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Thread: PLEASE HELP: Need advice on reverting a swamp to a sparkly blue!

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    PLEASE HELP: Need advice on reverting a swamp to a sparkly blue!

    Hello all! My name is Katie and I am new to this forum and to the wonderful world of pool maintenance!

    Last year, my husband and I purchased a house with a pool (with a new liner), but we had no clue about pool care so we just hired a pool guy. He was very helpful, he kept it regulated throughout the summer. He told us that we could keep it open throughout the winter without covering it and come spring, he would get it back up and running for a few hundred dollars.

    Well, to make a long story short, I recently called him about the pool and he stopped by to survey it. His response to me: There are waaay too many leaves and just being honest, he won't feel like cleaning them all out. So now, I'm without a pool guy and no other company in the area has called me back. This whole week has been very stressful, but I finally broke down and decided to fix it up myself!

    I've been reading different articles online about similar scenarios to mine. Right now, our pool is dark green and very obscure so that we can't see the bottom on either the shallow or deep end. There must be thousands upon thousands of leaves at the bottom perhaps along with some other debris. When I rake the shallow end, I can sort of see the bottom is lighter than is with the surrounding mounds of leaves. Also, with the coming of spring, everything (including the surface of the pool) was recently covered with pollen, which does NOT make my life any easier.

    So far, my husband and I have tried to clear as many leaves as possible with our net, but seem to be making no progress and scooping blindly. (Sidenote: Last year, some heavy rain caused mud to flush into the water, and when we went to rake some things out of the deep end, our pole broke, and that's how we actually found our pool guy!) I don't want to lose the pole again, but from what I've read, scooping blindly is the only way out of this mess.
    Also, I've read stories from people who used something called a "leaf eater;" it sucks up all of the leaves/debris into a bag using the garden hose. I'm not sure whether I should purchase one for this scenario, given I can't see into the water clearly.

    Our skimmer is pretty low-tech, from what I recall our pool guy telling us. It's just a simple basket, I can't recall the name he used for it. All I can remember him saying about cleaning the water is setting the filter to backwash for a while, shocking, and backwashing again. However, I've read precautions not to waste so many chemicals with all of the decomposed leaves just eating it away.

    I guess this is what I'm asking: Does anyone have any advice for my particular scenario (I've attached some pics)? I don't think draining is necessary based on what I've heard. But I'm nowhere near a body builder, so I haven't been of much assistance to my husband hauling these leaves out. Would it help us to get the leaf eater? Are there any chemicals we could use to clear up the water so we can see better without the plant matter eating it? I know how fast algae grows back, so we've yet to douse it with anything. Another concern I have is how long the process will take. Like I said, we're not sure what kind of progress we're making, if any, so how long should it take to clean up? I'm not sure how many gallons, but the depth ranges from 3 to 9 feet across. I'd like to have it cleaned up, if possible, by the end of the month. So many sunny days lately, and we've been stuck looking at our swamp! I've been going through several related threads, but I just want to be sure that I'm on the right track. I may just need some moral support LOL!

    Other than that, I'm a proud momma of 2 girls and 2 pups (both boys). My daughter's birthday is actually on the 3rd of next month and she's had her heart set on a pool party since last year. I've talked to her about having a party at Chuck E Cheese's instead and although she says she won't be entirely disappointed, I would still like to get the pool cleaned for my little fish! Please give me some GOOD news if you can--thanks in advance!
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    Richard320's Avatar
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    Re: PLEASE HELP: Need advice on reverting a swamp to a sparkly blue!

    Welcome!

    Heck, we've seen worse here. Leaf rake and pole, draq things to the shallow end and hoist the soggy mess out. When you're no longer catching much, start the SLAM. I'm betting you have read that article a few times, huh?

    We're not kidding when we say the right test kit is essential. You might discover that your CYA level is astronomical and a partial drain is called for. In which case, you might have somewhat better visibility when dragging for debris. It appears you have a vinyl pool, so you don't want to drain it too low; leave a foot of water at least in the shallow end lest the liner wrinkle. However, draining may not be necessary - it all depends on test results.

    It can be cleared! Here's some encouragement. I used to have a whole page of good green-to-clean photo essays bookmarked, but alas, I lost them when we switched servers or whatever. http://www.troublefreepool.com/threa...and-new-to-BBB


    16K freeform gunite with spa; Pentair 4000 DE filter; Century Whisperflow 1 HP; Pentair Minimax heater.
    Troublefree does not mean Maintenancefree. It's like brushing your teeth: You can spend a couple minutes a day and pennies a week or go to the dentist once a year and spend several thousand dollars.
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    Re: PLEASE HELP: Need advice on reverting a swamp to a sparkly blue!

    Like Richard said you are on the right track. Also correct is the fact you need a quality test kit the TF100 is your best and most economical choice. Scoop as much of the debris out as you can blindly then with a test kit we can guide you through the slam process with little difficulty
    Nathan
    15x30 gunite 18k gallons Hayward star clear plus 120sqft cart

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    Re: PLEASE HELP: Need advice on reverting a swamp to a sparkly blue!

    You are in the right place now. Many people including myself have been in the same situation before. In my case I bought a foreclosure with a pool that was not used for a long time with and could not see more than 6" deep. With a lot trees nearby and the leaf net bringing up leaves, worms, and all kinds of other stuff I had no idea where to start.

    First thing to do is order the recommended test kit and read the Pool School articles, it will allow you to understand your pool so much better and you get to rely on your testing and not that of the pool stores. It will also allow you to avoid spending a lot of money at the pool store.

    While you are waiting for you test kit to you need to continue getting the debris out of the pool. Are you familiar with your pool equipment and how to control the valves? What really helped me was that I bought a manual pool vacuum ( http://www.amazon.com/Swimline-8150-...ds=pool+vacuum ). The vacuum head attaches to your pool pole and hose runs from the vacuum head to the hole in the skimmer. You want to isolate the skimmer so it is the only thing pulling water to the pump.

    With this connected you will vacuum the bottom of your pool as you would your floor in the house. Go slow and don't try to chase things around, go back and forth until you covered the entire floor of your pool. You will most likely have to do this several times. It also increases the chances of clogging the pipe and the propeller of your pump and it gets old really fast. You mentioned a leaf eater but there is also another device that will go inline to the vacuuming process I described so far and that is an inline leaf catcher http://www.amazon.com/Pentair-R21108...l+leaf+catcher . This is another purchase but it keeps the bigger items from flowing through your pipes and to the pump. This saves the stress on you equipment and makes its much easier to clean your pool.

    Once you have gotten most of the debris out of the water and you have your test kit you will want to test your water and post your results here. What will matter at first are the CYA and CH levels, this will determine if you can treat your current water or if you need to replace some or all of it.

    If your CYA and CH levels are ok than you can start treating your water to bring it back to a looking like new.

    There is much more we can discuss but this should be a good start and I am sure you will get many responses as we love to see people learn and apply the methods shown on this site.
    25,000 gallon in ground white plaster- 1 1/2 HP Pentair SuperFlo pump - 60 sqft FNS DE filter (with FiberClear), 1999 Sundance Optima 850 hot tub.
    Manassas Park, VA

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    Divin Dave's Avatar
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    Re: PLEASE HELP: Need advice on reverting a swamp to a sparkly blue!

    What everyone else says. You are fine and no need to worry anymore.

    1st you have GOT to have the right test kit, otherwise you might as well fill it with dirt and forget about it.
    2nd go ahead any by a whole bunch of 8.25 percent bleach while you are waiting on your test kit to arrive.

    Very nice pool by the way... Its gonna look awesome very soon.
    Divin Dave,
    IG Vinyl, 15' x 30', 3 1/2' - 6' deep, Oval, ~15K gal, Intelliclor IC40, Intelliflo VS pump, Clean and Clear 420 Filter, auto-fill-disabled, Retrofit LED Color Light, Dolphin Nautilus Robot, TF100 Test Kit, Taylor K1766 Salt Test Kit, Tftestkit Pressure Gauge.
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    Re: PLEASE HELP: Need advice on reverting a swamp to a sparkly blue!

    Thank you all SO much for getting back with me! I am making my shopping list now and so far I have (1) the TF1000 test kit and (2) loads of bleach/chlorine. We're doing our best to move as much as we can toward the shallow end.

    Yes, it is vinyl (sorry, I didn't know if that helped or not)! We have a brush vacuum but were advised only to use it after all of the major debris (ie: rocks, pine cones) was collected and only to suck up the dirt. And I checked out the leaf eater that Rocco linked; now, will I be able to use it and the vaccuum at this point, or should I wait until after I put the chemicals in?

    I have only ever used the backwash function on our filter (where the water shoots out) and I guess it's called the "filter" function (where the little jets turn on and cause the water to flow in a certain direction). Other than that, as I'm sure you can tell, I'm pretty lost.
    I will post the CYA levels as soon as I get the new kit. We're out of the little strips that we used to have; the ones that are left only measure free chlorine, pH and something called "stabilizer."

    But I am so relieved to hear that the pool can be revived! I will post updates/pictures to this thread, or start a new one if need be. Thank you all SO MUCH for your advice and have a nice weekend!

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    Re: PLEASE HELP: Need advice on reverting a swamp to a sparkly blue!

    Welcome to the forum!

    Keep all of your information in this thread. It will keep the "story" coherent, so you will get better advice.

    You have gotten good advice so far. I'll add a few things.

    Don't bother with the strips. They are basically one step above worthless, and they will likely just confuse the situation. Just throw them out. The TF100 is far superior, and you don't need strips ever again.

    You aren't going to be able to do much with chemicals until you get the kit in hand and can give us a set of test results. It is going to bother you that you're not "doing anything" yet, so here's your assignment:
    1. Get as much as you can out of the pool manually, whether with the rake, the net, the scoop, whatever. It will make the process easier down the line, and with the larger solids, it's essential.
    2. Read Pool School over and over. The link is in the upper right corner of every page. There is a lot of info, so don't get discouraged if it reads like Swahili right now. It will start to click eventually (took me about 4 or 5 passes before I started to "get it").
    3. Spend time in the forums reading and learning from others' experiences. The "swamp to clear" process is remarkably similar from user to user. If you are familiar with how it will progress, it will be much easier to stick with the process once you are the one doing it.

    We are glad you decided to take control of your pool, and we love helping, so keep those questions coming. And pictures! We love pictures (plus it helps you see your progress along the way).
    33' round, 23,000 gal AG vinyl , 1HP 2spd PowerFlo Matrix downsized with 3/4HP impeller (X2), Hayward S180T 150# sand filter (X2), Hayward H250 NG heater Pool Store year 1 - $850 for 2 months; Pool Store year 2 - $440 for 2 months, TFPC year 1 - $170 for 4 months; TFPC year 2 - $95 for 4.5 months
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    Re: PLEASE HELP: Need advice on reverting a swamp to a sparkly blue!

    not to sound like a broken record but your pool is not that dirty and will look beautiful when clean, there was a pool just recently that looked like sump oil
    add as much information you know about your pool to your signature then we can answer specifically to suit your pool/filtration/chlorine system
    at the top right of the page is a link "settings" then edit your signature
    order a recomended test kit http://www.troublefreepool.com/conte...its-comparison
    then while you wait for a test kit start scooping leaves. when you get tired give the pole to hubby and tell him it's his turn
    post a photo of your pump/filter system if you are not sure of what is what
    start looking for the cheapest place that sells liquid chlorine or plain high strength bleach you are going to need a lot
    SWG inground peanut shaped eco-bright concrete pool
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    are you taking care of your pool or is the poolshop taking care of you

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    Re: PLEASE HELP: Need advice on reverting a swamp to a sparkly blue!

    I also have this same battle annually and have a few additional points.

    Never ever vacuum WITHOUT the skimmer baskets in place. I learned the hard way and sucked up a couple "gumballs" and had to deal with one semi clogged return until it deteriorated. About a season and half of slow skimming. Happy I have have two skimmers.
    I do a combo of leaf bag, brush, vacuum, backwash and then over and over again till it slowly gets clearer.
    Then the test kit process and it will be crystal before you know it.

    I do have a thought and wanted to see if anyone has gone this direction.

    I want to run on recirculate without my filter engaged and get the large stuff out. I go through a lot of DE in my current process and my thought is once I get the majority of the large stuff with vacuum then I will go back to filter mode and get the fine particles out. I am having to backwash every 30 minutes doing it as I have while vacuuming in the early stages.

    This is the best site ever and thank you all!
    JagMan1964
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    Re: PLEASE HELP: Need advice on reverting a swamp to a sparkly blue!

    Hey there- You'll need to get that test kit pronto. TF-100 is my choice, source is in my siggy line.
    You also need to start working to get the schmutz out- all those leaves and debris just slow down the entire process. And from the look of your yard you're going to get very familiar with brushing, netting out leaves and vacuuming. Consider it healthy exercise Read Pool School articles (top right hand link on this site).
    One thing I did when it was new to me is watch videos on YouTube about how to vacuum etc. Not all videos were applicable to my own pool, but they might still be helpful to learning the equipment and terminology. Backwashing will be something you'll need to learn about. Ignore the videos by pool stores showing you how to buy the chemicals they sell- bleach is cheaper and much easier to deal with, capisce?
    Holler when you have more questions. The experts here will chime in. Honest
    My Amazon Smile for November12K Fiberglass IG, Infinity 4000 automatic cover, SWCG, Hayward Sand Filter, Hayward 1.5 Pump, Doheny Discovery Robot, Savi Melody LED pool lights, outdoor speakers and other assorted doo-dads. Sundance Altamar Hot Tub.
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    Re: PLEASE HELP: Need advice on reverting a swamp to a sparkly blue!

    Quote Originally Posted by JagMan1964 View Post
    I also have this same battle annually and have a few additional points.

    Never ever vacuum WITHOUT the skimmer baskets in place. I learned the hard way and sucked up a couple "gumballs" and had to deal with one semi clogged return until it deteriorated. About a season and half of slow skimming. Happy I have have two skimmers.
    I do a combo of leaf bag, brush, vacuum, backwash and then over and over again till it slowly gets clearer.
    Then the test kit process and it will be crystal before you know it.

    I do have a thought and wanted to see if anyone has gone this direction.

    I want to run on recirculate without my filter engaged and get the large stuff out. I go through a lot of DE in my current process and my thought is once I get the majority of the large stuff with vacuum then I will go back to filter mode and get the fine particles out. I am having to backwash every 30 minutes doing it as I have while vacuuming in the early stages.

    This is the best site ever and thank you all!
    If you have something to catch the big stuff, your idea makes sense. However, on recirculate, the filter is taken out of the loop. So all the finer sludge you suck off the bottom will just go shooting out the returns and into suspension, clouding the pool. Maybe stretching a nylon across the skimmer basket to get the worst of things? I expect it would clog up quick, but it is simpler to clean than the filter. Eventually, you will have to vacuum through the filter to get everything out.
    16K freeform gunite with spa; Pentair 4000 DE filter; Century Whisperflow 1 HP; Pentair Minimax heater.
    Troublefree does not mean Maintenancefree. It's like brushing your teeth: You can spend a couple minutes a day and pennies a week or go to the dentist once a year and spend several thousand dollars.
    A pool is like a pet - you have to feed it every day, even the days you don't want to play with it!

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    Re: PLEASE HELP: Need advice on reverting a swamp to a sparkly blue!

    Hello all! Our kit just arrived yesterday, and from the looks of it, our CYA is at 70. I've continued to research SLAM-ing and I don't think this is too high to drain? And our pool is NOT saltwater. So far, we've just been hauling out leaves, and I think we might be able to wrap that up today! Yea! We have a box of shock left over from last season, and I found a couples cases of Clorox bleach (about 20 bottles, but not the huge jugs). Advice for what to do next?

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    Smykowski's Avatar
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    Re: PLEASE HELP: Need advice on reverting a swamp to a sparkly blue!

    It's much higher than we recommend, but it can be done; it will just take a lot of bleach to get to SLAM levels.

    Can you post your full set of test results before you get started?
    33' round, 23,000 gal AG vinyl , 1HP 2spd PowerFlo Matrix downsized with 3/4HP impeller (X2), Hayward S180T 150# sand filter (X2), Hayward H250 NG heater Pool Store year 1 - $850 for 2 months; Pool Store year 2 - $440 for 2 months, TFPC year 1 - $170 for 4 months; TFPC year 2 - $95 for 4.5 months
    The most important article on this site - The ABCs of Pool Water Chemistry

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    Re: PLEASE HELP: Need advice on reverting a swamp to a sparkly blue!

    Do you know the size of your pool in gallons? If not at the bottom of the pool math page is a calculator for that.

    Not to scare you but the amount of bleach/chlorine needed in the beginning is hard to imagine, untill you have done it.

    My pool is 17000 gallons to rase the chlorine levels to 30 I need about 8 gallons of 6% bleach. Be prepared to put that much chlorine into the pool daily for the first few days.

    **edit** correction to number of gallons
    27' AG, sand filter, Pentair 340203 Two-Speed 3/4-Horsepower, hard plumbed

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    Re: PLEASE HELP: Need advice on reverting a swamp to a sparkly blue!

    Whew! Has it been a stressful couple of weeks!
    With so much commotion, including sick kids, hours at work changing and unpredictable weather on top, I have finally found to time to update the post.
    We haven't been neglecting our pool this entire time and we're still looking to keep it up ourselves. I contacted the previous owner of the home (the family we brought it from still lives in the area), and when we went to survey the pool, we discovered that a pipe had actually burst in the system; he also told me the pool is about 4000 gallons. My husband found the part we needed and we had it replaced. Then, we went ahead and backwashed the pool about 5 times to drain it (I went back and read some articles and decided our CYA level was too high and it'd be better to just do a partial drain than risk anything). This was last week when we added the bleach/chemicals to begin the SLAM. It caused the water to turn sort of turquoise for a while and a lot of the leaves resurfaced (I wish we'd done that sooner--less lifting for me)! A storm came through on Tuesday and knocked a lot of debris back into the water--and four trees in the front yard! We just treated it again today with more bleach (gonna have to get a new supply soon), and I think we'll be able to clear/vacuum the bottom once the water clears up some more. Thank you all for your help on this journey so far; this website has been an incredibly useful tool! Definitely referring everyone I know with a pool here!

    (These pictures are from today, May 1st, after we've treated it with chemicals twice)

    Pool (2).jpg

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    Re: PLEASE HELP: Need advice on reverting a swamp to a sparkly blue!

    The others say the picture files exceed the maximum by 40/50 megapixels, but I'm not sure why; they're the same size...
    But the color right now is like a darker lime green, and we've been running the filter all afternoon.

    * To be more precise, it's slightly darker than the water in the picture that Mr. Richard first posted and about the same transparency.

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    Re: PLEASE HELP: Need advice on reverting a swamp to a sparkly blue!

    Hang in there you will get it, the key is keeping the chlorine at SHOCK LEVEL while doing the SLAM, this means frequent testing and dosing (every couple of hours), whenever you let the FC get below Shock Level the algae starts winning again and you end in a stalemate condition.
    Indoor 20x40 35,000 gallon vinyl pool with 1.5 HP 2 speed Jandy FloPro pump, Hayward EC75 Perflex DE filter, 11 4x12 Techno-Solis solar panels w/ Aquasolar controller, Aquabot Turbo T Robot Cleaner. Also LMI metering chlorine dispenser pump and HotSpring Jetsetter
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    Re: PLEASE HELP: Need advice on reverting a swamp to a sparkly blue!

    Are you still pulling leaves out? I'd keep raking the bottom with the leaf rake trying to get more leaves out! I'd also start brushing the pool walls and floor.
    I'd bet you my bikini you'll never get TFP water from a pool store!

    24' Sharkline Venture De Filter

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    Mod Squad YippeeSkippy's Avatar
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    Re: PLEASE HELP: Need advice on reverting a swamp to a sparkly blue!

    Quote Originally Posted by AquaticLego View Post
    the pool is about 4000 gallons.
    Just a hunch here but that pool can not be only 4000 gallons I think you can find the method of estimating your pool capacity in Pool School.
    My Amazon Smile for November12K Fiberglass IG, Infinity 4000 automatic cover, SWCG, Hayward Sand Filter, Hayward 1.5 Pump, Doheny Discovery Robot, Savi Melody LED pool lights, outdoor speakers and other assorted doo-dads. Sundance Altamar Hot Tub.
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    Divin Dave's Avatar
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    Re: PLEASE HELP: Need advice on reverting a swamp to a sparkly blue!

    Just a reminder. You need to keep your FC at SLAM level until ALL of the algae is dead.

    The only way to determine that is to do a Overnight Chlorine Loss Test (a.k.a, OCLT).
    Test your FC right at dark.
    Test it again first thing next morning.

    If your FC has dropped overnight, the drop is due to it still killing algae, and also killing itsef in the process.
    If your FC has not dropped the next morning, the the SLAM is complete and its time to filter filter filter until all of the dead algae is filtered out. When you pass the OCLT, then bring your FC down to regular maintenance level.
    Divin Dave,
    IG Vinyl, 15' x 30', 3 1/2' - 6' deep, Oval, ~15K gal, Intelliclor IC40, Intelliflo VS pump, Clean and Clear 420 Filter, auto-fill-disabled, Retrofit LED Color Light, Dolphin Nautilus Robot, TF100 Test Kit, Taylor K1766 Salt Test Kit, Tftestkit Pressure Gauge.
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