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Thread: Is there any difference for poolcare for Europe?

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    Is there any difference for poolcare for Europe?

    OK, to start off I'm just a new pool owner. Our pool Was first filled with water on june 24, but pumpstation wasn't connected that time. Because there was a lot of other work around the pool (placing tiles, lot of sand work, etc.) the water became very dirty / greenish.
    We thought is was algue, also due to the water not being moved by the pump. My father (a pool owner for 18 years) put in 2 pucks and 1 liter of anti-algue. We use a temorarly pump to get the water moved.
    As soon as all the hosing and pump was installed we started moving the water and vacuuming. Turned out it wasn't algue at all, the horrible look of the water was lots of sand and dirt on the bottim of the pool.
    Whe started vacuuming and vacuuming until all was clear.
    About 9 days after putting in the pugs, I added 200 kilo pool-salt and let the pump filter for more than 24 hours.
    Two days after putting in the salt, I removed the remaining of the pugs and turned the SGW on. At the moment we did our first tests with Tru Aqucheck. pH was to high (8.4) and FC to low (0.4).
    From that moment I started to treat my pool as follow:
    minimum of 8 hours running pump (usually from 09:00 to 17:00)
    1 to 2 hours per day SWG on 100%

    Since opening of the pool I used about 5 liters of anti-algue, but try to keep this as low as possible because I feel there is no need for it (supported by the info that I need less anti-algue products with SWG).
    I used some pugs with 'flake stuff'. Don't now the English translation for it. It is ued to bind the most tiny stuff together so it can be filtered by the sand.
    I have sparkling clear water with this treatment. There was only 1 occassion I had some cloudy water:

    On a saturday monring, after a week of cold days, I turned on the heatpump. Therefore I changed the faucets on the pumpstation. I closed the faucet on the inlet of the vacuum-hose (normally the pump sucks water through 2 skimmers and 1 vaccum connection), and turned the bypass to the heatpump half open. I pumped and heated for 8 hours. Next day I did the same. The 3rd day that heatpump was turned off, but normal circulation still was going through bypass/heatpump.
    At the end of day 3 I noticed the water was white cloudy/misty. I closed the bypass and opened the valve of the vacuum connection. Now the pump was sucking a lot of more water. I vacuumed the entire pool, added half a liter anti-algue (just to be sure) and kept pumping for the rest of the night. Next morning normal pumping hours and at the end of the day the pool was clear again.


    At this moment I check my water with the Tru Aquachec and act based on the values. One thing I'm struggling with is that my pH keeps rising every time. I have to add 6 coffecups once a week to get done from 8+ to 7.2 - still have to test the H of tapwater used for adding water after backwash.
    Most of the time 1 to 2 hours SWG per day is enough, when it gets to low I run it longer.

    I have the Tru Aquachec, but I finf it to fluctuating due to the used method (use light to interpret the values) the device uses. I haven't found the recommended tests in The Netherlands yet, so I'm looking for a seller to ship to me as low as possible.

    Is the methodm, and numbers, mentoined in TFPC usuable for countrys outside US? We have other climate, conditions and water overhere.

    My pool is 8 meters by 4 meters and 1.5 meters deep, so roughly it has 42.000 liters swimmable water.

    Thanks for helping out.

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    Mod Squad jblizzle's Avatar
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    Re: Is there any difference for poolcare for Europe?

    So the European water is different than our water? Is it not h2o?

    The chemistry is exactly the same everywhere in the world.
    Jason, TFP Moderator
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    Re: Is there any difference for poolcare for Europe?

    Things are more difficult in Europe from what I understand. Test kits are more difficult to find, as are big jugs of high-strength Sodium Hypochlorite aka laundry bleach.

    A few old threads that may help:
    http://www.troublefreepool.com/threa...learned-so-far
    http://www.troublefreepool.com/threa...kits-in-the-UK

    For liquid bleach, if you're in a rural area, check the farm supply places. A lot of times they sell dairy barn sanitizer, which is 12.5% Sodium Hypochlorite, which is pool chlorine under a different name.
    16K freeform gunite with spa; Pentair 4000 DE filter; Century Whisperflow 1 HP; Pentair Minimax heater.
    Troublefree does not mean Maintenancefree. It's like brushing your teeth: You can spend a couple minutes a day and pennies a week or go to the dentist once a year and spend several thousand dollars.
    A pool is like a pet - you have to feed it every day, even the days you don't want to play with it!

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    Re: Is there any difference for poolcare for Europe?

    Quote Originally Posted by jblizzle View Post
    So the European water is different than our water? Is it not h2o?
    From what I understand, but that may be a mistake, is that in some regions in USA you need extra filtering in the tapwater system. That is what I mean. Also, the climate is different than USA.

    Quote Originally Posted by Richard320 View Post
    Things are more difficult in Europe from what I understand. Test kits are more difficult to find, as are big jugs of high-strength Sodium Hypochlorite aka laundry bleach.

    A few old threads that may help:
    http://www.troublefreepool.com/threa...learned-so-far
    http://www.troublefreepool.com/threa...kits-in-the-UK

    For liquid bleach, if you're in a rural area, check the farm supply places. A lot of times they sell dairy barn sanitizer, which is 12.5% Sodium Hypochlorite, which is pool chlorine under a different name.
    Thanks, will take a look at the topics.

    Why should I need big jugs of bleach, if I have SWG?

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    Richard320's Avatar
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    Re: Is there any difference for poolcare for Europe?

    Quote Originally Posted by koffie View Post
    From what I understand, but that may be a mistake, is that in some regions in USA you need extra filtering in the tapwater system. That is what I mean. Also, the climate is different than USA.



    Thanks, will take a look at the topics.

    Why should I need big jugs of bleach, if I have SWG?
    Didn't read close enough. You don't. Unless you get an algae bloom.
    16K freeform gunite with spa; Pentair 4000 DE filter; Century Whisperflow 1 HP; Pentair Minimax heater.
    Troublefree does not mean Maintenancefree. It's like brushing your teeth: You can spend a couple minutes a day and pennies a week or go to the dentist once a year and spend several thousand dollars.
    A pool is like a pet - you have to feed it every day, even the days you don't want to play with it!

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    Mod Squad jblizzle's Avatar
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    Re: Is there any difference for poolcare for Europe?

    How is your climate different? We have members from Alaska, Florida, Arizona, Minnesota ... those are pretty big climate differences. Also many from Australia and other places around the world. As well as indoor and outdoor pools.

    The chemistry is the same. How you achieve that chemistry may vary to what is available to you.

    Your climate and water is not special
    Jason, TFP Moderator
    18k IG pebblesheen pool, Hayward ProLogic P4 w/ T-15 SWG, Pentair 1HP 2-speed Superflo, Hayward 6020 DE filter
    500 sqft Heliocol solar panels, ThePoolCleaner, TF-100 test kit w/ SpeedStir
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    Re: Is there any difference for poolcare for Europe?

    The Palintest SP 315C is the best drop-based test kit you can get in Europe. Unfortunately, it's a DPD chlorine test even though Palintest makes a FAS-DPD test but that is not available much in Europe (though you can ask or check).

    If you maintain the appropriate FC level for your CYA level, then you shouldn't need any anti-algae products at all (see the Chlorine / CYA Chart SWG Pools section).

    As for your pH rising, your Total Alkalinity (TA) may be too high. See if you can get it down to 60-70 ppm. Unfortunately, I don't think you can easily get boric acid or borax in Europe (because in concentrated form it has problems for reproduction, but pool quantities are very low and it doesn't absorb through the skin); otherwise, you could add 50 ppm Borates to the pool for greater pH stability.
    16,000 gallon outdoor in-ground 16'x32' plaster pool; Pentair Intelliflo VF pump; Pentair IntelliTouch i9+3s control system; Jandy CL-340 square foot cartridge filter
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    Re: Is there any difference for poolcare for Europe?

    A to low TA would make the pH go up and down to fast, the higher the TA how stable it gets? A TA of 60 ppm sounds a little low to me, should't that be in the 80-100 range?

    I can buy Palintest (with tablets) fo 25 euro overhere, but I would prefer the Taylor K2006 testkit, but I need to find out how to get it from USA to The Netherlands.
    Fortunately I can buy Arm & Hammer baking soda for 1,50 EUR per box here. I added 2 boxes (almost 1 kilo) to the pool yesterday and tested 2 hours later: it went from 50 to 60. I will test later today again (24 hours after adding).

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    Re: Is there any difference for poolcare for Europe?

    Did some research on what kind of stuff to buy over here for the TFPC or BBB method.

    Borax : Found this online, but is not cheaper (6 euro per kilo) than normal 'pH minus' buckets
    Baking soda: Available online or at a 'toko' for 1,50 a box
    Muriatic Acid : Not sure yet, I believe this would be normal 'zoutzuur' : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hydrochloric_acid

    The poolcalculator tells me I should use about 702 ml muriatic acid to lower my pool of 42000 liters from pH 8.5 to 7.5 a jug of 5 liters muriatic acid (30%) costs about 16 euro. Compare to a bucket of pH min : 16 euro for 5 kilo

    So for now I could start testing with Baking Soda and muriatic acid (allthough I just bought 14 kilo's of pH minus)

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    Re: Is there any difference for poolcare for Europe?

    Borax is used to increase pH, while "pH minus" is used to reduce pH, is there a reason why you are comparing both of them to each other?

    Yes, muriatic acid = hydrochloric acid.
    Your use of the term "zoutzuur" suggests that you speak Dutch, can you please add your location to your profile?

    We do not normally advise the use of dry acid (pH minus) as it adds sulphates.

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    Re: Is there any difference for poolcare for Europe?

    Sorry, was a mistake. I mean pH Plus. Borax is more expensive than pH Plus overhere (pH plus or minus allmost costs the same)
    I'm not sure what is in my pH Minus (powder), will have to read the bucket when it arrives.

    I'll take a look at the profile

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    Re: Is there any difference for poolcare for Europe?

    Borax is a little harder to get in NL "In Europe borax and boric acid have been classified as reproductive poisons, and since December 2010 no longer available to the public within the EU. Presently borax is still available in Switzerland (15), but shipment to Germany is not permitted. In Germany a small amount (20 - 50 grams) may be ordered through a pharmacy as ant poison, it will be registered. Borax is presently still available from www.ebay.co.uk and can be shipped to other EU countries.". You might check with blacksmiths, as far as I understand they also use it...
    As far as the test kit, let me know if I can help by buying it and shipping it for you. My hubs is Dutch, got a Rabobank account where you could deposit refund. I'd be happy to help you out if you can't find something equivalent out there.
    Groetjes!
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    Re: Is there any difference for poolcare for Europe?

    Wow, that would be great, thanks for the offer!
    I bet it would be cheaper to ship than normall rates? Looking at ebay they ask about 30 USD shipping to The Netherlands. Would you be able to give me a idea what it would cost for a K-2006 testkit with a refill plus shipping to The Netherlands (you can also send me a PM if you prefer)?
    Rabobank would, offcrouse, be no problem to tranfser to. Paypall is also possible

    I can find borax online in The Netherlands : http://www.dadrogistonline.nl/produc...y/borax-poeder ? But doesn't sound cheaper than normal pH plus, so it doesn't matter.

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