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Thread: Another New Guy

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    Another New Guy

    Hi, my name's Brian and I'm a poolaholic!

    Just kidding. Anyway, new the forum. I grew up with an IG pool as a kid. My wife and I decided last year to install our own IG pool. I wish I had thought to check on line for opinions and what not before hand, but that said I only have a couple of minor regrets. I live in Massachusetts (yes that's a regret but I'll save those issues for a different forum).

    We installed an 18'x36' rectangular IG pool with steps in the low end and a swim out in the deep end. It's a vinyl pool...mostly because that's what I am familiar with and also due to cost, and some other practical reason as well. We opted for a SWG system and they installed the Hayward Salt and Swim 3C (this is one of my minor regrets), a Hayward 1HP Super Pump (not really a regret, but I'm wishing maybe I had chosen something different) and a Hayward DE3620 (again, not necessarily a regret, but I was leaning towards cartridge and I let myself get talked into DE...and I hate being talked into things).

    Now, I don't know salt from shinola, but it seems on one hand there are certainly better systems out there than the S&S 3C. On the other hand, I figured I could go this route without spending a ton and get my feet wet on the whole SWG thing. The more I think about it, the more it gnaws at me that I didn't just make ask to upgrade the system. If I get two seasons out of a cell, and a new one is ~$200 (ish) then that won't be too bad and I may even stick with it. If not, I'll use it for a couple of years and upgrade. That's actually my thought process on the pump and filter as well. I grew up with Sand Filters, so DE and Cartridge are both new to me. I appreciate the "polishing" qualities of DE, but a reusable cartridge seems like the bees knees. I also know that there are pros and cons to each so it is what it is. As far as the pump goes, I do wish I had gotten something a little quieter, and maybe a VS. We'll see how it goes as well.

    Overall my install went well and the Pool Company that got the job was pretty good. He was certainly the least 'shilly' of the six I had bid on the project. I never realized what a racket this business is. In any case, our guy wasn't terrible. His estimate was by far the lowest and they were all using basically the same gear with minor variations here and there. I'm a firm believer in you get what you pay for and I wasn't prepared to skimp on giant hole in my yard, so I came right out and asked him how he can be so much lower than everyone else. His price included the safety cover, the electrician, 1000 sq/ft of poured concrete for the patio and a bunch of other little things that other companies were charging for on top of the cost of the pool. He said his approach is that he'd rather have us use him for service (opening and closing), chemicals, and general questions and not make a ton on the install. As a further example, the going rate of the changing LED light for the deep end of the pool was between $1,250 and $1,400, my guy was half of that at $650 (same exact fixture as everyone else, I compared them all, and asked him if he was using 'Hot' components or something). He said he makes money on the install, but he's not looking to retire from my one pool. Fair enough, I can appreciate that, being that I take the same approach with my own job. So all in all I feel much less violated than after buying a car.

    Unfortunately for him, I'm a DIY guy and I'm terribly obsessive, so he's likely going to miss out on my water testing and such, but I don't mind supporting the local guy when it comes to most of the consumables as long as his prices aren't way out of line. So far it seems like a good relationship. I bought some DE from him today and it was $5 for 25 pounds which seems to be the going rate.

    We installed last September, and promptly closed in early October. We just opened yesterday and the water looks great; crystal clear. There's plenty of scum on the bottom, but it's vacuuming right up. My test kit should be here today from Amazon, so I'm looking forward to that as well. Kids are psyched, wife is psyched and I'm ready to start the season.

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    Mod Squad jblizzle's Avatar
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    Re: Another New Guy

    Welcome to TFP!!!

    I am not familiar with the S&S line, I think it is just meant to be a cheap disposable SWG almost and likely requires the pump to run much longer than it really needs to. We recommend sizing the cell for 1.5-3 times the size of the pool, likely the AquaRite would have been a better choice.

    Most pumps on high speed are just as loud. If you wanted to get quieter, then you need to run at slower speeds. The easiest way for you to upgrade (if so desired) would be to just get a 2-speed motor for you existing pump. Running on low would save a good bit on power, especially if you have to run a long time for the SWG.

    I hope you ordered the K-2006 ... although the TF-100 is the better deal. You should also consider the SpeedStir
    Jason, TFP Moderator
    18k IG pebblesheen pool, Hayward ProLogic P4 w/ T-15 SWG, Pentair 1HP 2-speed Superflo, Hayward 6020 DE filter
    500 sqft Heliocol solar panels, ThePoolCleaner, TF-100 test kit w/ SpeedStir
    Pool School + Test Kit + PoolMath = A TROUBLE FREE POOL
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    Richard320's Avatar
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    Re: Another New Guy

    Welcome!

    And let me be the first to say, "Can you post some test results?"

    Get that pool balanced and going and if you need to raise the salt level at all, hold "Diamond Day" Post 5 in this thread.
    16K freeform gunite with spa; Pentair 4000 DE filter; Century Whisperflow 1 HP; Pentair Minimax heater.
    Troublefree does not mean Maintenancefree. It's like brushing your teeth: You can spend a couple minutes a day and pennies a week or go to the dentist once a year and spend several thousand dollars.
    A pool is like a pet - you have to feed it every day, even the days you don't want to play with it!

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    Re: Another New Guy

    I am not familiar with the S&S line, I think it is just meant to be a cheap disposable SWG almost and likely requires the pump to run much longer than it really needs to. We recommend sizing the cell for 1.5-3 times the size of the pool, likely the AquaRite would have been a better choice.
    Yeah, that's the impression I have as well. Not a total loss, but certainly something I'll look at upgrading within the next couple of years.

    Most pumps on high speed are just as loud. If you wanted to get quieter, then you need to run at slower speeds. The easiest way for you to upgrade (if so desired) would be to just get a 2-speed motor for you existing pump. Running on low would save a good bit on power, especially if you have to run a long time for the SWG.
    Very good tip, thank you!! Again, not a killer right now, but something to consider in the future.

    I hope you ordered the K-2006
    I did!



    And let me be the first to say, "Can you post some test results?"

    Kit just arrived this afternoon. I just finished vacuuming all the goop at the bottom, and the water "looks good" for now at least. I will test tomorrow and see where I'm at. I have not added any salt yet as the S&S manual says to get the chem balanced first.

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    Mod Squad jblizzle's Avatar
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    Re: Another New Guy

    You can add salt whenever you like, it will not affect the other test results.
    BTW, you can save a bit by getting solar salt instead of "pool" salt ... same stuff, slightly different sized chunks.
    Jason, TFP Moderator
    18k IG pebblesheen pool, Hayward ProLogic P4 w/ T-15 SWG, Pentair 1HP 2-speed Superflo, Hayward 6020 DE filter
    500 sqft Heliocol solar panels, ThePoolCleaner, TF-100 test kit w/ SpeedStir
    Pool School + Test Kit + PoolMath = A TROUBLE FREE POOL
    If you found TFP helpful and we saved you money ... Become a TFP Supporter!

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    Casey's Avatar
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    Re: Another New Guy

    Congratulations on ordering a good test kit right from the start! You're going to have a great summer in that brand new pool of yours!

    Welcome to TFP! If it's not to much trouble.... we'd love to see your family's new toy!
    I'd bet you my bikini you'll never get TFP water from a pool store!

    24' Sharkline Venture De Filter

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    Re: Another New Guy

    Welcome to the Forum!

    You're in the right place as a Poolaholic for sure.
    TFP Moderator
    Essential Links:
    ABC's Of Pool Chemistry, Test Kits, SLAM Your Pool
    28K Gal IG FreeForm, CLI Quartz, Pentair 36"SF & VS Pump, Dolphin M5, Rheem

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    Re: Another New Guy

    You can add salt whenever you like, it will not affect the other test results.
    BTW, you can save a bit by getting solar salt instead of "pool" salt ... same stuff, slightly different sized chunks.
    I did see that little tid bit in the forum already. The nice thing is that the installer already gave me the start up salt, so I'll only have to buy it for maintenance.

    ongratulations on ordering a good test kit right from the start! You're going to have a great summer in that brand new pool of yours!

    Welcome to TFP! If it's not to much trouble.... we'd love to see your family's new toy!
    Thanks! I'll try and post one later today.

    Welcome to the Forum!

    You're in the right place as a Poolaholic for sure.
    Thanks! Sure seems that way!!

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    Re: Another New Guy

    Well, I'm a twit. I thought I ordered the Taylor K-2006 but I actually ended up with the LaMotte 2056 ColorQ Pro 7. I had them both in my cart, along with a bunch of other stuff and I removed the wrong one. I thought the checkout price was a little high, but I was rushing because I had to get my little one off the bus.

    Should I return the Lamotte for the Taylor? I'm not sure how good this tech is.


    I did try it and this is what I got.

    Water temp is 53 degrees:

    FCL = 2.9

    TCL (I assume same as CC) = 2.97

    Ph = 6.9

    ALY = 22

    CH = 70

    CYA = 23
    Last edited by CLW42; 05-10-2014 at 01:01 PM. Reason: Added Readings

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    Re: Another New Guy

    If you can return it, do so and get the K2006 or the TF100 which gives you more regents.
    I'd bet you my bikini you'll never get TFP water from a pool store!

    24' Sharkline Venture De Filter

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    Re: Another New Guy

    Several of our finest have already given you some good advice, so I will merely welcome you to TFP! You have come to the right place to learn how to take control of your pool.
    Gold Supporter, TFP Lifetime Supporter, 26,680 gal Plaster IGP 3.5 - 10' depth / Attached Waterfall Spa, Manually Chlorinated, Triton Sand Filter, 1.5 HP * 1.1 SF = 1.65 SFHP 1-speed Pentair WhisperFlo WF-26 Pump, 400K BTU NG Teledyne Laars Series One Heater, Polaris 360, Test Kit Comparison, Chlorine/CYA Chart, SLAMing Your Pool, OCLT
    A good test kit is an investment, not an expense.

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    Re: Another New Guy

    I'm not sure about returning the Lamotte since I used it. I'll probably just get the K2006 anyway. Maybe run them side by side and see what's what.

    Several of our finest have already given you some good advice, so I will merely welcome you to TFP! You have come to the right place to learn how to take control of your pool.
    Thanks!

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    Re: Another New Guy

    I see people who run sets of tests using two different kits or comparing their results to the pool store. Which one do you believe? I can't figure that out.
    Dave S.
    42k vinyl and concrete pool, 1.5hp pump, 140gpm filter
    TFTestkits , PoolMath , Pool School

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    Re: Another New Guy

    Okay, ordered the TF-100. I'm guessing it should be here by Wednesday, give or take.

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    Re: Another New Guy

    Okay guys. Got my TF-100 yesterday and here are my initial results

    FCL = 2.5
    CC = 0
    PH = 7.4
    TA = 70
    CH = 100
    CYA = not sure, I could see the dot the whole time...cylinder filled to the brim and I could still see it.
    26,700 Gal., 18x36 IG pool with Vinyl. 1HP Hayward Super Pump; Hayward DE3620 Filter; Hayward SAS; TFT-100 test kit; Dolphin Atlantis Cleaner.

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    Re: Another New Guy

    The CYA test means you have no CYA. That's a very common puzzlement for newbies.

    I would suggest adding enough to get your pool to 40 ppm.

    How does your water look?

    What other questions do you have?
    Dave S.
    42k vinyl and concrete pool, 1.5hp pump, 140gpm filter
    TFTestkits , PoolMath , Pool School

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    Re: Another New Guy

    That looks easy enough to shape up! Some CYA in a sock and turn up the SWG and it's balanced.

    Have you gotten all the crud out yet?
    16K freeform gunite with spa; Pentair 4000 DE filter; Century Whisperflow 1 HP; Pentair Minimax heater.
    Troublefree does not mean Maintenancefree. It's like brushing your teeth: You can spend a couple minutes a day and pennies a week or go to the dentist once a year and spend several thousand dollars.
    A pool is like a pet - you have to feed it every day, even the days you don't want to play with it!

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    Mod Squad kimkats's Avatar
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    Re: Another New Guy

    Have you added any CYA? Have you used any pucks or sticks? They have CYA in them.

    If you have not added/used any of the above you do not have any CYA.

    Your other numbers look good.

    I can't wait to see a pic of your pool!

    Kim
    TFP Moderator 33x52 round AG 25,600 gals Sand Filter 1.5hp Pump - 2 Speed, SLAM, Pool School, Recommended Levels, Recommended Chemicals, Pool Math, Chlorine/CYA Chart, TF-100 Test Kit

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    Re: Another New Guy

    The CYA test means you have no CYA. That's a very common puzzlement for newbies.

    I would suggest adding enough to get your pool to 40 ppm.

    How does your water look?

    What other questions do you have?
    - Okay, sounds like a plan on the CYA. I knew it was going to be low or non-existent.

    - Water is crystal clear! Looks and feels great.

    - Only other question for now is: Is there a preferred brand or type of stabilizer/conditioner? I've seen a 25# bucket on Amazon for $70 but I'm not sure if it's any good. I could always run to Wally World and get the HTH brand as well...any tips?


    That looks easy enough to shape up! Some CYA in a sock and turn up the SWG and it's balanced.

    Have you gotten all the crud out yet?
    - Yup, all the crud has been gone for a couple of weeks. I vacuumed it all out within the first couple of days of opening (May 8th). I haven't run the SWG yet, because I wanted to make sure I was balanced first. I'm close...close enough to start it up I think. I'm planning on getting it going today or tomorrow morning. I was using bleach and tabs to get my levels up. It's slipped a little in the last couple of days. I was in the 4's on Monday.
    26,700 Gal., 18x36 IG pool with Vinyl. 1HP Hayward Super Pump; Hayward DE3620 Filter; Hayward SAS; TFT-100 test kit; Dolphin Atlantis Cleaner.

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    Re: Another New Guy

    You need about 16 lbs to raise CYA from zero to 70 for your SWG. Luckily, it comes in 4 lb canisters!

    I'd only add three canisters to start, because there's residual that's too low to read from using pucks, or in case your pool is smaller than you think. Maybe only 2 1/2. Adding more is easy. Getting rid of excess is hard. Pour it in a sock and set it in the skimmer or hang it in front of a return or let it bob around on a float of some sort. Don't scatter it across the surface. Don't pour it in your skimmer. And it won't predissolve in a bucket any time soon, so don't even bother trying that.
    16K freeform gunite with spa; Pentair 4000 DE filter; Century Whisperflow 1 HP; Pentair Minimax heater.
    Troublefree does not mean Maintenancefree. It's like brushing your teeth: You can spend a couple minutes a day and pennies a week or go to the dentist once a year and spend several thousand dollars.
    A pool is like a pet - you have to feed it every day, even the days you don't want to play with it!

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