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Thread: What did I get into?

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    What did I get into?

    Hi. First off, I am not THE pool guy or even A pool guy or even a pool owner. I'm just trying to help my next door neighbor and am probably in over my head.

    She's got an inground concrete pool that calcs to 28700 gallons. I don't remember the pump size but the filter I believe is a Triton II 100C sand filter I think. I'll verify this when I go back over later today. When she uncovered the pool this year she said it was a green mess. She's used up to 3 bags of Turboshock daily for 3-4 days plus placing (3) 3" Trichlor pucks in each of the two strainer baskets and replacing them when consumed.

    Used the last of the trichlor she had last night. FC tested this mornig at 21.5. The water is blue but grayish cloudy. I have brushed, swept, vaccumed to waste, added to the filter, bought and used the Taylor2006 test kit and read a lot on this forum.

    I need someone to look over the numbers, offer up why it shows no CYA with all of the pucks and turboshock added and help me clear this water.

    This afternoon the last test a couple of hours ago:

    FC 9.5
    CC .5
    PH 7.5
    CH 120
    TA 210
    CYA <30

    I am aerating the water to increase the PH so I can add MA to lower the TA. I'm not sure on the best way to raise the CH and also, I don't want to get too many things going on at once until the water clears. It is greyish white cloudy with what looks like a lot of tiny particulates in the water, easily seen at night with a light.

    As far as filtration, I have added socks to both skimmers, removed the top from the sand filter and stirred and poked down into the sand with a broomstick. I don't think it's possible to do that with a water hose because the equipment is in a pump room with a lot of electrical on the floor under the perimeter of the filter. The filter, when clean after backwashing runs 8 psi. I added DE until the pressure rose to 9-10 psi. I also pulled the filter pump and cleaned the impeller and replaced a bad O-ring on the end of the volute. The pool and equipment is all 5 years old.

    any help on getting this pool cleared up and getting the water balanced is greatly welcomed. I've been over there daily for the last 5 days.... Right now I feel like the best thing I never did was put in a pool.

    Oh, I also got a fish tank test kit, drop style, to test for ammonia, it showed none.

    So have it, besides move, what do I need to do??

  2. Back To Top    #2
    Mod Squad JohnT's Avatar
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    Re: What did I get into?

    Welcome to TFP!

    I wouldn't worry about TA or pH at all right now. TA at 210 is very tolerable, and the pH test is not accurate at high chlorine levels.

    You do need to raise the CH level to avoid damage to the pool surface. This is fairly urgent.

    Grayish cloudy generally indicates the algae is dead, so it becomes a filtration issue. Brushing daily and filtering 24/7 is the standard course. 5 days really isn't all that long. Probably in the next few days you will see a marked improvement in clarity.
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    Re: What did I get into?

    What/who are you using to get those results?
    Pool size: 24000gal inground Vinyl-Taylor k-2006 and k-1766 test kits and-speed stir
    Intermatic P1353ME digital timer w/freeze sensor
    CircuPool Si-45 SWCG System
    Polaris 280 vacuum/Polaris PB4-60 boost pump
    Pentair IntelliFlo VS 3hp Pump--Pentair sand filter

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    Mod Squad JohnT's Avatar
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    Re: What did I get into?

    Quote Originally Posted by timerguy View Post
    What/who are you using to get those results?
    Quote Originally Posted by phyrphxr
    Taylor2006 test kit
    TFP Moderator
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  5. Back To Top    #5

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    Re: What did I get into?

    whoops-- missed that! sorry!
    Pool size: 24000gal inground Vinyl-Taylor k-2006 and k-1766 test kits and-speed stir
    Intermatic P1353ME digital timer w/freeze sensor
    CircuPool Si-45 SWCG System
    Polaris 280 vacuum/Polaris PB4-60 boost pump
    Pentair IntelliFlo VS 3hp Pump--Pentair sand filter

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    Re: What did I get into?

    Just ran over and tested chlorine. FC 8.5, CC.5.

    It is a bright hot sunny day here. There are still (60) Poolbrand pucks in the two strainers, 3 in each.

    The quick reply is appreciated. So, what's the best proceucre to raise the CH when I'm vaccuming to waste as quick as I can replace the water?

    Also, the pump has been running 24/7 this whole time. Would it be helpful to shut it off and see if this stuff settles down to the bottom, then vac?

    And any thoughts and why I am seeing no CYA?

    Thanks!! I gotta get some pics up here soon of this....

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    Isaac-1's Avatar
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    Re: What did I get into?

    Like others have said add CH (you may have to get this from a pool or big box store, up north they sell some types of ice removers that will raise CH, not sure about in OK though), keep the FC up and keep filtering, sand filters can take a couple of weeks to clear swamp conditions even after the algae is all dead.

    Ike

    p.s. I assume 60 is a typo on the trichlor pucks, as to the low CYA most likely bacterial conversion of the CYA with the swamp conditions
    Indoor 20x40 35,000 gallon vinyl pool with 1.5 HP 2 speed Jandy FloPro pump, Hayward EC75 Perflex DE filter, 11 4x12 Techno-Solis solar panels w/ Aquasolar controller, Aquabot Turbo T Robot Cleaner. Also LMI metering chlorine dispenser pump and HotSpring Jetsetter
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    Re: What did I get into?

    Quote Originally Posted by phyrphxr View Post
    And any thoughts and why I am seeing no CYA?

    Thanks!! I gotta get some pics up here soon of this....
    Likely, as Isaac said, over the winter the swamp bacteria converted all the CYA to ammonia, but you got lucky and all of the ammonia completed chemical conversion to nitrogen and outgassed or the chemicals that were added before you jumped in burned out the ammonia.
    Joel - TFP Moderator - Minnesota - **Become a TFP Supporter!** Helpful Links: ABCs of Pool Water Chemistry - SLAM Procedure - Chlorine/CYA Chart
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    Isolated Spa - 345 Gallons

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    Re: What did I get into?

    It was. There are 6 pucks, 3 in each skimmer. Has been that way for at least a couple of weeks and she replenished them as they dissolve. The pump is a 1hp Pentair. The filter is a triton II TR100.

    So as far as the CYA, would it be best to add nothing and keep replenishing the pucks, she just bought a new container of them. Or add what is needed to raise the CYA?

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    Re: What did I get into?

    You need to get her off the pucks or else CYA will go sky high over time and the pool will turn green again
    Indoor 20x40 35,000 gallon vinyl pool with 1.5 HP 2 speed Jandy FloPro pump, Hayward EC75 Perflex DE filter, 11 4x12 Techno-Solis solar panels w/ Aquasolar controller, Aquabot Turbo T Robot Cleaner. Also LMI metering chlorine dispenser pump and HotSpring Jetsetter
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  11. Back To Top    #11

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    Re: What did I get into?

    And on the calcium chloride, is that something that will generally disolve into the water quickly or settle to the bottom? I don't want to vac out anything added. And thanks again, I'm glad I found this place.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Isaac-1 View Post
    You need to get her off the pucks or else CYA will go sky high over time and the pool will turn green again
    That shouldn't be a problem at all but I'm sure she's going to want to at least use up what she already has.

  12. Back To Top    #12

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    Re: What did I get into?

    Let those in the skimmers dissolve and have a supply of bleach/liquid chlorine on hand. Keep the remainder of the pucks/shock for cya top off purposes.
    Pool size: 24000gal inground Vinyl-Taylor k-2006 and k-1766 test kits and-speed stir
    Intermatic P1353ME digital timer w/freeze sensor
    CircuPool Si-45 SWCG System
    Polaris 280 vacuum/Polaris PB4-60 boost pump
    Pentair IntelliFlo VS 3hp Pump--Pentair sand filter

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    Mod Squad JVTrain's Avatar
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    Re: What did I get into?

    Quote Originally Posted by phyrphxr View Post


    That shouldn't be a problem at all but I'm sure she's going to want to at least use up what she already has.
    You can use them but keep track of how many and test the CYA weekly. Once it hits 30+ then you can calculate how many will get you to 40, use up those and hide the rest for an emergency vacation supply. Straight bleach after that.
    Joel - TFP Moderator - Minnesota - **Become a TFP Supporter!** Helpful Links: ABCs of Pool Water Chemistry - SLAM Procedure - Chlorine/CYA Chart
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    Re: What did I get into?

    Used a nozzle for some robot gizmo to aerate the water trying to raise the PH...before I posted here. Refilling the pool with well water to get enough in it to vacuum it again today.



    - - - Updated - - -

    The pool has an automatic cover that's not working. If I can get it moving, would it help to keep the pool covered in the daytime until the CYA level is up?

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by JVTrain View Post
    You can use them but keep track of how many and test the CYA weekly. Once it hits 30+ then you can calculate how many will get you to 40, use up those and hide the rest for an emergency vacation supply. Straight bleach after that.
    Will do that. Thanks.

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    Isaac-1's Avatar
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    Re: What did I get into?

    Quote Originally Posted by phyrphxr View Post
    That shouldn't be a problem at all but I'm sure she's going to want to at least use up what she already has.
    That is the story we hear all the time, if you found out something you were eating was making you sick, would you keep eating it just because you have a large stock on hand?
    Indoor 20x40 35,000 gallon vinyl pool with 1.5 HP 2 speed Jandy FloPro pump, Hayward EC75 Perflex DE filter, 11 4x12 Techno-Solis solar panels w/ Aquasolar controller, Aquabot Turbo T Robot Cleaner. Also LMI metering chlorine dispenser pump and HotSpring Jetsetter
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    Re: What did I get into?

    Quote Originally Posted by JohnT View Post
    Welcome to TFP!

    I wouldn't worry about TA or pH at all right now. TA at 210 is very tolerable, and the pH test is not accurate at high chlorine levels.

    You do need to raise the CH level to avoid damage to the pool surface. This is fairly urgent.

    Grayish cloudy generally indicates the algae is dead, so it becomes a filtration issue. Brushing daily and filtering 24/7 is the standard course. 5 days really isn't all that long. Probably in the next few days you will see a marked improvement in clarity.
    Forgot to say thanks for the welcome here John. Added approximately 15lbs calcium chloride to the water and it increased CH from 120 to 190. After tomorrow morning's cleaning ritual I'll add another 10 to 15lbs and recheck.

  17. Back To Top    #17

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    Re: What did I get into?

    After a couple weeks she has a crystal clear, inviting pool. We swam in it a couple nights ago and the first thing my wife commented on was that the water smelled 'clean'. No chlorine pool smell, just 'clean'.

    This morning the water tested at:

    FC 7
    CC 0
    PH 7.2
    TA 125
    CH 350
    CYA 45

    Only chlorine source now is bleach, she's onboard with dosing it daily as needed.

    So the only thing I don't know how to control or even it if should be lowered, is CH. It started out at 120, added calcium chloride to 190, added more to 300. It seems to have crept up from there.....if that's even possible. Other than chlorine, the only thing I have been working on is bringing down the TA from 210. Have been aerating as in the pic above constantly to raise the PH then adding MA to bring it back down. When I first checked the PH this morning it tested at 8.0. So would letting the PH run that high if even for a short while have an affect on CH? Anything else affect it from what has been done?

    The supply water is well water and I tested it this morning and showed CH at 200.

    Thanks for any advice and for having this forum and information up. Her pool challenge has now become something I actually look forward to conquering....

  18. Back To Top    #18
    Mod Squad JVTrain's Avatar
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    Re: What did I get into?

    The increase you're seeing could be because of the MA additions you've been doing to reduce TA. If your pH was dipping to 7.0 or less your CSI would have dipped to a range where there is potential to be corrosive to plaster or in your case concrete. This situation could increase CH by stripping it off the walls and dissolving? I'm not as familiar as some experts with plaster, concrete pools but that's my take. Plug your numbers into Pool Math and see what the effects of pH have on your CSI. Also look at what happens (happened) when your CH was lower and you were adding acid. In that case it was even easier for corrosion to occur (more negative CSI), adding CH to your water from the pool walls themselves and from what you were adding. Maybe a better course would have been to get CH in line first, then address TA.

    REAL experts feel free to correct and chime in.
    Joel - TFP Moderator - Minnesota - **Become a TFP Supporter!** Helpful Links: ABCs of Pool Water Chemistry - SLAM Procedure - Chlorine/CYA Chart
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    Re: What did I get into?

    so this evening, FC 5, CC 0, PH is 7.8, TA is 110, CH is 375, CYA 45.

    CSI at those levels is 0.49.

    If I bring down PH to 7.4 and other levels remain the same, CSI would be 0.09.

    Is it okay to let the CH remain that high? If it continues to rise or needs to be lowered, is replacing water the answer?

  20. Back To Top    #20
    Mod Squad JVTrain's Avatar
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    Re: What did I get into?

    That CH is fine. Just keep pH in check and your good. You can manage it even higher.

    Joel - TFP Moderator - Minnesota - **Become a TFP Supporter!** Helpful Links: ABCs of Pool Water Chemistry - SLAM Procedure - Chlorine/CYA Chart
    40x20 Pool: 32K Gallons * Vinyl * Bleach Chlorination * Hayward S270T Sand Filter * Pentair SuperFlo 1 HP * Teledyne/Laars Heater * AquaVac Tigershark * TF-100 w/ SpeedStir
    Isolated Spa - 345 Gallons

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