I have on the pump says its a 2 speed. Looking at the bid again, it says "Polaris 280 with dedicated pump". I know they a plumbing a line for it too, so can I assume this is the booster pump?

    The salesman said that 2 500 watt lights is standard with their bids, but like you he feels that I could probably get away with just 1. It would knock $500 off the price if I just get 1, or I could just upgrade to the LED colored lights at almost the same price as the 2 500 watt lights.

  5. Back To Top    #5
    bulldogz400's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2014
    Location
    Las Vegas
    Posts
    128

    Re: Pool bid outside of Boston, thoughts…..

    I'm partial to the LED because of the cool light shows as well as considerably less energy consumption.

    Seeing that you are going with mostly Pentair equipment, the Intellibrite LED has a pretty broad range of capabilities. Speaking of Pentair, I wonder why the PB is switching to Jandy for the salt water generator instead of the Pentair IC series? Pentair offers a 3 year warranty on their items when you "bundle" 3 or more of their products. Pump, filter, and one other item (or more). Might be something to talk to the PB about.
    IG gunite 32 x 18 on a bachelor budget! Click Here To See

  6. Back To Top    #6

    Join Date
    Aug 2014
    Location
    Mansfield, TX
    Posts
    82

    Re: Pool bid outside of Boston, thoughts…..

    Price is so hard to compare across time zones because of labor costs, permitting, etc. For here (Texas) price seems a little high, but could be great for your area.

    Only thing I will say is I will echo the thought of getting the one LED light for the same price of two 500-watts. The one LED will use less power and will light up your size pool very well.
    14,700 IG chlorine, NPT mini pebble Midnight Blue built 7/14
    Jandy cartridge filter, 2.0 HP Jandy E-pump variable speed
    Taylor K-2005C test kit
    15' weeping wall water feature, Jandy LED, Polaris 3900 Sport cleaner
    Aqualink PDA

  7. Back To Top    #7

    Join Date
    Jun 2014
    Location
    Tucson, AZ
    Posts
    860

    Re: Pool bid outside of Boston, thoughts…..

    Thoughts -

    1. Switch out the Jandy SWG for a Pentair IC40 and get the bundled warranty
    2. I'd go with a DE filter (Pentair QuadDE) over a straight cartridge filter for better water clarity unless you have restrictions in your area against DE
    3. Make sure the skimmer and main drains are plumbed separately to the pump with control valves as opposed to having the MDs connected in series with the skimmer. Shouldn't add too much to the overall plumbing cost but the upside is you get much better control over your water intake.

    As for the PB that's slow to respond....dump him! You are about to spend a small fortune on a very significant upgrade to your home that will be a huge disruption to your private life for about 2 months or so when the build gets started. That PB should be begging you for the work and responding to your ever request in a timely fashion. His attitude at this point indicates he would be a very bad choice.

    Also, get a build schedule in writing and make sure your payment schedule approximates something like 30-30-30-10. Hold that last 10% check UNTIL AFTER the pool is started up and your punch-list of cleanup and final details are completed. Believe me, you will not be the PBs only customer and he will likely have several jobs going at once or he will be starting a new job as yours comes to an end. The only way to keep their attention throughout the ENTIRE process is to withhold final payment until you are satisfied.

    One final thought - I'm not a huge fan of DIY jobs but there are many people on this forum who have posted threads detailing their entire DIY pool builds. INteresting stuff that you might want to investigate as it could save you as much as 30% off a PB's bid. As far as I can tell, the only downside to DIY is the amount of time you will have to spend researching and learning the business of pool construction as well as tracking down and negotiating with sub-contractors to do the work. If you like that sort of stuff, it may be the way to go.

    Good luck and please post lots of pictures when you finally start your pool build!!

  8. Back To Top    #8

    Join Date
    May 2013
    Location
    Needham, MA
    Posts
    124

    Re: Pool bid outside of Boston, thoughts…..

    Quote Originally Posted by TXHeat View Post
    Price is so hard to compare across time zones because of labor costs, permitting, etc. For here (Texas) price seems a little high, but could be great for your area.

    Only thing I will say is I will echo the thought of getting the one LED light for the same price of two 500-watts. The one LED will use less power and will light up your size pool very well.
    Yes, this is the average cost for this region of the country. Like I said, this was the highest quote I received by about $5000 from the cheapest. This quote however does have the paver coping and polymer structure so at the end of the day they are in the same ball park.

  9. Back To Top    #9

    Join Date
    May 2013
    Location
    Needham, MA
    Posts
    124

    Re: Pool bid outside of Boston, thoughts…..

    Quote Originally Posted by SunnyOptimism View Post
    Thoughts -

    1. Switch out the Jandy SWG for a Pentair IC40 and get the bundled warranty
    2. I'd go with a DE filter (Pentair QuadDE) over a straight cartridge filter for better water clarity unless you have restrictions in your area against DE
    3. Make sure the skimmer and main drains are plumbed separately to the pump with control valves as opposed to having the MDs connected in series with the skimmer. Shouldn't add too much to the overall plumbing cost but the upside is you get much better control over your water intake.

    As for the PB that's slow to respond....dump him! You are about to spend a small fortune on a very significant upgrade to your home that will be a huge disruption to your private life for about 2 months or so when the build gets started. That PB should be begging you for the work and responding to your ever request in a timely fashion. His attitude at this point indicates he would be a very bad choice.

    Also, get a build schedule in writing and make sure your payment schedule approximates something like 30-30-30-10. Hold that last 10% check UNTIL AFTER the pool is started up and your punch-list of cleanup and final details are completed. Believe me, you will not be the PBs only customer and he will likely have several jobs going at once or he will be starting a new job as yours comes to an end. The only way to keep their attention throughout the ENTIRE process is to withhold final payment until you are satisfied.

    One final thought - I'm not a huge fan of DIY jobs but there are many people on this forum who have posted threads detailing their entire DIY pool builds. INteresting stuff that you might want to investigate as it could save you as much as 30% off a PB's bid. As far as I can tell, the only downside to DIY is the amount of time you will have to spend researching and learning the business of pool construction as well as tracking down and negotiating with sub-contractors to do the work. If you like that sort of stuff, it may be the way to go.

    Good luck and please post lots of pictures when you finally start your pool build!!
    Originally the PB had included in his quote a Pentair Heat Pump (no gas here), but I had asked him to remove that to reduce costs. Seeing as how the pool will be small, and in direct sun all day I figured I could go one season without it, but add it on later if we felt the need. That would have given me the extended warranty. I will ask him about the Pentair SWCG. In the past when I asked why they use specific pieces he response was, "we only like to install what we service". If they are reluctant to go with the Pentair SWCG, I wonder if it would be worth it to go with the heat pump right away. I know my wife really wants a heater anyways.

    On the issue of the DE filter, local code does not allow it.

    I too love the idea of the colored LED, but not nearly as much as my wife. Once she saw the cut sheet on that she was sold.

  10. Back To Top    #10
    Divin Dave's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2013
    Location
    Longview, Texas
    Posts
    4,926

    Re: Pool bid outside of Boston, thoughts…..

    Good deal on the pump for the Polaris. Sounds good.
    I think the PB is just putting a bit more icing on the cake with 2 lights being "standard". You shuldnt need 2 lights till you get up to about the 34-36 feet long range. Mine is 30 and 1 light wayyy more than lit it up.

    Im in agreement about trading the extra light to a LED upgrade. The LED are cool and dont attract as many bugs either. And the cost of electricity is well tremendously less than the incandescent. (cut my bill by about 30 month when I changed to LED).

    I also agree with previous comment about your Main drain be plumbed seperately from the skimmer.

    Quote Originally Posted by rmclain73 View Post
    The cut sheet that I have on the pump says its a 2 speed. Looking at the bid again, it says "Polaris 280 with dedicated pump". I know they a plumbing a line for it too, so can I assume this is the booster pump?

    The salesman said that 2 500 watt lights is standard with their bids, but like you he feels that I could probably get away with just 1. It would knock $500 off the price if I just get 1, or I could just upgrade to the LED colored lights at almost the same price as the 2 500 watt lights.
    Divin Dave,
    IG Vinyl, 15' x 30', 3 1/2' - 6' deep, Oval, ~15K gal, Intelliclor IC40, Intelliflo VS pump, Clean and Clear 420 Filter, auto-fill-disabled, Retrofit LED Color Light, Dolphin Nautilus Robot, TF100 Test Kit, Taylor K1766 Salt Test Kit, Tftestkit Pressure Gauge.
    www.tftestkits.net Experience- it's what's learned just after you needed it most !!

  11. Back To Top    #11

    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    New Hampshire
    Posts
    350

    Re: Pool bid outside of Boston, thoughts…..

    Can I ask who you went with? My builder was from Mass and my pool is bigger than that and was much less expensive. I was just curious. You can PM Me if you want. I am a fan of 2 lights, I have 1 LED light and it does not fill up my whole pool and mine is only 32 ft long.
    18k: IG: Black Granite Liner: Aspen: 16x33.5: SWG: Polaris 280

    My pool build new-pool-build-in-nh-t60957.html

  12. Back To Top    #12

    Join Date
    May 2013
    Location
    Needham, MA
    Posts
    124

    Re: Pool bid outside of Boston, thoughts…..

    Quote Originally Posted by doobs41378 View Post
    Can I ask who you went with? My builder was from Mass and my pool is bigger than that and was much less expensive. I was just curious. You can PM Me if you want. I am a fan of 2 lights, I have 1 LED light and it does not fill up my whole pool and mine is only 32 ft long.
    PM sent

  13. Back To Top    #13


    TFP Guide

    bmoreswim's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Location
    Central MD
    Posts
    3,294

    Re: Pool bid outside of Boston, thoughts…..

    Agreed. If you go with LED it would need to be two. I'm not sure if that was your plan. One would be ok for the 500w. If you wait on the heater just make sure the pad is plumbed/spaced out sufficiently and the electrical line/breakers are up to snuff so when/if you are ready to pull the trigger later it will be plug and play.
    18'x38' Rectangle (3'-8 1/2' deep w/ diving board) - 27K gal. w/ gray plaster
    Hayward equipment (cartridge filter, 2-speed pump, SWCG, automation) View Our Build
    Coverstar automatic pool cover | StoneMakers concrete retaining wall and decking
    Spring 2013 Build | Dolphin Active 20 robot cleaner | Support TFP!

  14. Back To Top    #14

    Join Date
    Jun 2014
    Location
    Tucson, AZ
    Posts
    860

    Pool bid outside of Boston, thoughts…..

    Quote Originally Posted by rmclain73 View Post
    Originally the PB had included in his quote a Pentair Heat Pump (no gas here), but I had asked him to remove that to reduce costs. Seeing as how the pool will be small, and in direct sun all day I figured I could go one season without it, but add it on later if we felt the need. That would have given me the extended warranty. I will ask him about the Pentair SWCG. In the past when I asked why they use specific pieces he response was, "we only like to install what we service". If they are reluctant to go with the Pentair SWCG, I wonder if it would be worth it to go with the heat pump right away. I know my wife really wants a heater anyways.

    On the issue of the DE filter, local code does not allow it.

    I too love the idea of the colored LED, but not nearly as much as my wife. Once she saw the cut sheet on that she was sold.
    Do local codes allow you to use a DE filter but instead of DE you can use cellulose fiber which is biodegradable and not as hazardous as DE?

    I'm not a big fan of heat pumps (basically an A/C run in reverse). Any chance solar-thermal will work where you are? You'll definitely want a heater to extend your swimming season.



  15. Back To Top    #15

    Join Date
    May 2013
    Location
    Needham, MA
    Posts
    124

    Re: Pool bid outside of Boston, thoughts…..

    Some folks here are saying go with 2 LED lights, others are saying 1. Pool will be only 24-26 feet long. The widest spot will be no more than 14. It's a free form, but more less a kidney shaped. The PB seemed to think 1 should cut it, but of course he was speaking on the 500 watt. It was my impression that the LED lights are brighter?

  16. Back To Top    #16

    Join Date
    Jun 2014
    Location
    Tucson, AZ
    Posts
    860

    Pool bid outside of Boston, thoughts…..

    Quote Originally Posted by rmclain73 View Post
    Some folks here are saying go with 2 LED lights, others are saying 1. Pool will be only 24-26 feet long. The widest spot will be no more than 14. It's a free form, but more less a kidney shaped. The PB seemed to think 1 should cut it, but of course he was speaking on the 500 watt. It was my impression that the LED lights are brighter?
    I think one light fixture should be more than enough.

    Brightness is only one component. There's also the color temperature difference between LED/Incandescent. It depends a lot on the LED manufacturer and the quality control used in selecting the LED parts. Some people think that the LED light is "too blue/white" and looks clinical like fluorescent lighting. But it all depends on how good the manufacturer is at adding in a little yellow component to the light.

    Any chance you'd have an opportunity up see one in action? That might help a lot since lighting is very subjective.



  17. Back To Top    #17


    TFP Guide

    bmoreswim's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Location
    Central MD
    Posts
    3,294

    Re: Pool bid outside of Boston, thoughts…..

    My Hayward LED lights are not as bright individually as an incandescent. Even white to white. But the real factor to consider is that with the color lights, you will love the color shows so much you will want to use them. The colors are much less bright than an incandescent. One will likely be borderline bright enough. Deeper equals darker.
    18'x38' Rectangle (3'-8 1/2' deep w/ diving board) - 27K gal. w/ gray plaster
    Hayward equipment (cartridge filter, 2-speed pump, SWCG, automation) View Our Build
    Coverstar automatic pool cover | StoneMakers concrete retaining wall and decking
    Spring 2013 Build | Dolphin Active 20 robot cleaner | Support TFP!

  18. Back To Top    #18

    Join Date
    Jun 2014
    Location
    Tucson, AZ
    Posts
    860

    Pool bid outside of Boston, thoughts…..

    In my opinion, it would also depend a lot on if you think you'll be doing significant amounts night swimming. I've run into some folks who have two light fixtures (incandescent) in the main pool because they want it to be super-bright for swimming at night. If all you think you'll use the night lighting for is landscape scenery, then a lower brightness LED with all the fancy "light show" programs might be a better choice.

    My $0.02 summary - it has nothing to do with which one is better than the other. It has everything to do with what you want to use it for.




  19. Back To Top    #19

    Join Date
    May 2013
    Location
    Needham, MA
    Posts
    124

    Re: Pool bid outside of Boston, thoughts…..

    I spoke with the PB last night and discussed everything that was mentioned here in this thread. We are working in drafting up a new bid to reflect some of the changes I requested. I thank you all for your input and help.

    One thing he and I did talk about, and I am not sure which way to go, is the speed on the pump. It will be the Pentair Whisperflo. The pump comes in 1 or 2 speeds. I told him that I would want the 2 speed, but he was thinking I would be fine with just the single speed. His reasoning for this was, depending upon the final agreed size of the small pool, I would more than likely be getting a 3/4 HP or 1HP pump. He is thinking the 3/4 HP will be the one. He claims that this pump is pretty energy efficient, and here in the Boston area our energy rates are constant as opposed to other parts of the world where rates increase in the summer months and/or during peak hours.

    At the end of the day its my decision of course, but I am interested in your thoughts on how much savings and ROI I would see with the 2 speed on this model over a New England swim season.

  20. Back To Top    #20


    TFP Guide

    bmoreswim's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Location
    Central MD
    Posts
    3,294

    Re: Pool bid outside of Boston, thoughts…..

    Are 2-speed pumps quieter than single speed? On low our 2-speed is almost silent. On hi it's noisy/distracting.
    18'x38' Rectangle (3'-8 1/2' deep w/ diving board) - 27K gal. w/ gray plaster
    Hayward equipment (cartridge filter, 2-speed pump, SWCG, automation) View Our Build
    Coverstar automatic pool cover | StoneMakers concrete retaining wall and decking
    Spring 2013 Build | Dolphin Active 20 robot cleaner | Support TFP!

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •