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Thread: Sooo tired of going to pool store!

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    Sooo tired of going to pool store!

    Hello everyone, my name is Heather and I am new to this site and to my pool. I have only.had it for two years. I must say I love it! I opened my pool,beginning of May and lets just say it has gone from bad to worse with hundreds of dollars spent already. I have a 12,000 gallon inground liner pool. I inherrited it two yrs ago when we moved in. My issue is that I can not for the life of me get my pool clear. Yesterday the pool store says my pool isnt holding chlorine, as the fc was 0 and tc was 0. Other readings ph 6.8
    Total alk. 92
    Adj. Total alk. 72
    Cya. 65
    Tds. 500
    I am at a loss as to what to do. I keep adding shock (powder form) and in like a 24 hour period it is gone. According to my test kit. The water is a deep turquoise, but it just seems like there i particles in the water keeping it cloudy?? Als two days ago I used banish to kill any algae that may be growing. Any advice would be great!

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    bridgman's Avatar
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    Re: Sooo tired of going to pool store!

    OK, so the powder shock you're adding does two things -- raises FC level (good) and adds CYA (bad past a certain point, since CYA makes chlorine less effective for any given level of FC). Suggest you switch to bleach (aka chlorinating liquid aka liquid chlorine aka liquid shock) ASAP so you don't raise your CYA level any higher. One of the tables in Pool School shows the relationship between FC and CYA - basically tells you what FC level you need for each CYA level to get the same algae & bacteria killing effect.

    http://www.troublefreepool.com/conte...art-slam-shock

    Read up on the SLAM method, and make sure you have a test kit that can handle high levels of FC (most can't -- the "recommended test kits" can).

    At 65 CYA level you'll need to maintain a 24-28 FC level during the SLAM effort to kill off whatever is growing in your pool, and that's a lot of FC -- probably worth draining off some water and then topping up again to lower the CYA level... somewhere in the 30-40 range is usually recommended. You don't *have* to lower the CYA level but lowering it by 30% will similarly reduce the amount of chlorine you're going to have to pour in.

    Main thing is *not* to add any more powdered chlorine since that will only raise your CYA level higher, and it's too high already.

    EDIT -- forgot to say WELCOME !!
    Cedar hot tub, 680 US gallons - Snorkel wood-burning heater, canoe paddle, "offline" Intex 1000 GPH pump/filter with skimmer

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    Re: Sooo tired of going to pool store!

    I have read that you add the liquid chlorine the return jets so not to damage the liner is that true?

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    Smykowski's Avatar
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    Re: Sooo tired of going to pool store!

    Yes. As long as you are pouring in the correct amount, you won't damage the liner.

    I'd suggest starting your time in pool school by visiting the link in my signature.
    33' round, 23,000 gal AG vinyl , 1HP 2spd PowerFlo Matrix downsized with 3/4HP impeller (X2), Hayward S180T 150# sand filter (X2), Hayward H250 NG heater Pool Store year 1 - $850 for 2 months; Pool Store year 2 - $440 for 2 months, TFPC year 1 - $170 for 4 months; TFPC year 2 - $95 for 4.5 months
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    Mod Squad woodyp's Avatar
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    Re: Sooo tired of going to pool store!

    16x32x52" Steel Cornelius Miramar AGP Vinyl liner 13,100 gal. Buried 2 ft.
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    Re: Sooo tired of going to pool store!

    New pool readings:
    Cya: 80
    Tc: 7.7
    Fc: 6.9
    Ph: 7.5
    Adj.tot. Alk: 138
    Total alk: 170
    The pool store said things look good. But still have cloudy, dark turquoise water. No ammonia was found in water as well. They said to schock,it really well tonight and tomorrow. I went to store and bought some liquid bleach. I believe the powdered.schock is raising my cya.?? I am just wondering at what level do I want to raise my chlorine level to? Also any other tips would be great. Thanks
    Last edited by Herbie; 05-23-2014 at 12:21 PM. Reason: Typo
    12k gallon inground pool with vinyl liner. Sandfilter, hayward 1.5 hp pool pump. Pool is approx 15 yrs.old. Liner is four years old. TF100 testing kit.

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    Richard320's Avatar
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    Re: Sooo tired of going to pool store!

    Quote Originally Posted by Herbie View Post
    New pool readings:
    Cya: 80
    Tc: 7.7
    Fc: 6.9
    Ph: 7.5
    Adj.tot. Alk: 138
    Total alk: 170
    The pool store said things look good. But still have cloudy, dark turquoise water. No ammonia was found in water as well. They said to schock,it really well tonight and tomorrow. I went to store and bought some liquid bleach. I believe the powdered.schock is raising my cya.?? I am just wondering at what level do I want to raise my chlorine level to? Also any other tips would be great. Thanks
    If you believe those readings -- and I don't -- then you'd need to raise the FC level to 31!!! That will take 3.6 jugs of Clorox - just to start! And more to keep it there. A couple jugs a day at least, until it clears up. If CYA is actually lower, then less. But if it's higher (dumping bags of powdered shock in will cause that) it could be even worse. So the solution is to replace some water. But not yet. You don't know how much to drain, really. Not unless you're certain those results are accurate.

    Here's why I don't think they are: If you added enough dichlor or trichlor "shock" to raise CYA 15 then your pH should have dropped dramatically. Instead, it went up! But if the "shock" was Cal-hypo, then the pH should have stayed roughly the same and CYA should have stayed the same. But they show CYA growing from 65 to 80 and pH from 6.8 to 6.9. That does not make sense. The results must be wrong. Which set? Probably both!

    My suggestion: Take Woody's advice. Order your own proper test kit. Pour a jug and a half of bleach in every day to stall the algae a little. I don't expect it to clear, because I don't trust those results, but it should keep it from getting worse until the kit arrives. Once you have test results you can trust, then it can be cleared efficiently. And probably for less money than you've already wasted at the pool store.
    16K freeform gunite with spa; Pentair 4000 DE filter; Century Whisperflow 1 HP; Pentair Minimax heater.
    Troublefree does not mean Maintenancefree. It's like brushing your teeth: You can spend a couple minutes a day and pennies a week or go to the dentist once a year and spend several thousand dollars.
    A pool is like a pet - you have to feed it every day, even the days you don't want to play with it!

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    Re: Sooo tired of going to pool store!

    Quote Originally Posted by Herbie View Post
    I went to store and bought some liquid bleach. I believe the powdered.schock is raising my cya.??
    Correct. Assuming the readings are correct, you've gone from 65 to 80 between readings, and so the FC level you need for shock has gone from 26-28 to 31 already.

    More shock => more CYA => more shock needed => more CYA => you can see where this is going.

    Quote Originally Posted by Herbie View Post
    I am just wondering at what level do I want to raise my chlorine level to? Also any other tips would be great. Thanks
    According to the CYA/FC table below (Pool School => Handy Reference => for 80 CYA your shock level for FC is 31. Maybe 3.5 gallons of 8.25% bleach for 12000 gallon pool.

    That's not a "get it to here and you're done", though, it's a "maintain it here until everything is dead" level. SLAM = Shock Level And Maintain. Most kits can't read FC past 10 or so, which is why folks here encourage you to get a specific type of kit with "FAS-DPD" chlorine test.

    http://www.troublefreepool.com/conte...art-slam-shock

    The chlorine gets eaten up pretty quickly, so you need to test & add more chlorine to keep above shock level until everything is dead.

    EDIT - I like Richard320's advice better than mine
    Cedar hot tub, 680 US gallons - Snorkel wood-burning heater, canoe paddle, "offline" Intex 1000 GPH pump/filter with skimmer

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    Re: Sooo tired of going to pool store!

    If you keep your chlorine level high will it damage my vinyl liner? Also added the bleach per chart. Now there is white foamy suddsy bubbles on top. Also forgot to mention that when I went out to pool this morning I could smell the chlorine, which I dont think is good. Thanks for your responses.
    12k gallon inground pool with vinyl liner. Sandfilter, hayward 1.5 hp pool pump. Pool is approx 15 yrs.old. Liner is four years old. TF100 testing kit.

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    Re: Sooo tired of going to pool store!

    Hi Heather,
    Please please.... order a TF100 Test Kit with XL option today. DO Not hesitate. The pool store testing is WRONG. There is no way your alk can chage as drastically as it did by adding what you have.

    Stay away from teh Pool Store, or you will end up in worse shape than you already are. If they knew what they were talking about and their tests were correct, then you woud not be here now looking for help.

    SO, now that you are here, I can tell ya, you came to the right place. Take a deep breath and relax. THere is no need for panic any more. The experts here are indeed experts with all of the credentials and experience in the world. Your part in this will be testing the water - yes you! - and posting the results here. then do what the experts advise.

    In no time, you will have a sparkling and crystal clear troublefree pool.
    Divin Dave,
    IG Vinyl, 15' x 30', 3 1/2' - 6' deep, Oval, ~15K gal, Intelliclor IC40, Intelliflo VS pump, Clean and Clear 420 Filter, auto-fill-disabled, Retrofit LED Color Light, Dolphin Nautilus Robot, TF100 Test Kit, Taylor K1766 Salt Test Kit, Tftestkit Pressure Gauge.
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    Re: Sooo tired of going to pool store!

    Quote Originally Posted by Herbie View Post
    If you keep your chlorine level high will it damage my vinyl liner? Also added the bleach per chart. Now there is white foamy suddsy bubbles on top. Also forgot to mention that when I went out to pool this morning I could smell the chlorine, which I dont think is good. Thanks for your responses.
    Bubbles are probably from cheap algaecide reacting with the chlorine. Did the pool store sell you any? It would be a miracle if they didn't. Smelling chlorine is good! That means that something is reacting with chlorine and forming chloramines. Once the pool is clear and balanced, you won't smell that again unless you have a whole bunch of sweaty people jump in at once.

    Super high chlorine without any CYA can fade the liner, but if the pool is full of algae, it will never accumulate high enough to do that. And you have plenty of CYA.

    16K freeform gunite with spa; Pentair 4000 DE filter; Century Whisperflow 1 HP; Pentair Minimax heater.
    Troublefree does not mean Maintenancefree. It's like brushing your teeth: You can spend a couple minutes a day and pennies a week or go to the dentist once a year and spend several thousand dollars.
    A pool is like a pet - you have to feed it every day, even the days you don't want to play with it!

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    Re: Sooo tired of going to pool store!

    Quote Originally Posted by woodyp View Post
    +1

    Get a test kit. Test your own water. It's easy once you get some practice and it's empowering. Not to mention ACCURATE, unlike what the pool store does for testing. I know it sounds odd but pool stores are generally the worst place to get your water tested. It's inaccurate and then they sell you expensive products that you typically don't need based on those poor tests. It's just a bad idea.

    Follow the link woodyp posted or the TF-100 link in my signature.

    Also, when you get the chance and get familiar with the forum a bit, add the details of your pool to your signature so the experts here can more easily help you out. My first season with a pool and I'm totally in control after finding this site and going through Pool School. The test kit cost money, but all the advice (which WILL actually help) is free and the best money can't buy.
    Joel - TFP Moderator - Minnesota - **Become a TFP Supporter!** Helpful Links: ABCs of Pool Water Chemistry - SLAM Procedure - Chlorine/CYA Chart
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    Re: Sooo tired of going to pool store!

    Ordered the kit! The store said I needed to put more algecide in. Richard, are you saying dont do it. and no I didnt buy any, already had some. Lol. I am done buying stuff from them. I didnt know about this site until I started searching the web. Wish I would have found it earlier. I hope one day to have my pool back to normal again. Thanks for all your advice.
    12k gallon inground pool with vinyl liner. Sandfilter, hayward 1.5 hp pool pump. Pool is approx 15 yrs.old. Liner is four years old. TF100 testing kit.

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    Re: Sooo tired of going to pool store!

    Your test kit will be your best friend. I say no to the addition of algaecide. Don't write off the pool store totally they may sell liquid chlorine cheaper than other stores sell bleach.
    35K IG Vinyl 20 x 40 self built pool, Hayward Pro Series High-Rate Sand Filter 31" 98gal/min, Hayward TriStar 1.85hp, Hayward 400btu heater, BBB method w/Hypo, Jazz light w/matching fiber optic rope lighting around coping w/syncronized color wheels. Concrete Paver deck.

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    Richard320's Avatar
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    Re: Sooo tired of going to pool store!

    No algaecide. It works better as a preventative than a cure, and as you can see, it breaks down and foams up.
    16K freeform gunite with spa; Pentair 4000 DE filter; Century Whisperflow 1 HP; Pentair Minimax heater.
    Troublefree does not mean Maintenancefree. It's like brushing your teeth: You can spend a couple minutes a day and pennies a week or go to the dentist once a year and spend several thousand dollars.
    A pool is like a pet - you have to feed it every day, even the days you don't want to play with it!

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    Mod Squad zea3's Avatar
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    Re: Sooo tired of going to pool store!

    While you are waiting for your test kit to arrive read some of our articles in Pool School . Pool water chemistry is a great place to start. Then read through SLAM process so you will have a little information and a chance to ask for clarification about the process before you start to slam.

    Now for some FYI: algacide does very little to kill existing algae, but can help prevent algae from growing rapidly if your FC drops too low. Any algacide you add now would be oxidized by the chlorine during the slam process and slow things down a bit. Until your kit gets here add a jug of bleach a day to keep things in check. If you ordered from TF testkits it should only take a few days to show up.
    TFP Moderator
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    Re: Sooo tired of going to pool store!

    Heather,
    you are awesome for taking control, and getting your own test kit !!! You will not regret it!

    dont add any more magic powerer or potions that end with the number 9 until your test kit arrives.
    In the meantime, read POOL SCHOOL. Click the Pool School button at the top right hand corner of this page.
    Dont worry if seems like gibberish and too much to comprehend. it isnt, and experts here can answer any questions you have.
    Divin Dave,
    IG Vinyl, 15' x 30', 3 1/2' - 6' deep, Oval, ~15K gal, Intelliclor IC40, Intelliflo VS pump, Clean and Clear 420 Filter, auto-fill-disabled, Retrofit LED Color Light, Dolphin Nautilus Robot, TF100 Test Kit, Taylor K1766 Salt Test Kit, Tftestkit Pressure Gauge.
    www.tftestkits.net Experience- it's what's learned just after you needed it most !!

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    Re: Sooo tired of going to pool store!

    You are on the path to success. The kit will be your best tool to reach pool water that is crystal clear.

    The bubbles will dissipate in short order once you stop using that algaecide. Say it with me.... "nothing but liquid chlorine from now until I get my kit."

    Agree that 1.5 jugs of 8.25% bleach a day is good advice until you get your kit. You might consider adding half in the morning and half in the evening.
    Pool: IG 22k- 16x32 clipped corners- vinyl liner, w/ a great board. Built in 3/99, new to me 2/2011.
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    Re: Sooo tired of going to pool store!

    im starting to think test strips are more accurate then 3/4's of the pool stores with testers.

    Although I do like one of my local stores, they are good, the rest suck.

    Let us know what the test shows and also, take some pictures !

    my pool took almost 2 weeks and 6 de changes, so don't give up the folks here can help ya get it clean and do it much cheaper then the local pool store.

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    Unhappy Re: Sooo tired of going to pool store!

    So woke up this morning and water pretty much the same. Can't wait until I get my test kit. So I just added another bottle and half of bleach. Pretty much at a stand still right now.Trying to figure out how to post pictures.
    12k gallon inground pool with vinyl liner. Sandfilter, hayward 1.5 hp pool pump. Pool is approx 15 yrs.old. Liner is four years old. TF100 testing kit.

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