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Thread: suntouch, pump and SWG wiring questions

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    suntouch, pump and SWG wiring questions

    ok I am currently in the last stages of pool construction and have posted the construction thread in 'under construction' forum (with pics!)
    I am in the middle of wiring. I have a suntouch automation system, intellifo VS and an Aquarite 40k SWG. currently I have the pump on its own 20A 2pole GFCI breaker and attached to the suntouch via comm cable, which was provided with the pump. I have a second 20A 2 pole GFCI breaker run to the suntouch and pigtailed to the suntouch transformer and then run over to the SWG, basically suntouch and SWG on same breaker.

    first question, (warning i am probably missing something simple) i ran 12-3 (red, black, white and ground) to all of the above. none of the pool equipment have connections for the neutral/white wire, but obviously the breaker does. where do i attach the neutral in the suntouch, pump and SWG?

    second question, the aquarite manual indicates to use any 4 wire comm cable to connect to the suntouch system, where does this connect in the suntouch? do i need another relay?

    third question, where do i attach bonding wire to the suntouch? it appears there is a slot on the grounding bar.

    thanks
    DIY 16x32vinyl lined IG, est. 22500 gallons, roman steps, cozy cove swim out. Pentair Suntouch automation, Pentair intelliflo VS, Hayward Aqua Rite SWG t-15, Hayward C4030 filter, 5 Aquasol 4 x 12 solar panels mounted on SW facing roof.

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    JasonLion's Avatar
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    Re: suntouch, pump and SWG wiring questions

    The white (neutral) wire does not connect to the pump or SWG at all. There is a remote chance it might come in handy inside the SunTouch, though you don't normally use/connect it.

    The AquaRite data connection connects to the comm port inside the SunTouch, the same place the pump data connection is wired to. {EDIT}The AquaRite power connection should hook up through the pump relay inside the SunTouch, so the AquaRite is only powered when the logical "pump" is on. The data connection should take care of this.{/EDIT} The logical pump and the actual physical pump are different things, which will come up just a little when programming the SunTouch.

    The SunTouch does not get bonded. It does not touch the water, and should be more than 5' from the water, so no reason to bond it.
    19K gal, vinyl, 1/2 HP WhisperFlo pump, 200 sqft cartridge filter, AutoPilot Digital SWG, Dolphin Dynamic cleaning robot
    Creator of PoolMath and Pool Calculator. Other handy links: Support this site, TF Test Kits, Pool School

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    Re: suntouch, pump and SWG wiring questions

    Most pool equipment seems to be 220 volts, which means two hot wires and no neutral, so I believe 12-2 wire would have been fine to run. Might as well just cap off the neutral wire.
    15k gunite pool. Intelliflo VF. Autopilot SWG.
    2k separate spa with waterfall (ie: pain in the rear maintaining a separate body of water). 2HP Hayward Tristar pump.

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    Re: suntouch, pump and SWG wiring questions

    Quote Originally Posted by JasonLion View Post
    The white (neutral) wire does not connect to the pump or SWG at all. There is a remote chance it might come in handy inside the SunTouch, though you don't normally use/connect it.

    The AquaRite data connection connects to the comm port inside the SunTouch, the same place the pump data connection is wired to. {EDIT}The AquaRite power connection should hook up through the pump relay inside the SunTouch, so the AquaRite is only powered when the logical "pump" is on. The data connection should take care of this.{/EDIT} The logical pump and the actual physical pump are different things, which will come up just a little when programming the SunTouch.

    The SunTouch does not get bonded. It does not touch the water, and should be more than 5' from the water, so no reason to bond it.
    ok, I thought that was the case with the white wire, should have used 12-2, but just to be clear, when I am connecting to the breaker, what should be done with the white wire? just don't insert anything in the slot for a neutral. have 2 hots into breaker and the breaker pigtail in neutral bus? I will cap 'em off in the pool equipment, they aren't hurting anything being on there.

    so with the SWG comm cables, do I pigtail them with the pump comm cable and insert in the correct color coded screw downs (j-11 connection per Pentair manual)? that seems very odd. I would have assumed they would have their own port to communicate with the suntouch...
    it just doesn't seem to make much sense to me...are you able to explain this a little more?

    I think I got the bonding idea from pg 49 of manual when it reads ' all equipment including the suntouch power center must be bonded to earth ground". It seem to make sense to me, put I wanted to be sure.

    thanks and I would appreciate any more advice with the connections
    DIY 16x32vinyl lined IG, est. 22500 gallons, roman steps, cozy cove swim out. Pentair Suntouch automation, Pentair intelliflo VS, Hayward Aqua Rite SWG t-15, Hayward C4030 filter, 5 Aquasol 4 x 12 solar panels mounted on SW facing roof.

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    JasonLion's Avatar
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    Re: suntouch, pump and SWG wiring questions

    You are correct about bonding the SunTouch, it has a special bonding lug on the ground bar. I missed that in their manual.

    You shouldn't really have used wire with a white wire in it. I wouldn't connect it on either end.

    On the data connection, the terminals on the SunTouch should easily accommodate the wires from both the pump and SWG. This is a data connection, rather like a computer network. Each devices "requests" permission to speak, and any of them can send messages to each other, taking turns to use the wire.
    19K gal, vinyl, 1/2 HP WhisperFlo pump, 200 sqft cartridge filter, AutoPilot Digital SWG, Dolphin Dynamic cleaning robot
    Creator of PoolMath and Pool Calculator. Other handy links: Support this site, TF Test Kits, Pool School

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    Re: suntouch, pump and SWG wiring questions

    Ok here is a picture of the grounding bar
    I don't see any special screw. So I will plan on just putting it into one of the slots in the grounding bar. Does that sound right?

    yes you are right, I should have used the different wire. not sure where I thought I had to use 12-3, more expensive too. oh well live and learn...slowly.

    ok, i'll connect the data cable as you indicated, makes things easier. I thought I would have to buy more cable but the intelliflo comes with something like 25 feet of cable, I used approx. 6' to connect to suntouch. can I just use 2 separate lengths of this with appropriate color coding on each?



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    does that seem right to connect bonding network to a ground? I thought the were too separate systems?
    DIY 16x32vinyl lined IG, est. 22500 gallons, roman steps, cozy cove swim out. Pentair Suntouch automation, Pentair intelliflo VS, Hayward Aqua Rite SWG t-15, Hayward C4030 filter, 5 Aquasol 4 x 12 solar panels mounted on SW facing roof.

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    Re: suntouch, pump and SWG wiring questions

    Bonding and ground are two separate systems, but they are often connected. For example both are attached to the motor chassis. There is really no avoiding them being connected, you just don't want to do it more than required. Yea, any place on the ground bar is fine.

    On the data connection, remember to follow the diagram in the AquaRite about how to convert between Hayward wire colors and Pentair wire colors when connecting the data cable to the AquaRite.
    19K gal, vinyl, 1/2 HP WhisperFlo pump, 200 sqft cartridge filter, AutoPilot Digital SWG, Dolphin Dynamic cleaning robot
    Creator of PoolMath and Pool Calculator. Other handy links: Support this site, TF Test Kits, Pool School

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    Re: suntouch, pump and SWG wiring questions

    Ok cool thanks. Yeah I'm planning on taking my time with the comm cable, lots of colors there


    DIY 16x32vinyl lined IG, est. 22500 gallons, roman steps, cozy cove swim out. Pentair Suntouch automation, Pentair intelliflo VS, Hayward Aqua Rite SWG t-15, Hayward C4030 filter, 5 Aquasol 4 x 12 solar panels mounted on SW facing roof.

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    Re: suntouch, pump and SWG wiring questions

    Cant tell from your pictures, but are you using conduit from the power center to the equipment? If so, you shouldn't use romex in the conduit. Romex is intended for exposed use and can overheat if run through conduit.

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    Re: suntouch, pump and SWG wiring questions

    ok inspector wanted metal in direct contact with pool as part of bonding system, he suggested there was a plate that most people put in skimmer, or an in line piece of PVC with metal inside to accomplish this. why wouldn't ladder or handrail accomplish the same thing?
    DIY 16x32vinyl lined IG, est. 22500 gallons, roman steps, cozy cove swim out. Pentair Suntouch automation, Pentair intelliflo VS, Hayward Aqua Rite SWG t-15, Hayward C4030 filter, 5 Aquasol 4 x 12 solar panels mounted on SW facing roof.

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    Re: suntouch, pump and SWG wiring questions

    Probably looking for something like this.

    A ladder can be used as a way to bond the water, instead of a plate like the one mentioned above, as long as the ladder is conductive throughout and bonded. Some inspectors worry that the ladder may be replaced with a non-conductive ladder at some point and require the plate, or other similar fitting.
    19K gal, vinyl, 1/2 HP WhisperFlo pump, 200 sqft cartridge filter, AutoPilot Digital SWG, Dolphin Dynamic cleaning robot
    Creator of PoolMath and Pool Calculator. Other handy links: Support this site, TF Test Kits, Pool School

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    Re: suntouch, pump and SWG wiring questions

    Thanks Jason, I found the same. I am going to call him and see what he thinks of ladder.
    Just FYI, I wound up wrapping the number 8 bonding wire around nylon bolt on the corner metal pieces ( look like angle iron) and tightening it up against metal to bond those pieces. We both felt it was a tight bond and the nylon should be there for a couple hundred years.
    Thanks


    DIY 16x32vinyl lined IG, est. 22500 gallons, roman steps, cozy cove swim out. Pentair Suntouch automation, Pentair intelliflo VS, Hayward Aqua Rite SWG t-15, Hayward C4030 filter, 5 Aquasol 4 x 12 solar panels mounted on SW facing roof.

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    Re: suntouch, pump and SWG wiring questions

    Good news, inspector said ladder should be fine.


    DIY 16x32vinyl lined IG, est. 22500 gallons, roman steps, cozy cove swim out. Pentair Suntouch automation, Pentair intelliflo VS, Hayward Aqua Rite SWG t-15, Hayward C4030 filter, 5 Aquasol 4 x 12 solar panels mounted on SW facing roof.

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