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Thread: the pool is winning

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    donniespool's Avatar
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    the pool is winning

    well....here goes...pool looked like my avatar when the pic was taken...last month...85 degrees[thanks to the blanket]..life was good...then...testing, brushing, back flushing, lps..etc..I am ready to make it a small tennis court..the summer has reared its ugly head and turns my cool pool into a cloudy, almost green, bits of yellow mess. this is a yearly event..it seems as though it collects a yellow dust on the bottom, and steps...not on the sides...it is swept off with ease but makes the pool look really cloudy...and not easy to look at...almost green. my TF 100 test kit is just getting used to me...here are the most recent results..I use chlorine tablets and need to understand how to switch over to bleach...help...I am better at posting pictures than maintaining my pool
    cya ............. 80
    calcium hardness....425
    ph..................7.5
    fc....................5
    cc....................0
    total alkalinity ....100
    these tests are from today..5/19...the levels have gone up and down over the past month...
    in ground gunite/plaster 16x30..3-6-3 play pool, sand filter, 1 hp pump..single speed... built in 77 replastered in 05
    15300 gallons. chlorine tabs no longer...tf-100 test kit

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    Beens's Avatar
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    Re: the pool is winning

    First step for you to start winning this fight with the pool is to get a good test kit.

    Congratulations! You got the best!

    Step 1 = Complete!

    I know the experts will be here soon with great advice and I just wanted to say welcome.

    You've posted test results, that is a great start. Now tell us what kind of pool you have, how many gallons (if you know) what kind of pump/filter. Etc.

    A lot of advice depends on what you have so the more you describe the better!

    We also love pics so keep em coming!

    18' x 48" (42" water depth) Intex Metal Frame 6,700 Gallons
    Hayward Power-Flo LX 1.0 HP pump
    Hayward Pro Series S166T Sand Filter
    Original Intex Floating Skimmer

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    Re: the pool is winning

    You've found the right place for pool help (all kinds)

    Your pool doesn't look nearly as bad as you might think!

    I'm on my phone or I'd take a stab at helping you (I could probably recite what someone here soon will tell you in detail in my sleep )

    Listen to what these folk are about to tell you about your FC/CYA and prepare for smooth sailing once you're fixed up

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    Richard320's Avatar
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    Re: the pool is winning

    The pool is only winning because the CYA is too highand you let FC dip too low for too long. Right now, the FC is adequate to maintain a clear pool (barely) but not high enough to get ahead of the algae growth you have. To do that, you need to maintain a FC level of 31 for days until you have completed the SLAM process. Alternately, and what you will see advised, is to hold your nose, grit your teeth, accept the inevitable, and replace half the water to get CYA down to something manageable. At 40 CYA, you'll only need to maintain 16 FC.

    You will lose a certain percentage of FC to sunlight. It's a percentage, not a fixed parts-per-million, so you'll lose twice as much to the sun if you attempt the SLAM at the high CYA level you currently have. That can add up to a whole lot of bleach!

    You already posess the two most important tools: a proper test kit, and this forum. You can beat the green and end up with a sparkling pool that will be the envy of all your neighbors, especially around late August, when their pools are starting to look a little hazy.

    Here's some stories to inspire you. You're actually in pretty good shape compared to a lot of people you can sort of see the vacuum head down there!
    First Time Shocking with Bleach
    Pretty black pool
    A little encouragement for those with algae and new to BBB
    Frog Filled Green Swamp to Oasis---Work in Progress!!!
    Before and After Pool Pics
    Before and after!
    A final picture set of how well the BBB method works!

    Now, in case you haven't figured out just how it happened, here's a piece of writing from last year. You'll probably relate.
    We'll take a 16000 gallon pool, because that's what I have. On a fresh fill, prominent national pool chain recommends 2.5 pounds pf stabilizer per 10,000 gallons, which works out nicely to 4 pounds which brings CYA to 30.

    With an average loss of 2 PPM/Day or 14 ppm/week, I'll have added 8.6 PPM/CYA if I used trichlor pucks perfectly. And they recommend a weekly "shock" of dichlor between 5 and 10 FC.... 2-3 oz per 10,000 gallons. Split the difference; I'll add 4 oz. CYA went up another .9.

    So..by the end of week one, I have added 9.5 more CYA. It is now 39.5. Mimimum FC for that is 3, so I'm probably okay.

    Week two, up to 49 CYA.
    Week three, 58.5. Minimum FC should be 5, but they recommend 3 as ideal, so the pool looks a bit hazy. So I'll toss in a little extra dichlor "shock" to jack FC up to 10. Which adds another 6.4 CYA. Keeping count? We're up to 64.9 now.

    That caught the algae just in time.. we had two weeks of good luck. A steady diet of pucks and 4 oz. "shock" each week only added another 19, up to 73.9 now.

    Week 6 it started looking funky, so we "shocked"it once again. CYA is up to 99.3. But minimum FC to keep algae at bay is 8, and we're still holding things to 3, because prominent national chain's preprinted sheet shows that as ideal. So algae got a toehold and the pool has a bit of a tint. So we throw two whole bags of dichlor in which jacks it another 7.6 by the time week 7 is over, we're at 116.4, because we had pucks in the floater the whole time.

    So...in 7 weeks, from 30 to 116.4. Let's say there are no more algae outbreaks because they sold me a huge bucket of phos-free and another of yellow-out monopersulfate "shock" Nothing but the pucks and the extra 4 oz of dichlor "shock" weekly. So the next 7 weeks added 66.5, which brings the total to 182.9 CYA.

    Now if we didn't understand this and things looked a bit hazy, we might throw an extra puck or two in the floater every couple weeks, which will drive it over 200 easily.
    16K freeform gunite with spa; Pentair 4000 DE filter; Century Whisperflow 1 HP; Pentair Minimax heater.
    Troublefree does not mean Maintenancefree. It's like brushing your teeth: You can spend a couple minutes a day and pennies a week or go to the dentist once a year and spend several thousand dollars.
    A pool is like a pet - you have to feed it every day, even the days you don't want to play with it!

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    donniespool's Avatar
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    Re: the pool is winning

    Thanks for getting me started...I realized I would be depressed and confused...The draining half the pool is not good...I will check it out but I believe our water usage in this section of town is what our sewer user fee is based this particular time of the year...I am beginning to see what needs to be done.. I'll head to Cosco tomorrow and get whatever bleach you folks recommend..and a lot...as I understand..I need to raise my fc to shock level, which because my cya is 80...the chart shows 31...and keep it there...please advise..I believe I read 6 and or 12 percent bleach?..I will be back washing liberally...this process needs to continue until my water looks decent and my cya is within range?..thanks very much...I forgot what my main drain looks like
    in ground gunite/plaster 16x30..3-6-3 play pool, sand filter, 1 hp pump..single speed... built in 77 replastered in 05
    15300 gallons. chlorine tabs no longer...tf-100 test kit

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    Beens's Avatar
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    Re: the pool is winning

    If you're going to do it, the drain/refill should happen first. That will lower the CYA and you won't have to go all the way to FC 31. Much less chlorine/bleach that way. It will really make the SLAM easier to deal with.

    Most household bleach comes in 8.25% now. It's the stuff that is branded "liquid chlorine" or "liquid shock" that is usually 10% or 12.5%. (All sodium hypochlorite)
    If you're doing bleach, make sure it is just regular unscented bleach. Not scented, or "outdoor" or anything funky. I use great value (walmart) brand, up & up (target) brand and everyday essentials (farm fresh grocery store brand) all 8.25% that I get for $2.69 - $2.99 for a 121oz bottle.

    There is a thread for bleach prices this year that is handy to check on every now and then. People will post deals they find. Maybe something near you! http://www.troublefreepool.com/threa...ch-Prices-2014

    During the SLAM (follow the article) you will be testing your FC very often so keep an eye on your chlorine testing reagents. With a high CYA and therefore really high FC (if you don't drain) you will need a lot of drops for each test. So you will probably need to order refills of those.

    It can be done. It has been done. You can do it! We can help! (lol what is this, home depot?)
    18' x 48" (42" water depth) Intex Metal Frame 6,700 Gallons
    Hayward Power-Flo LX 1.0 HP pump
    Hayward Pro Series S166T Sand Filter
    Original Intex Floating Skimmer

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    soupy8728's Avatar
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    Re: the pool is winning

    Quote Originally Posted by donniespool View Post
    ...The draining half the pool is not good...I will check it out but I believe our water usage in this section of town is what our sewer user fee is based this particular time of the year.
    I just drained and refilled my ENTIRE pool and I contacted the water/sewer company prior to doing this. They used a "variance" which allowed me not to be charged all at once for that much water. Might look into that for your area.
    IG Plaster with raised spill-over Spa, ~26,000 gallons, Built 2001
    Cartridge filter
    Solar heated

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    Mod Squad JVTrain's Avatar
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    Re: the pool is winning

    As soupy said, if you're draining onto open ground, off-sewer drainage then refilling, contact your city office and tell them you're filling the pool and the approximate volume you'll be using to refill. They should be able to eliminate the sewer fees associated with the water usage, which is usually a fee per 1000 gallons and can be quite steep. That is if you're actually draining to open ground. If it's going into the sewer... well you'll have to foot that bill unless your scruples allow you to tell the city you're not doing so.
    Joel - TFP Moderator - Minnesota - **Become a TFP Supporter!** Helpful Links: ABCs of Pool Water Chemistry - SLAM Procedure - Chlorine/CYA Chart
    40x20 Pool: 32K Gallons * Vinyl * Bleach Chlorination * Hayward S270T Sand Filter * Pentair SuperFlo 1 HP * Teledyne/Laars Heater * AquaVac Tigershark * TF-100 w/ SpeedStir
    Isolated Spa - 345 Gallons

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    donniespool's Avatar
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    Re: the pool is winning

    ok...looks like I will have to bite the bullet with the water usage. In our county the sewer usage is based on the what goes through your water meter..any angle to tax us...on the ground or in the sewer system same usage..Unfortunately I have used up my one time water usage brake that the company allows. We had a line break on a back section of our lot and it went unnoticed resulting in an inflated bill.
    I will get over to Wal Mart this morning and load up on bleach and also will order more testing regents...thanks for the heads up...I will check back when the 'process' gets underway...ugh!!!!!!!!!!
    in ground gunite/plaster 16x30..3-6-3 play pool, sand filter, 1 hp pump..single speed... built in 77 replastered in 05
    15300 gallons. chlorine tabs no longer...tf-100 test kit

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    Richard320's Avatar
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    Re: the pool is winning

    Do some comparison shopping. There are a lot of pool stores in your area. Plug your zip code into "Dealer Locations". It's 12.5% stuff, and right now it's buy 3, get one free.
    16K freeform gunite with spa; Pentair 4000 DE filter; Century Whisperflow 1 HP; Pentair Minimax heater.
    Troublefree does not mean Maintenancefree. It's like brushing your teeth: You can spend a couple minutes a day and pennies a week or go to the dentist once a year and spend several thousand dollars.
    A pool is like a pet - you have to feed it every day, even the days you don't want to play with it!

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    donniespool's Avatar
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    Re: the pool is winning

    OK...drained almost half the pool, lost my pump suction and could not get it reprimed, refilled and got my cya, that was 80 down to 60..I realize this is not what we were looking for..but that is what I have. I am a regular at WalMart now wheeling out baskets of bleach..thanks for the recommendation, was even asked if I 'needed any body bags with all that bleach'...got my shock level fc up to 29...the chart says 24..If I understand the process correctly..I maintain this level[24] until I can stand to look at my pool, the nasty junk is gone, and the fc level does not change overnight...understanding the sunlight eats it up..in the mean time I will be sweeping numerous times a day and back washing as needed...does this sound like I am on track and somewhat understand this whole process..at least at a beginners level??? also thanks for the advise on ordering more regents...really appreciate everyone's help....D
    in ground gunite/plaster 16x30..3-6-3 play pool, sand filter, 1 hp pump..single speed... built in 77 replastered in 05
    15300 gallons. chlorine tabs no longer...tf-100 test kit

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    Beens's Avatar
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    Re: the pool is winning

    Sounds like you have the basics down for the slam. A couple tips, during the slam just test the chlorine level (fc/cc) and don't worry about everything else. (Ph especially since the test doesn't work right with more than 10 FC)

    Also, the more often you can test and dose the better. It'll probably drop quickly at first then little by little you'll be able to spread out your test times a bit.

    And post tons of pics for us because we like 'em! They are also helpful to see your progress which usually ends up being needed when you get to the point where progress slows down and you start losing patience. (Because almost everyone does at some point during a slam!)

    Ok enough phone typing for me! Happy slamming!
    18' x 48" (42" water depth) Intex Metal Frame 6,700 Gallons
    Hayward Power-Flo LX 1.0 HP pump
    Hayward Pro Series S166T Sand Filter
    Original Intex Floating Skimmer

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    donniespool's Avatar
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    Re: the pool is winning

    thanks Beens, I figured the other tests could wait for now...I am testing a lot as the Ariz sun eats up the FC...brushing my off color pool would make a humorous photo...here is a picture from this morning...this is day two....thanks
    in ground gunite/plaster 16x30..3-6-3 play pool, sand filter, 1 hp pump..single speed... built in 77 replastered in 05
    15300 gallons. chlorine tabs no longer...tf-100 test kit

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    donniespool's Avatar
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    Re: the pool is winning

    UPDATE...thanks guys..it looks like I am turning the tide...day 4 of the slam and I can see the bottom, main drain, of my pool...keeping the fc level as close to the 24 as possible[my beginning cya was 60]..color is returning to something acceptable..I keep this up until the pool is clear and the overnight chlorine loss is zero or very low?? is this correct?...assuming I reach this point do I then return to the regular testing of the water?...will I see a lower cya level when done slamming? my intention is to stop using 3inch pucks and just using liquid chlorine..is this a good idea?. can tablets be used occasionally when we are out of town?.. sorry for all the questions ...but I am enjoying not dealing with my lps...thank you..D
    Last edited by donniespool; 05-25-2014 at 05:00 PM. Reason: spelling
    in ground gunite/plaster 16x30..3-6-3 play pool, sand filter, 1 hp pump..single speed... built in 77 replastered in 05
    15300 gallons. chlorine tabs no longer...tf-100 test kit

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    Richard320's Avatar
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    Re: the pool is winning

    Quote Originally Posted by donniespool View Post
    UPDATE...thanks guys..it looks like I am turning the tide...day 4 of the slam and I can see the bottom, main drain, of my pool...keeping the fc level as close to the 24 as possible[my beginning cya was 60]..color is returning to something acceptable..I keep this up until the pool is clear and the overnight chlorine loss is zero or very low?? is this correct?...assuming I reach this point do I then return to the regular testing of the water?...will I see a lower cya level when done slamming? my intention is to stop using 3inch pucks and just using liquid chlorine..is this a good idea?. can tablets be used occasionally when we are out of town?.. sorry for all the questions ...but I am enjoying not dealing with my lps...thank you..D
    Moving right along there!

    You keep it up until it's clear, CC is .5 or less, and you lose 1 or less overnight. At that point you're done and can go to daily checks of pH and FC. CYA may be lower after backwashing. Liquid chlorine is good year round. No unwanted side effects. Yes, tablets are good for vacation, that's why you leave CYA below 50 if possible, to allow room for the CYA pucks add.

    16K freeform gunite with spa; Pentair 4000 DE filter; Century Whisperflow 1 HP; Pentair Minimax heater.
    Troublefree does not mean Maintenancefree. It's like brushing your teeth: You can spend a couple minutes a day and pennies a week or go to the dentist once a year and spend several thousand dollars.
    A pool is like a pet - you have to feed it every day, even the days you don't want to play with it!

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    donniespool's Avatar
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    Re: the pool is winning

    thanks Richard...here is a pic from this morning...had not yet cleaned up the bottom by the main drain..the dead yellow looking algae..Looks like I have won this round...really appreciate the help you guys offered..D
    in ground gunite/plaster 16x30..3-6-3 play pool, sand filter, 1 hp pump..single speed... built in 77 replastered in 05
    15300 gallons. chlorine tabs no longer...tf-100 test kit

  17. Back To Top    #17
    Richard320's Avatar
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    Re: the pool is winning

    Moving right along!

    I think I'll add this link to my inspirational posts.
    16K freeform gunite with spa; Pentair 4000 DE filter; Century Whisperflow 1 HP; Pentair Minimax heater.
    Troublefree does not mean Maintenancefree. It's like brushing your teeth: You can spend a couple minutes a day and pennies a week or go to the dentist once a year and spend several thousand dollars.
    A pool is like a pet - you have to feed it every day, even the days you don't want to play with it!

  18. Back To Top    #18
    donniespool's Avatar
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    Re: the pool is winning

    Another thanks to you all who commented on my problem pool...I stand victorious this round...my pool has never looked more blue er or more sparklier,,,,crystal clear!!
    test results after slam...free chlorine still dropping
    cya 40 was 60 at beginning of slam
    fc 11.5
    cc 0
    ch 325
    ta 110
    ph waiting for fc to drop
    I am all over the testing...first thing every morning and at the end of the day..chart says fc of 5...I will not drop below this number..Any comments as to what to watch for would be appreciated...I will be using liquid bleach not the pucks....if everything remains as it should is slamming necessary on a routine basis or just when the test results warrant it? crystal clear without the lps....D
    in ground gunite/plaster 16x30..3-6-3 play pool, sand filter, 1 hp pump..single speed... built in 77 replastered in 05
    15300 gallons. chlorine tabs no longer...tf-100 test kit

  19. Back To Top    #19

    In the Industry

    duraleigh's Avatar
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    Re: the pool is winning

    Uh-oh! I think TFP has created another pool snob.
    Dave S.
    42k vinyl and concrete pool, 1.5hp pump, 140gpm filter
    TFTestkits , PoolMath , Pool School

  20. Back To Top    #20
    Mod Squad JVTrain's Avatar
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    Re: the pool is winning

    Quote Originally Posted by donniespool View Post
    Another thanks to you all who commented on my problem pool...I stand victorious this round...my pool has never looked more blue er or more sparklier,,,,crystal clear!!
    test results after slam...free chlorine still dropping
    cya 40 was 60 at beginning of slam
    fc 11.5
    cc 0
    ch 325
    ta 110
    ph waiting for fc to drop
    I am all over the testing...first thing every morning and at the end of the day..chart says fc of 5...I will not drop below this number..Any comments as to what to watch for would be appreciated...I will be using liquid bleach not the pucks....if everything remains as it should is slamming necessary on a routine basis or just when the test results warrant it? crystal clear without the lps....D
    As long as you keep FC at or above low number for your CYA ppm, you should never need to SLAM. Many vets here haven't SLAM'd in a long time. If you drop below or see CC > 1 then consider a OCLT and/or SLAM... I think.

    Great looking pool!

    Joel - TFP Moderator - Minnesota - **Become a TFP Supporter!** Helpful Links: ABCs of Pool Water Chemistry - SLAM Procedure - Chlorine/CYA Chart
    40x20 Pool: 32K Gallons * Vinyl * Bleach Chlorination * Hayward S270T Sand Filter * Pentair SuperFlo 1 HP * Teledyne/Laars Heater * AquaVac Tigershark * TF-100 w/ SpeedStir
    Isolated Spa - 345 Gallons

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