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Thread: Cleaned 2 years of debris out of the pool

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    Cleaned 2 years of debris out of the pool

    Well aft6er a 2 year pool absence, I bit the bullet and cleaned 2 years of debris out of the pool. I had it pressure tested, and the 2 skimmers are leaking a bit, but after the hard winter we had here in Indiana, no main drain damage. It held to 18psi for over an hour. The returns are all good also. I made the mistake of NOT putting the cover on (we have a very large cover that is also a preventive cover that keeps dogs cats and people from falling in.) At any rate I bought a three inch pump and hoses from Rural King for a total of about 4 hundred dollars which I thought was a lot cheaper than hiring a pool company to come in and do it. The pump took about 7 hours to pump out a 45k gallon pool.
    After we got down to about 4 inchs in the deep end, I hired a couple of guys who came in and mucked out the rest of it. We used the snow shovel and a trash can to clean up the muck and debris and about 2 million tadpoles in various stages of development. My environmental wife almost went mental and was franticly trying to save frogs. When we got all of the heavy stuff out, We pressure washed the walls and bottom to remove any algae we could see. I know everyone uses muratic acid to do a clean wash but that is dangerous stuff. I will deal with any alage we have, if any, when the pool is full. We have a Polaris 9300 sport which does and excellent job cleaning after we got the sand and silt filter for it. I will let y'all know how its going.
    We dropped the house hose in to start filling. based on our water pressure we are looking at somewhere between 7 and 10 days to fill it up. I put some algaecide 40 in to insure no growth while we fill. I also put one three inch Chlorine tab in to run the frogs off. More to come. I am writing this for any newbies who are wondering just how far you can go with your own maintenance. I have learned that from now on I will have cover on the pool and a leaf net on top of that. I will also put ion chlorine in the winter to maintain stability. I do not like mucking the pool.
    Alden Shipley
    Pool:IG, 24x44 45000 Gal.Concrete, built 1982.
    3.5 feet shallow end to 8 feet deepend.
    Hayward Sand Filter 300 LB Sand.
    1.5 HP motor, single speed Flow rate unknown.
    2 Skimmers, 1 deep 1 opposite shallow in deep end drain.
    We use about 300 feet of coiled black pvc pipe to heat the pool from the sun Novice pool owner. Has a leak somewhere. We will find it. (I hope.) :>
    Southern Indiana (Harrison County).

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    Re: Cleaned 2 years of debris out of the pool

    While you are waiting for the pool to fill, I would get your test kit ordered. The one most recommended here is the TF-100 from tftestkits.net. The speedstir is a nice option if you have the spare cash.

    Another thing you can do is read through Pool School. A lot of good information.

    Good luck on the opening.
    12000 Gallon IG Plaster built 2/15/2014. Jandy 340 sg ft 127 gpm filter, Jandy 1 HP stealth pump. Circupool RJ-45 SWG (overkill). TF-100 with Speed Stir.

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    Re: Cleaned 2 years of debris out of the pool

    Good advice from jmbradwell. If you are not already familiar with TFP, do yourself a favor and read ALL the threads in Pool School. You are doing a tremendous amount of work to reopen your pool. Learn how to properly maintain your water chemistry, what the dangers of "pool store" advice and chemicals can do to make your water a "time bomb" that would return your water to swamp status. Good luck!!
    16,000 gallon Oval Vinyl Liner Pool (new liner 2014)
    Custom built in 1999 to be half in-ground and half out (sloped yard) vermiculite bottom, laser sighted to Florida Room and Deck
    Purex Triton Model cc100 Cartridge Filter, 100 gpm flow rate, Penfair 1HP Pump
    TF-100 Test Kit

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    Mod Squad tim5055's Avatar
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    Re: Cleaned 2 years of debris out of the pool

    Good advice so far, but I just want to add if you have that single 3" tab sitting on the bottom of the pool you may want to put it on something and/or float it. The tab sitting on the plaster can degrade the surface with direct contact. I also might suggest adding some liquid chlorine each day and stirring it around.

    With a new fill you know you won't have CYA, so maybe float a sock of that to begin adding it. Shoot for a low amount until you get the water really moving and you can balance the water. Without any CYA the sun is going to burn off any chlorine quickly and leave you susceptible to more/faster algae growth.
    TFP Moderator 39 X 18 23,000(ish) freeform gunite; built 2007ish; Pentair Triton II TR100 600lb Sand filter; 2 HP Pentair pump with 2.2 HP AO Smith single speed motor; 2 skimmers, 1 main drain, 4 returns w/waterfall, Stenner 45MHP2 3GPD running@ 60% - 15 gal Tank; heated by the sun CYA 200+ when I started - 50 now. Dolphin Supreme M5 Pool Cleaner. Hot Springs SX Spa, 285 gallon

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    Re: Cleaned 2 years of debris out of the pool

    We finished up the rebuild on all of the piping, and we are getting a little bit of air in one of the returns. I think that is due to the water level being low. In addition to replacing all of the pvc connecting through the sand filter and pump, we had to install a new Gauge
    to watch the pressure. At any rate, we have 6 dead frogs and about 10 leaves and are still filling. I appreciate the advice about the test kits, as the one I have is older and most of the chemicals are used up. Generally I didn't worry about cya too much, because we constantly moved the water 24/7 and the AOSmith motor did a nice job. I will be adding some DE to the pool to allow it to pickup all of the little stuff. Everything is fine so far. In addition, I pulled out the 500 feet of black pvc pipe to start heating with solar. # years ago, I made about a dozen circles that we laid on the concrete to collect heat. It was 145 degrees (Fahrenheit) and too hot to touch. I thought about attaching the pipe to black painted 3/4 inch marine plywood, but being lazy I am going to try this again. I had the repair guys put a hose fitting just before the sand filter to attach a garden hose to with the pvc. We will see how that goes. As far as test kits go, I am no chemist, and frankly the kits I saw here were a bit intimidating. I will be reading a lot I suppose. If anyone is interested in me posting more, let me know and I will. I seem to have violated the Admins rule, and was told I was hijacking a site. Being 68 years old, and not terribly computer oriented, I apologize. At any rate that's where we are today. We use floaters with the chlorine tabs when the pool is full. I generally use three of them and check the chlorine and PH daily. I used about 3 ounces of the algae killer, just to be on the safe side as we fill. I have used liquid bleach, but find that the 90 percent chlorine powder is ideal as I can hand mix what I need as necessary, and a lot cheaper. Naturally I use a chemical mask to do so. If anyone wants me to I can also take pictures of the pool, and how it is going. No one seems to know what the paint is on it, we do know it is not rubber based, but it is enamel I believe. Our deck is concrete, and wide. I found a surface cover made by Rustoleum that is for wooden decks and concrete, and I am contemplating painting the deck with the stuff. It would certainly be cheaper than tile. It is $85.00 for 4 gallons. I think we would need about 12 gallons. Thanks for reading and comments.
    Last edited by APS; 07-16-2014 at 02:58 PM. Reason: add info
    Alden Shipley
    Pool:IG, 24x44 45000 Gal.Concrete, built 1982.
    3.5 feet shallow end to 8 feet deepend.
    Hayward Sand Filter 300 LB Sand.
    1.5 HP motor, single speed Flow rate unknown.
    2 Skimmers, 1 deep 1 opposite shallow in deep end drain.
    We use about 300 feet of coiled black pvc pipe to heat the pool from the sun Novice pool owner. Has a leak somewhere. We will find it. (I hope.) :>
    Southern Indiana (Harrison County).

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    Re: Cleaned 2 years of debris out of the pool

    Not to be disrespectful, but we are giving you the best piece of advice you will ever get about maintaining your pool:
    Read and try to understand what we are teaching in Pool School.

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    Re: Cleaned 2 years of debris out of the pool

    TFP will hopefully never be a place where we say," this is the only way to maintain your pool"

    Rather, we will continue to be a place where the reader can gain a stunning amount of pool knowledge in a compact, precise format and then use that knowledge as the reader sees fit. About 7-8 years ago, I just gave up on bringing newbies to my point of view......we can only present what we know and hope the reader can turn it to useful advice.
    Dave S.
    42k vinyl and concrete pool, 1.5hp pump, 140gpm filter
    TFTestkits , PoolMath , Pool School

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    Re: Cleaned 2 years of debris out of the pool

    Ok. I do not quite understand how much bleach I need to put into a 45000 gallon pool. I also do not understand this while cyuranic acid issue and how it has anything to do with the chlorine level. I have read through the pool school discussions, and have looked at the sample settings for fibergals, gunite, and vinyl pools, but no where does anyone mention a poured concrete pool. There is no coating on the pool other than paint.I truly appreciate all of the information, but This pool seems to be very different than other pools. I also appreciate the advice that is general iun nature, but it is rather vague when dealing with specifics. I was told by several pool companies that the pool has to be repainted with enamel every 2 years. This is the 10th year that the pool has not been painted. It still looks great.If I knew how to upload a picture to this site, I would do so. As to learning about CYA etc, I do read and listen. But the advice is general and not germane to the issues we are having. It takes 9 days to fill this swimming pool. I have turned to this suite for advice because I have heard so much hearsay from pool companies around here as to be totally confused. One guy who told me that the paint was epoxy because it still looked so good told me my bottom drain was leaking, hence the loss of water. He wanted 10k (!) to sandblast and paint it. The bottom drain held 18psi for over an hour, and does not leak. There is a skimmer leak, but both skimmers are tied into one line and the guys who tested used a sound wave to attempt to identify the leak area, and determined it was "probably" in the skimmer in the deep end. But we have to cut concrete at 150 an hour to find out. Personally based on my experience with the pool people in this area, none of them know what the **** they are doing, and making a lot of guesses. Hence my reason for attempting to find out what to do with this pool, here. I am an educated man, I know how to read, but I need definitive help for this pool, which quite frankly is the largest private pool in three counties. it is 24feet by 44feet and very different from any pool I have ever messed with. Apparently I have irritated several of you based on the comments I am getting. I am sorry for that. I guess I need specific advice germane to the situation I have. We bought 50 gallons of Bleach when we last had the pool open and it was gone in less than a week. I cannot afford to buy 50 gallons of liquid bleach per week. Now we have a slight leak around the pump, as we fill, and there is air seeping into the pump from who knows where, because the return lines hold pressure as well as the main drain does. I guess I will have to call the 150 per hour people back. This is much more lucrative business than the television and radio business was. I may start my own company, lol. Thanks for reading.
    Last edited by APS; 07-17-2014 at 11:46 AM. Reason: corrections
    Alden Shipley
    Pool:IG, 24x44 45000 Gal.Concrete, built 1982.
    3.5 feet shallow end to 8 feet deepend.
    Hayward Sand Filter 300 LB Sand.
    1.5 HP motor, single speed Flow rate unknown.
    2 Skimmers, 1 deep 1 opposite shallow in deep end drain.
    We use about 300 feet of coiled black pvc pipe to heat the pool from the sun Novice pool owner. Has a leak somewhere. We will find it. (I hope.) :>
    Southern Indiana (Harrison County).

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    Mod Squad jblizzle's Avatar
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    Re: Cleaned 2 years of debris out of the pool

    You would use the recommendations for a gunite pool.

    I tried to skim the wall of text, but still not sure what you actual questions are.

    FC is consumed by 2 things. The sun and organics in the water.
    CYA has 2 functions. Protect the FC from the sun and buffer the chlorine so it is not as harsh on equipment and people.

    As the CYA gets higher, you have to maintain higher FC levels to prevent algae ... see the FC/CYA Chart.

    If you added bleach to your pool with 0 CYA in the water, you would lose 50% of it about every hour to the noon day sun. With the proper CYA and FC ratio, you should only be using 2-4ppm of FC every day ... with a big pool, that is still a lot of bleach ~1-2 gallons of 10% bleach will need to be added each day.
    Jason, TFP Moderator
    18k IG pebblesheen pool, Hayward ProLogic P4 w/ T-15 SWG, Pentair 1HP 2-speed Superflo, Hayward 6020 DE filter
    500 sqft Heliocol solar panels, ThePoolCleaner, TF-100 test kit w/ SpeedStir
    Pool School + Test Kit + PoolMath = A TROUBLE FREE POOL
    If you found TFP helpful and we saved you money ... Become a TFP Supporter!

  10. Back To Top    #10

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    Re: Cleaned 2 years of debris out of the pool

    Ok.
    1. How much loss of water over the course of a sunny day with temperature ranges of 88 to 95 degrees does a pool 24 by 44 feet lose due to evaporation?
    2. What is the acceptable and target level readings for a poured concrete (not plaster) pool with 45000 gallons of water in it (PH FC, CYA)?
    3. Should I add chlorine as the pool is filling, and because the water level changes daily as we add water, what is an acceptable amount of chlorine to add? And should I take readings every day?
    4. For maintenance purposes what are the target levels I should aim for to maintain the pool and prevent algae growth, once it is filled?
    5. Do I need to repair the skimmers immediately or can I wait until fall to do so? (I do have a Polaris robot that does a very good job with debris.)
    6. I am getting a bit of air when I turn on the pump as I fill the pool, but the pump does not lose prime. There is a small bit of water underneath the pump Is this something to worry about? The pool is not even half full yet.
    Thanks,
    Alden Shipley
    Pool:IG, 24x44 45000 Gal.Concrete, built 1982.
    3.5 feet shallow end to 8 feet deepend.
    Hayward Sand Filter 300 LB Sand.
    1.5 HP motor, single speed Flow rate unknown.
    2 Skimmers, 1 deep 1 opposite shallow in deep end drain.
    We use about 300 feet of coiled black pvc pipe to heat the pool from the sun Novice pool owner. Has a leak somewhere. We will find it. (I hope.) :>
    Southern Indiana (Harrison County).

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    Mod Squad jblizzle's Avatar
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    Re: Cleaned 2 years of debris out of the pool

    1. Depends on your humidity and wind speed, there are calculators online
    2. Use the plaster numbers: http://www.troublefreepool.com/conte...mmended-levels
    3. Would not hurt to add 1-2ppm of FC while it fills ... of put some tablets in a floater to slowly *** FC and CYA.
    4. You just need to keep the FC above the minimum for your CYA: FC/CYA Chart
    5. What is wrong with them? If they are leaking, then up to you if you are OK will losing and replacing the water.
    6. Air in the pump points to a suction leak (http://www.troublefreepool.com/conte...side-air-leaks) and certainly should be fixed. It could just be due to the added suction since the pool is not full yet. The wetness is not likely related to the air in the pump, but points to a leaking seal. If the bearings in the motor are getting wet, that will shorten the life of the motor.
    Jason, TFP Moderator
    18k IG pebblesheen pool, Hayward ProLogic P4 w/ T-15 SWG, Pentair 1HP 2-speed Superflo, Hayward 6020 DE filter
    500 sqft Heliocol solar panels, ThePoolCleaner, TF-100 test kit w/ SpeedStir
    Pool School + Test Kit + PoolMath = A TROUBLE FREE POOL
    If you found TFP helpful and we saved you money ... Become a TFP Supporter!

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    Re: Cleaned 2 years of debris out of the pool

    APS, You seem to be undertaking quite a project. I have been taking care of swimming pools since I was 12. (I am now 54) I have seen many poured concrete pools, although you seem to have a large one for a private pool. They are not my specialty, but I believe you will need to watch your calcium hardness. Other than that,I think everything else is the same.
    As long as I've known, this forum is open to all pool owners. At one point in time, I believe we have all been frustrated with what the Pool Stores and the so called "pool experts" have been giving us and telling us. This is what this forum is all about. Pool chemistry facts and what does what. I hope you feel I am not one of the people you have irritated, we are just trying to give you useful information.
    We all try to remain and want to see your pool a success story. There are a number of great people on this forum with similar stories and situations similar to yours.
    I hope after you have read The ABC's of Water Chemistry http://www.troublefreepool.com/conte...ater-chemistry
    and the effects of how CYA affects your chlorine/ bleach consumption http://www.troublefreepool.com/conte...art-slam-shock
    Hopefully,it starts to make some sense to you. If not, ask some questions and we will try to help.
    16,000 gallon Oval Vinyl Liner Pool (new liner 2014)
    Custom built in 1999 to be half in-ground and half out (sloped yard) vermiculite bottom, laser sighted to Florida Room and Deck
    Purex Triton Model cc100 Cartridge Filter, 100 gpm flow rate, Penfair 1HP Pump
    TF-100 Test Kit

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    Talking Re: Cleaned 2 years of debris out of the pool

    Quote Originally Posted by joegus View Post
    APS, You seem to be undertaking quite a project. I have been taking care of swimming pools since I was 12. (I am now 54) I have seen many poured concrete pools, although you seem to have a large one for a private pool. They are not my specialty, but I believe you will need to watch your calcium hardness. Other than that,I think everything else is the same.
    As long as I've known, this forum is open to all pool owners. At one point in time, I believe we have all been frustrated with what the Pool Stores and the so called "pool experts" have been giving us and telling us. This is what this forum is all about. Pool chemistry facts and what does what. I hope you feel I am not one of the people you have irritated, we are just trying to give you useful information.
    We all try to remain and want to see your pool a success story. There are a number of great people on this forum with similar stories and situations similar to yours.
    I hope after you have read The ABC's of Water Chemistry http://www.troublefreepool.com/conte...ater-chemistry
    and the effects of how CYA affects your chlorine/ bleach consumption http://www.troublefreepool.com/conte...art-slam-shock
    Hopefully,it starts to make some sense to you. If not, ask some questions and we will try to help.
    Frustration is abating after going through what we just went through. If I knew how to post pics on this site I would. My wife and I appreciate all that we have (and are) learning. As you said, It is quite a chore. With all of the help we are getting here it makes it a lot easier! Thanks to all of you.
    Alden
    Alden Shipley
    Pool:IG, 24x44 45000 Gal.Concrete, built 1982.
    3.5 feet shallow end to 8 feet deepend.
    Hayward Sand Filter 300 LB Sand.
    1.5 HP motor, single speed Flow rate unknown.
    2 Skimmers, 1 deep 1 opposite shallow in deep end drain.
    We use about 300 feet of coiled black pvc pipe to heat the pool from the sun Novice pool owner. Has a leak somewhere. We will find it. (I hope.) :>
    Southern Indiana (Harrison County).

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    Re: Cleaned 2 years of debris out of the pool

    Good thing is, once you get the hang of it, is really easy to keep it up!
    Pool size: 24000gal inground Vinyl-Taylor k-2006 and k-1766 test kits and-speed stir
    Intermatic P1353ME digital timer w/freeze sensor
    CircuPool Si-45 SWCG System
    Polaris 280 vacuum/Polaris PB4-60 boost pump
    Pentair IntelliFlo VS 3hp Pump--Pentair sand filter

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    Mod Squad jblizzle's Avatar
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    Re: Cleaned 2 years of debris out of the pool

    Jason, TFP Moderator
    18k IG pebblesheen pool, Hayward ProLogic P4 w/ T-15 SWG, Pentair 1HP 2-speed Superflo, Hayward 6020 DE filter
    500 sqft Heliocol solar panels, ThePoolCleaner, TF-100 test kit w/ SpeedStir
    Pool School + Test Kit + PoolMath = A TROUBLE FREE POOL
    If you found TFP helpful and we saved you money ... Become a TFP Supporter!

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    Casey's Avatar
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    Re: Cleaned 2 years of debris out of the pool

    I like to use postimage.org to host my pics.

    Think of CYA as sunscreen for your chlorine. The CYA will protect the chlorine from being burnt up from the sun. A good range is 50ppm. You can pick it up at WalMart in 4lb jugs, it's called Stabilizer/Conditioner. You can use PoolMath to help you determine how much to use. Once you figure it out, you put it in a sock and hang it over the return. You lost all that chlorine bleach last year because you didn't have CYA in the water. I hope I've helped you understand how CYA works.
    I'd bet you my bikini you'll never get TFP water from a pool store!

    24' Sharkline Venture De Filter

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    Mod Squad kimkats's Avatar
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    Re: Cleaned 2 years of debris out of the pool

    I can't wait to see this huge pool!

    We can and will help you learn. It can be overwhelming at first but it will all come together as you learn how to care for your pool.

    It can be SO much cheaper than using the pool store! BUT you do need to spend a little money up front to help you save money in the long run.

    I hope your look into a good test kit. There are videos and we will also help you learn how to do the tests.

    I bought my test kit BEFORE I bought my pool! I wanted to make sure I could do it before I spent the big money on the pool. It turned out to be easier than I thought it would be.

    Let us know how we can help you next.

    Kim
    TFP Moderator 33x52 round AG 25,600 gals Sand Filter 1.5hp Pump - 2 Speed, SLAM, Pool School, Recommended Levels, Recommended Chemicals, Pool Math, Chlorine/CYA Chart, TF-100 Test Kit

  18. Back To Top    #18

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    Re: Cleaned 2 years of debris out of the pool

    Today we went down to the pool, and tested the water. Didn't have anything but Chlorine an PH but the level for chlorine was in the "ideal" area, as was ph. I put three floaters with a total of 9 tabs in the pool. The Polaris 9300 was resurrected from the basement and works fine. Great cleaner. We did find a hairline crack in the old Hayward pump, But Weldbond and Gorilla glue may fix that. We also had all new pipes installed. We are now down to the skimmer problem. We need to buy a new test kit as Aquachem has discontinued their "professional" kit and will not offer refills. I guess I need to order something from you folks here on TFP. The help has been tremendous, the robot is working and now if the temp would just get back up to 95 or so...Life is good! I guess I need top learn the TFP way. Study time!
    Alden Shipley
    Pool:IG, 24x44 45000 Gal.Concrete, built 1982.
    3.5 feet shallow end to 8 feet deepend.
    Hayward Sand Filter 300 LB Sand.
    1.5 HP motor, single speed Flow rate unknown.
    2 Skimmers, 1 deep 1 opposite shallow in deep end drain.
    We use about 300 feet of coiled black pvc pipe to heat the pool from the sun Novice pool owner. Has a leak somewhere. We will find it. (I hope.) :>
    Southern Indiana (Harrison County).

  19. Back To Top    #19
    Mod Squad kimkats's Avatar
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    Re: Cleaned 2 years of debris out of the pool

    Here is a great first step for learning the TFP way

    http://www.troublefreepool.com/conte...etting-started

    Let us know how else we can help you!!

    Hint, hint, hint I LOVE pics!!!!

    Kim
    TFP Moderator 33x52 round AG 25,600 gals Sand Filter 1.5hp Pump - 2 Speed, SLAM, Pool School, Recommended Levels, Recommended Chemicals, Pool Math, Chlorine/CYA Chart, TF-100 Test Kit

  20. Back To Top    #20

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    Re: Cleaned 2 years of debris out of the pool

    I checked the pool yesterday and all was well. The PH and the Chlorine were in the acceptable levels on the scale on the liquid tester. I decided that after reading the TFP way to go, I would treat my "pet" to a shock of chlorine. I put ten scoops of chlorine in and today the liquid tester was a deep yellow, so my shock is working. The water is crystal clear and will be swimmable soon. It is around 70 degrees and the outdoor temp has been around 78. We need hot weather,lol. I want to get the TFP test kit, but It seems awfully complicated. The shock level btw was over 10, probably around 15. Thanks again, and I hesitate to join these photo websites, because I am a professional photographer, and I will not give up copyright to a web site. If there was another way to upload it would be great!
    Alden Shipley
    Pool:IG, 24x44 45000 Gal.Concrete, built 1982.
    3.5 feet shallow end to 8 feet deepend.
    Hayward Sand Filter 300 LB Sand.
    1.5 HP motor, single speed Flow rate unknown.
    2 Skimmers, 1 deep 1 opposite shallow in deep end drain.
    We use about 300 feet of coiled black pvc pipe to heat the pool from the sun Novice pool owner. Has a leak somewhere. We will find it. (I hope.) :>
    Southern Indiana (Harrison County).

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