Become a TFP Supporter Pool Math Forum Rules Pool School
Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 20 of 31

Thread: Helping a friend open ihs pool - lots to adjust

  1. Back To Top    #1

    steveg_nh's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2013
    Location
    Southern NH
    Posts
    825

    Helping a friend open ihs pool - lots to adjust

    Hi All,

    I have my pool pretty well balanced, and I was talking to a friend that is opening his Friday. He didn't believe me at first, when I told him how easy it was, and how little I spent getting it ready. He's already sold on the TFP method. I'm going to help him out. His pool is an above ground pool, 15x24', with a 4' depth. Pool Math says about 9300 gallons.

    I tested with my TF100 and got the following today:

    pH: 6.5
    FC: 0
    CC: 0
    CYA: <20
    TA: 20
    CH: 70
    Water looks pretty clear (peaked under cover)

    He has a cartridge type filter. So Pool Maths I should add the following:

    70 oz of 8.25% bleach for FC
    30 oz of washing soda or soda ash for PH
    131 oz of baking soda for TA
    50 oz of stabilzer for CYA

    Since I need to raise ph and TA, i figured I should use soda ash. Yes? But how do I know how much it will affect TA, so I reduce the baking soda addition? Or can I just retest an hr or so after for TA, and go from there? I figure I should adjust in this order:

    ph
    FC
    TA
    Stabilizer

    Also, he said last year he used tablets, that lasted about a week each. He never tested FC last year! Ouch. We'll get him sorted out this year. But I think his best bet is to get CYA stable, and then sanitize with bleach vs pucks or anything like that. Would you agree with that?

    Thanks
    24'x40' 25k gal Imperial Mountain Pond IGP, full 28 mil VynAll Ocean Breakers liner. All Hayward system: 140k BTU HeatPro heat pump, 3/4HP single speed TriStar 2" Pump, DE6020 filter, AquaPlus Automation/Salt Chlorination, remote controls, ColorLogic 4.0 lighting. Polaris 280 w/PB4-60 BP. TF100 & K1766 test kits. Rinox Palazzo pavers and Spherik coping. Pool installed 9/2013, project completed 6/16/14.

  2. Back To Top    #2
    Richard320's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    San Dimas, CA (LA County)
    Posts
    18,768

    Re: Helping a friend open ihs pool - lots to adjust

    Scroll down to Effects of Adding Chemicals in Poolmath and plug in your numbers. It will tell you how much the Soda Ash will raise TA. How much any common chemical will affect the water, actually. It's pretty helpful.

    I'd deal with pH first, then get some Chlorine in there. In between the additions, you can be fumbling around with setting up the CYA in a sock.
    16K freeform gunite with spa; Pentair 4000 DE filter; Century Whisperflow 1 HP; Pentair Minimax heater.
    Troublefree does not mean Maintenancefree. It's like brushing your teeth: You can spend a couple minutes a day and pennies a week or go to the dentist once a year and spend several thousand dollars.
    A pool is like a pet - you have to feed it every day, even the days you don't want to play with it!

  3. Back To Top    #3

    steveg_nh's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2013
    Location
    Southern NH
    Posts
    825

    Re: Helping a friend open ihs pool - lots to adjust

    Man you guys have thought of everything with pool math. I must have missed that though. I'll take another look.
    24'x40' 25k gal Imperial Mountain Pond IGP, full 28 mil VynAll Ocean Breakers liner. All Hayward system: 140k BTU HeatPro heat pump, 3/4HP single speed TriStar 2" Pump, DE6020 filter, AquaPlus Automation/Salt Chlorination, remote controls, ColorLogic 4.0 lighting. Polaris 280 w/PB4-60 BP. TF100 & K1766 test kits. Rinox Palazzo pavers and Spherik coping. Pool installed 9/2013, project completed 6/16/14.

  4. Back To Top    #4

    steveg_nh's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2013
    Location
    Southern NH
    Posts
    825

    Re: Helping a friend open ihs pool - lots to adjust

    So that little tool is pretty neat! You do have to pay attention when using pool math, as an adjustment in one area, affects another, so you need to consider the relationship as you use it. But I love it. So this is where I landed:

    values.jpg

    I figure I'll dissolve the washing soda, add it, wait about 30 min while pump is running, then add the bleach, wait 30 min, then test ph and fc again. then, dissolve the baking soda, add it, and set up the sock for the CYA add.

    Good plan?
    24'x40' 25k gal Imperial Mountain Pond IGP, full 28 mil VynAll Ocean Breakers liner. All Hayward system: 140k BTU HeatPro heat pump, 3/4HP single speed TriStar 2" Pump, DE6020 filter, AquaPlus Automation/Salt Chlorination, remote controls, ColorLogic 4.0 lighting. Polaris 280 w/PB4-60 BP. TF100 & K1766 test kits. Rinox Palazzo pavers and Spherik coping. Pool installed 9/2013, project completed 6/16/14.

  5. Back To Top    #5

    Join Date
    Oct 2013
    Location
    Chapin, SC
    Posts
    1,141

    Re: Helping a friend open ihs pool - lots to adjust

    20 Mule team Borax will do a good job of getting your pH up. Google it to find it in your local area. I found it at Walmart here.
    Pool size: 24000gal inground Vinyl-Taylor k-2006 and k-1766 test kits and-speed stir
    Intermatic P1353ME digital timer w/freeze sensor
    CircuPool Si-45 SWCG System
    Polaris 280 vacuum/Polaris PB4-60 boost pump
    Pentair IntelliFlo VS 3hp Pump--Pentair sand filter

  6. Back To Top    #6

    steveg_nh's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2013
    Location
    Southern NH
    Posts
    825

    Re: Helping a friend open ihs pool - lots to adjust

    Unless I'm misunderstanding though, since I want to bring his TA up too, I washing soda will have a better affect on TA though, requiring less baking soda to be added. Probably 6 in 1, 1/2 dozen in the other.

    - - - Updated - - -

    The crazy part too, for him, is that all of the above, plus a gallon of muriatic acid just to have on hand, is about $40 of stuff. Way less than he paid last year...
    24'x40' 25k gal Imperial Mountain Pond IGP, full 28 mil VynAll Ocean Breakers liner. All Hayward system: 140k BTU HeatPro heat pump, 3/4HP single speed TriStar 2" Pump, DE6020 filter, AquaPlus Automation/Salt Chlorination, remote controls, ColorLogic 4.0 lighting. Polaris 280 w/PB4-60 BP. TF100 & K1766 test kits. Rinox Palazzo pavers and Spherik coping. Pool installed 9/2013, project completed 6/16/14.

  7. Back To Top    #7
    JesseWV's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Location
    North Central WV
    Posts
    526

    Re: Helping a friend open ihs pool - lots to adjust

    The "crazy" part is paying what he paid last year.

    Quote Originally Posted by steveg_nh View Post
    The crazy part too, for him, is that all of the above, plus a gallon of muriatic acid just to have on hand, is about $40 of stuff. Way less than he paid last year...
    16k gal, 28'x3.5', Vinyl A/G, 1hp Pentair Dynamo 2-speed Pump, Hayward S160T Sand Filter, Intermatic HB800RCL Digital Timer, Intex 8110 SWG, TF-100 Test Kit, SpeedStir Author: Jesse's Graphical Pool Testing Log

  8. Back To Top    #8

    Join Date
    Oct 2013
    Location
    Chapin, SC
    Posts
    1,141

    Re: Helping a friend open ihs pool - lots to adjust

    20 Mule team or washing soda/ash whatever you can find that's the least expensive /ppm of ph/ta. 20 mule team also increases ta
    Pool size: 24000gal inground Vinyl-Taylor k-2006 and k-1766 test kits and-speed stir
    Intermatic P1353ME digital timer w/freeze sensor
    CircuPool Si-45 SWCG System
    Polaris 280 vacuum/Polaris PB4-60 boost pump
    Pentair IntelliFlo VS 3hp Pump--Pentair sand filter

  9. Back To Top    #9

    In the Industry

    duraleigh's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Sebring, Florida
    Posts
    30,084

    Re: Helping a friend open ihs pool - lots to adjust

    Get 20 Mule Team Borax as a choice over soda ash. Soda Ash contains a residual that is typically not harmful but there is no sense putting it in your pool if Borax is available.
    Dave S.
    42k vinyl and concrete pool, 1.5hp pump, 140gpm filter
    TFTestkits , PoolMath , Pool School

  10. Back To Top    #10

    steveg_nh's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2013
    Location
    Southern NH
    Posts
    825

    Re: Helping a friend open ihs pool - lots to adjust

    Soda ash and A&H Washing Soda Detergent Booster are the same thing right? If not, if I don't want to add Borates to the pool, would Washing Soda be a better option? Plus I get a higher impact on TA with Washing Soda than Borax. As I understand it, though, Borax will impact TA at about 50% the rate of soda ash (if I'm remembering correctly). Not a big deal, just add more baking soda.

    Adding borates to the pool isn't planned, but certainly doesn't hurt anything if the rates aren't high. They do have a dog though. So if Borax is better, or Washing Soda is better, etc, could I suggest that a note be called out in Pool School, in recommended chemicals and water chemistry, as there is no distinction between one or the other. Might be good to mention the tradeoffs of using soda ash vs Borax vs washing soda. Just a thought.

    I'll run pool math again and see what it says if using Borax.

    Here's the new plan...

    values2.jpg
    24'x40' 25k gal Imperial Mountain Pond IGP, full 28 mil VynAll Ocean Breakers liner. All Hayward system: 140k BTU HeatPro heat pump, 3/4HP single speed TriStar 2" Pump, DE6020 filter, AquaPlus Automation/Salt Chlorination, remote controls, ColorLogic 4.0 lighting. Polaris 280 w/PB4-60 BP. TF100 & K1766 test kits. Rinox Palazzo pavers and Spherik coping. Pool installed 9/2013, project completed 6/16/14.

  11. Back To Top    #11

    steveg_nh's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2013
    Location
    Southern NH
    Posts
    825

    Re: Helping a friend open ihs pool - lots to adjust

    One more question. Since FC is 0, should we SLAM anyway? I read the article on slamming and it said to. My pool started off with 0 too though, and it's fine. No CCs, clear water and passes OCLT. If he passes those tests should we not bother?

    Thank you.
    24'x40' 25k gal Imperial Mountain Pond IGP, full 28 mil VynAll Ocean Breakers liner. All Hayward system: 140k BTU HeatPro heat pump, 3/4HP single speed TriStar 2" Pump, DE6020 filter, AquaPlus Automation/Salt Chlorination, remote controls, ColorLogic 4.0 lighting. Polaris 280 w/PB4-60 BP. TF100 & K1766 test kits. Rinox Palazzo pavers and Spherik coping. Pool installed 9/2013, project completed 6/16/14.

  12. Back To Top    #12
    JesseWV's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Location
    North Central WV
    Posts
    526

    Re: Helping a friend open ihs pool - lots to adjust

    You probably don't need to go through the SLAM process but the longer you wait to add chlorine the higher the risk. I would raise FC to 10 and do an OCLT if it were my pool, just to be sure. Algae is invisible when it first starts growing, better to nip it in the bud.
    16k gal, 28'x3.5', Vinyl A/G, 1hp Pentair Dynamo 2-speed Pump, Hayward S160T Sand Filter, Intermatic HB800RCL Digital Timer, Intex 8110 SWG, TF-100 Test Kit, SpeedStir Author: Jesse's Graphical Pool Testing Log

  13. Back To Top    #13

    steveg_nh's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2013
    Location
    Southern NH
    Posts
    825

    Re: Helping a friend open ihs pool - lots to adjust

    That's what I was thinking...thanks
    24'x40' 25k gal Imperial Mountain Pond IGP, full 28 mil VynAll Ocean Breakers liner. All Hayward system: 140k BTU HeatPro heat pump, 3/4HP single speed TriStar 2" Pump, DE6020 filter, AquaPlus Automation/Salt Chlorination, remote controls, ColorLogic 4.0 lighting. Polaris 280 w/PB4-60 BP. TF100 & K1766 test kits. Rinox Palazzo pavers and Spherik coping. Pool installed 9/2013, project completed 6/16/14.

  14. Back To Top    #14

    steveg_nh's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2013
    Location
    Southern NH
    Posts
    825

    Re: Helping a friend open ihs pool - lots to adjust

    I was just at the grocery store and they had am Arm and Hammer baking soda that said it was super concentrated and to use 33% less. Is that something different than just regular baking soda that I should avoid? Pool math didn't give an option for concentration.
    24'x40' 25k gal Imperial Mountain Pond IGP, full 28 mil VynAll Ocean Breakers liner. All Hayward system: 140k BTU HeatPro heat pump, 3/4HP single speed TriStar 2" Pump, DE6020 filter, AquaPlus Automation/Salt Chlorination, remote controls, ColorLogic 4.0 lighting. Polaris 280 w/PB4-60 BP. TF100 & K1766 test kits. Rinox Palazzo pavers and Spherik coping. Pool installed 9/2013, project completed 6/16/14.

  15. Back To Top    #15
    JesseWV's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Location
    North Central WV
    Posts
    526

    Re: Helping a friend open ihs pool - lots to adjust

    I'm not real sure how they can concentrate baking soda when it's already 100% sodium bicarbonate. Can you take a picture and post it next time you're there?
    16k gal, 28'x3.5', Vinyl A/G, 1hp Pentair Dynamo 2-speed Pump, Hayward S160T Sand Filter, Intermatic HB800RCL Digital Timer, Intex 8110 SWG, TF-100 Test Kit, SpeedStir Author: Jesse's Graphical Pool Testing Log

  16. Back To Top    #16
    Smykowski's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Location
    Gurnee, IL (North Suburban Chi-town)
    Posts
    3,065

    Re: Helping a friend open ihs pool - lots to adjust

    Good on you to be skeptical. When in doubt, read the ingredients list.
    33' round, 23,000 gal AG vinyl , 1HP 2spd PowerFlo Matrix downsized with 3/4HP impeller (X2), Hayward S180T 150# sand filter (X2), Hayward H250 NG heater Pool Store year 1 - $850 for 2 months; Pool Store year 2 - $440 for 2 months, TFPC year 1 - $170 for 4 months; TFPC year 2 - $95 for 4.5 months
    The most important article on this site - The ABCs of Pool Water Chemistry

  17. Back To Top    #17

    steveg_nh's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2013
    Location
    Southern NH
    Posts
    825

    Re: Helping a friend open ihs pool - lots to adjust

    I will. I looked at the ingredients and there seemed to be a lot more listed than just sodium bicarbonate.
    24'x40' 25k gal Imperial Mountain Pond IGP, full 28 mil VynAll Ocean Breakers liner. All Hayward system: 140k BTU HeatPro heat pump, 3/4HP single speed TriStar 2" Pump, DE6020 filter, AquaPlus Automation/Salt Chlorination, remote controls, ColorLogic 4.0 lighting. Polaris 280 w/PB4-60 BP. TF100 & K1766 test kits. Rinox Palazzo pavers and Spherik coping. Pool installed 9/2013, project completed 6/16/14.

  18. Back To Top    #18

    steveg_nh's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2013
    Location
    Southern NH
    Posts
    825

    Re: Helping a friend open ihs pool - lots to adjust

    So I took a look this morning. It was laundry detergent! Good thing I double checked. It said on the front "Baking soda activated" so I think it threw me. i admit I was rushing though, and had I been buying it at that point, I would have read it carefully. I found the regular old Pure Baking Soda, as is mentioned in pool school, in the baking aisle. Any reason why store brand isn't ok over A&H? The only ingredient listed was Sodium Bicarbonate USP. 61oz was $1.99.
    24'x40' 25k gal Imperial Mountain Pond IGP, full 28 mil VynAll Ocean Breakers liner. All Hayward system: 140k BTU HeatPro heat pump, 3/4HP single speed TriStar 2" Pump, DE6020 filter, AquaPlus Automation/Salt Chlorination, remote controls, ColorLogic 4.0 lighting. Polaris 280 w/PB4-60 BP. TF100 & K1766 test kits. Rinox Palazzo pavers and Spherik coping. Pool installed 9/2013, project completed 6/16/14.

  19. Back To Top    #19
    Mod Squad JVTrain's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2014
    Location
    Central Minnesota
    Posts
    5,079

    Re: Helping a friend open ihs pool - lots to adjust

    It's all the same thing. If you buy the more expensive one, you're paying for the brand and pretty packaging.
    Joel - TFP Moderator - Minnesota - **Become a TFP Supporter!** Helpful Links: ABCs of Pool Water Chemistry - SLAM Procedure - Chlorine/CYA Chart
    40x20 Pool: 32K Gallons * Vinyl * Bleach Chlorination * Hayward S270T Sand Filter * Pentair SuperFlo 1 HP * Teledyne/Laars Heater * AquaVac Tigershark * TF-100 w/ SpeedStir
    Isolated Spa - 345 Gallons

  20. Back To Top    #20
    JesseWV's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Location
    North Central WV
    Posts
    526

    Re: Helping a friend open ihs pool - lots to adjust

    I've found this at my local Walmart many times, it's pretty good deal at

    $2.05 for 4lbs!

    Hospitality-Pure-Baking-Soda-64-oz

    16k gal, 28'x3.5', Vinyl A/G, 1hp Pentair Dynamo 2-speed Pump, Hayward S160T Sand Filter, Intermatic HB800RCL Digital Timer, Intex 8110 SWG, TF-100 Test Kit, SpeedStir Author: Jesse's Graphical Pool Testing Log

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •