Become a TFP Supporter Pool Math Forum Rules Pool School
Results 1 to 9 of 9

Thread: Pre Buld Noob needs guidance NJ

  1. Back To Top    #1

    Join Date
    Jun 2014
    Location
    Cream Ridge NJ
    Posts
    30

    Pre Buld Noob needs guidance NJ

    1st post,

    I am very very new and am in the pool builder interview process. I met with the 1st PB yesterday and another scheduled for Monday. I wanted to share some of his initial comments to get other opinions here. Also, I will be sharing decisions along the way, of which a couple I made yesterday.

    I will refer to this gentleman from now on as PB1, so if I get responses, it will be easier to follow who said what and suggested what.

    The following was suggested and I will be going with

    a.) 25x44 (probably 8') I had thought maybe deeper, any opinions or concerns I should be aware of? Kidneyish, natural shaped.
    b.) Substrate- He is using 1/2 rebar and colored grey (shaded charcoal) gunite as an upcharge- I inquired about quartz filler, pebbles or tile and he suggested his colored gunite and averages 20 year life expectancy with his clients cause he teaches his clients how to maintain it. He was not a fan of diamond brite and said a lot of guys add their own and mix vs. getting direct from factory?
    c.)400 btu natural gas heater
    d.) 2 skimmers
    e.) 2 12v lights
    f.) DE filter- Is there a top shelf opinion on filters?
    g.) 1 1/2 HP pump because I am putting an attached spa (should spa drain in pool for water fall effect? I am putting in a separate water fall (riverish) water flow over elevated natural rock
    h.) The pool will be only accessible for entry because of landscaping on opposite side. 1/2 of it directly under the natural boulder landscaping and water fall so as not to be able to run around pool. Any concerns with kids (drunk adults) jumping off the higher portions into deep end?
    i.) no diving board, no slide
    j.) Maybe a diving rock?
    k.) Raised spa, any height concerns?
    l.) Stone coping, what is that? Optional cantilever edge?
    m.) He specifically mentioned he did not like hayward equipment? why is that?
    n.) Aqua Pro filter?
    o.) I am not going with a heat pump
    p.) Raypak Pool and Spa heater
    q.) Aqua Pro pool pump
    r.) Jandy pool digital assistant
    s.) Astrollite II lights? Should I consider colored light?
    t.) Jany water purification system? Whats this all about?

    He also says there is absolutely no problem with me having all the pool heaters, pumps and equipment on the side of the house, next to AC, natural gas meter, electrical boxes. I am familiar with head pressure loss and if he has no problem digging and plumbing runs of 60 - 120 ft, any other issues I should know about?

    Thanks in advance, I just don't want to make any mistakes and be sold by a salesman without some knowledge from experienced pool owners and neutral parties.

  2. Back To Top    #2
    JasonLion's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    Silver Spring, MD
    Posts
    37,879

    Re: Pre Buld Noob needs guidance NJ

    Long plumbing runs aren't so bad if they use a good sized pipe, certainly 2" at a minimum. They can get to be a real problem if smaller pipe is used.

    Colored plaster invariably has an uneven appearance. Some people like that, but may object. Quartz/pebble are more work/cost, but look better and last longer.

    Builders get attached to the brands they are familiar with and object to other brands. Sometimes they had a bad experience with something of the other brand, sometimes they just make things up. In practice Pentair, Hayward, and Jandy are all about the same. They vary far more within their own product lines than they are different from each other.

    For filters, each kind has pros and cons, but no one kind is clear better than another. The main thing with filters is to get something larger than you nominally need, which means much less work for you as it can go longer between cleanings.

    "Jany water purification system" - no ideal. Perhaps he is talking about a SWG?

    Colored lights are fun, but hardly essential. Mostly a question of spending the money for some entertainment or not.

    Coping is the deck surface right around the edge of the water. Stone coping tends to look great and be a bit more maintaince.

    Raised spa is totally normal.

    Make sure to get a two speed or variable speed pump. Either one will save you 50% (or more) off your electric bill. Variable speed pump save more money, but cost more up front and break more often.
    19K gal, vinyl, 1/2 HP WhisperFlo pump, 200 sqft cartridge filter, AutoPilot Digital SWG, Dolphin Dynamic cleaning robot
    Creator of PoolMath and Pool Calculator. Other handy links: Support this site, TF Test Kits, Pool School

  3. Back To Top    #3
    rodog123's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2013
    Location
    Pearland, TX
    Posts
    308

    Re: Pre Buld Noob needs guidance NJ

    -I would see if you can add LED lights vs. 12V lights. I have the Jandy Nichless led lights and love them. We have parties and get tons of compliments on the light shows. We have three lights in our pool, two lights would not have been enough.

    - I did not see and robot vacumm aka Creepy Crawly (I have the Zodiac MX8) If you do not have many trees in your backyard I would suggest the MX8.

    - Decking Volleyball/Umbrella holes add them now PB should throw these in for free.

    I have the Jandy Iaqualink and love it. I'm able to control the pool from my Iphone. Lights, filter, water features, heater, spa very easy and user friendly.

    - I would make sure all equipment is from the same manufacturer I have all Jandy.
    -Stay away from any Ozone systems they might try to sell you, not practical for an outdoor pool setting.
    Completed 38'X21' IG Free form pool approx 18.5K gallons, sports pool w/spa and tanning shelf 3.5-5.5 ft. Jandy Cartridge Filter, Jandy stealth pumps, Jandy LXi Heater, I aqualink, Inline chlorinator. Click to see My Pool Build

  4. Back To Top    #4
    sargent's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Location
    Tulsa, OK
    Posts
    291

    Re: Pre Buld Noob needs guidance NJ

    The Jandy water purification system might be the Nature2® Fusion Soft. That is a salt water and mineral system all in one. You don't want that because the minerals can cause staining and green hair.

    Or it might be a Nature2® Fusion Inground, which is a chlorine tab feeder and mineral system all in one. You don't want that because of the minerals and because use of tabs can be bad because they raise the CYA levels, and then you have to drain the pool to get CYA down to a manageable level.

    Or it could be an AquaPure® Ei™, which is a SWG, but it will be too small for your pool.

    Or it could be an AquaPure® SWG. That would be okay, but you need to get the PLC1400. The PLC700 will be too small.
    14k gal IG vinyl, Jandy Flopro 1 hp up-rated, 2 spd pump, Hayward 325 sq ft cartridge filter, Circupool Si-40 SWCG

  5. Back To Top    #5

    Join Date
    Jun 2014
    Location
    Cream Ridge NJ
    Posts
    30

    Re: Pre Buld Noob needs guidance NJ

    All I can say is wow,

    I have just had PB2 & PB3 back to back days and I have seen an increased level of unpreparedness by the PB representatives. Old photos, forgotten manufacturer consumer brochures, no shortage of opinion though.

    PB2 emphasized Shotcrete. Did research and jury's still out. He was pricier but the insight on the below water line boulders and definitiveness of costs told me he knew what he was doing. Still he was more expensive. They use Hayward products. Everyone seems to agree that 2 lights for 800sqf is the way to go. I have also decided to go with a Salt Water pool and have gotten quotes from the last 2 on that. A 3rd light for the spa. Does anyone have an opinion on colored LED lights for the effect and ambiance?

    PB3 was a commercial train wreck. More prepared with consumer pieces and videos but his pricing guides and lack of insight to waterfalls (they outsource) made him a last choice. Not to mention astronomically more expensive. They use Jandee products and I like some of the the technological gadgetry available.

    The one issue that I have had PB2 & PB3 ask about was township code on property % usage. I am a little concerned that I will be over the 14% and unable to get a permit. How much trouble is a variance, whats it cost? How long does it take? and what is the process? I am in Upper Freehold Regional Township in NJ if anyone knows.

    Thanks all.

    Chris

  6. Back To Top    #6

    Join Date
    Jun 2014
    Location
    Cream Ridge NJ
    Posts
    30

    Re: Pre Buld Noob needs guidance NJ

    Hi All, It's been a while. I had a hiccup in my pool build and also an opportunity. The hiccup, I took care of but here is my question on the opportunity. I did not realize that my recently hired electrician, is an expert in, pool wiring, pumps, piping, gas lines and equipment. I really have confidence in him now.

    With that said, what concerns and the likelihood of contracting a PB just to pour the shell. Basically I want to GC the job now. I can pull the permits. I can sub the pavers and fence. I have the piping, wiring and connections person in place.

    I really need to know my risk on the shot-crete or gun-nite installation. Things, like warranty, quality control, and the actual likelihold of a PB accepting terms? Please all opinions welcome.

    Chris

  7. Back To Top    #7
    CusePool's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2014
    Location
    Friendswood, TX
    Posts
    91

    Re: Pre Buld Noob needs guidance NJ

    I think if you GC yourself, you completely eliminate the PB and contract out excavation, rebar and gunite just like any other part of the job. Plenty of people have done this process themselves so I am sure you'll get lots of great feedback on it.
    ~18,000 IG/Spa chlorine, Blue Granite Pebblesheen
    Hayward 1.5hp 2-speed Tri-Star Pump, 525sqft Swimclear filter, Polaris 280 cleaner
    400K BTU Heater, LED Lights, PS8 Automation
    Build thread: http://www.troublefreepool.com/threa...s-Houston-area

  8. Back To Top    #8

    Join Date
    Jun 2014
    Location
    Cream Ridge NJ
    Posts
    30

    Re: Pre Buld Noob needs guidance NJ

    Quote Originally Posted by CusePool View Post
    I think if you GC yourself, you completely eliminate the PB and contract out excavation, rebar and gunite just like any other part of the job. Plenty of people have done this process themselves so I am sure you'll get lots of great feedback on it.
    Is it possible to sub out a Gunite or Shotcret only?

    I can handle the excavation.

    My hardscaper is very familiar with rebar, are any footings usually required? What kind of contractor would someone recommend for this specific part?

    Does anyone have any idea how to go about the piecing out the Gunite or Shotcrete? Obviously someone would need the machine?

    I would also like Diamond Brite or Pebble Tec. Who is the best to contact for that?

    Lastly the Large boulders and landscaping, again, my dear friend/brother is capable. Here's what I am thinking on the far side that has me concerned.

    Building a ledge below the waterline that the large boulders will rest upon the length of one side, the WF/ and or lazy river/ and or diving rock will be all on one side to prevent running around the pool.

    There is also a raised spa if that maters.

    I can figure out all the pumps, head requirements, electrical and design. The key here is who is best to attempt the actual structure, support (rebar) and placement of boulders and large rock to maintain that natural look?

  9. Back To Top    #9
    CusePool's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2014
    Location
    Friendswood, TX
    Posts
    91

    Re: Pre Buld Noob needs guidance NJ

    Quote Originally Posted by Christofu2 View Post
    Is it possible to sub out a Gunite or Shotcret only?

    I can handle the excavation.

    My hardscaper is very familiar with rebar, are any footings usually required? What kind of contractor would someone recommend for this specific part?

    Does anyone have any idea how to go about the piecing out the Gunite or Shotcrete? Obviously someone would need the machine?

    I would also like Diamond Brite or Pebble Tec. Who is the best to contact for that?

    Lastly the Large boulders and landscaping, again, my dear friend/brother is capable. Here's what I am thinking on the far side that has me concerned.

    Building a ledge below the waterline that the large boulders will rest upon the length of one side, the WF/ and or lazy river/ and or diving rock will be all on one side to prevent running around the pool.

    There is also a raised spa if that maters.

    I can figure out all the pumps, head requirements, electrical and design. The key here is who is best to attempt the actual structure, support (rebar) and placement of boulders and large rock to maintain that natural look?
    I feel bad responding because I have not done this myself, so I'll say I am only chiming with my thoughts, not direct experience.

    I would say you could absolutely just contract out whatever parts you want. If you can dig the hole, do it and hire out the steps you can't do. If you can do electrical and still pass inspections, etc then go for it.

    As for who to do the work - that is easy - you'd hire the same companies that the PBs are hiring. Hire a pool rebar company and a pool gunite company. I'm sure you can search for these type companies online in your area, heck some of the bids we got from PBs even had a list of subs they use, so there would be a starting spot. Many times subs can recommend other subs. As for PebbleTec, go to the company's main website and they have lists of authorized installers in each area. Call those guys and get quotes - again you could ask them who sprays a nice gunite shell and call those companies for bids on the shell and ask the gunite company who does a nice rebar cage, and so on...

    For rocks, tile, and coping stuff, at least for my build those things were all contracted out to the same company who were a sort of jack-of-all-trades pool contractor type company. They also did the deck. I'll bet you'd have some luck searching on pool renovation companies because it is the same work. Hire one of these companies and they'll build you a natural looking waterfall out of moss-rock or whatever else you want, they know how to do it and they do a good job (at least around here anyway).
    ~18,000 IG/Spa chlorine, Blue Granite Pebblesheen
    Hayward 1.5hp 2-speed Tri-Star Pump, 525sqft Swimclear filter, Polaris 280 cleaner
    400K BTU Heater, LED Lights, PS8 Automation
    Build thread: http://www.troublefreepool.com/threa...s-Houston-area

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •