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Thread: Vinyl Liner Steps - need some help/advice

  1. Back To Top    #1

    Join Date
    Aug 2010
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    Atlanta, GA
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    39

    Vinyl Liner Steps - need some help/advice

    I am replacing my pool liner on a 20x40 pool with vinyl covered steps. The liner I have has pulled away at the top and basically looked awful. There is only going to be a few inches (maybe 1) of water on that top step and I'm pretty scared it will happen again. I finally pulled the liner back (of course it's brittle and broke so I'm committed now to doing this!). The liner appeared to be incorrectly measured as I can't believe it would shrink that much (but maybe, does the sun shrink the liner? I thought they only stretched maybe an inch maybe more?). Here is my question.

    I see a lot of talk on fiberglass rods on steps and although that doesn't seem great, it holds the liner to the steps (I really just need this on the top). I was hoping to find a broken one with steel or something but I didn't. What I found was concrete steps, I guess they are poured? Nothing on the edge to hold the liner in. All that is on the steps is foam padding (also on step treads and risers, should there be padding on the treads?)

    I see instructions like this about the fiberglass rod but can't see to find anything to install it (also assuming I can't do this easily with concrete) - http://www.poolproductsdirect.com/li...tructions.html

    I did find someone selling the clips on ebay but that was it (maybe my search terms are bad?) http://www.ebay.com/itm/70-Stainless...p2054897.l4275

    Finally I see this and it looks pretty interesting but I don't see an option for a bead on the liner steps from intheswim (where I'm ordering a vynall liner) - http://www.frankwall.com/products/misc_products.html

    Anyone have any thoughts? Need pictures? I can post tomorrow if that helps! I've been taking the pool measurements about 4x over just to be sure!

    PS - on a side note, I killed a huge black widow two years ago. Last year, I actually caught one in a glass jar and showed it off. Never saw any more except this year. WHen I pulled back the cover...little ones in there, so I guess they have been living in the pool liner on the steps for a few years. I doubt they will survive the delta dust I injected down there earlier today but I thought it odd they were living there...
    40x20 Vinyl Inground (27,000 gal). SWG with Pentair 48 DE Filter.
    Also have a broken Polaris pump with no polaris and a broken AquaCal Heat Pump...inherited from last owner.

  2. Back To Top    #2

    Re: Vinyl Liner Steps - need some help/advice

    We have steel steps on a 20 x 40 roman that locks the liner at each step. They are from Cardinal Systems. http://cardinalsystemsinc.com/produc...sundecks-spas/


    20x44.5 (3.5 feet SE, 10 feet DE), IG, Vinyl, Hayward Cartridge (C4030), 2HP Hayward Super Pump (SP2615X20), 2 main drains, 5 returns, Hayward ColorLogic 4.0, Circu Pool RJ60 SWG, Hayward Heat Pro 140K BTU, Polaris 380, Polaris Booster Pump (PB4-60),

  3. Back To Top    #3

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    Mar 2013
    Location
    New Hampshire
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    350

    Re: Vinyl Liner Steps - need some help/advice

    Our stairs are steel and were put in like the rest of the pool with the vermiculite under each step etc. The liner is held in place just the same as the other parts of the liner. You can see pictures of stairs in signature.
    18k: IG: Black Granite Liner: Aspen: 16x33.5: SWG: Polaris 280

    My pool build new-pool-build-in-nh-t60957.html

  4. Back To Top    #4

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    Aug 2010
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    Atlanta, GA
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    Re: Vinyl Liner Steps - need some help/advice

    Quote Originally Posted by doobs41378 View Post
    Our stairs are steel and were put in like the rest of the pool with the vermiculite under each step etc. The liner is held in place just the same as the other parts of the liner. You can see pictures of stairs in signature.
    Are the links still working? I didn't see the pictures.
    40x20 Vinyl Inground (27,000 gal). SWG with Pentair 48 DE Filter.
    Also have a broken Polaris pump with no polaris and a broken AquaCal Heat Pump...inherited from last owner.

  5. Back To Top    #5

    Re: Vinyl Liner Steps - need some help/advice

    I just clicked the link and it worked. Try searching cardinal pool system steps...our Garrett liner was designed with a strip on each step (liner back) that inserted into the steel steps from Cardinal.


    20x44.5 (3.5 feet SE, 10 feet DE), IG, Vinyl, Hayward Cartridge (C4030), 2HP Hayward Super Pump (SP2615X20), 2 main drains, 5 returns, Hayward ColorLogic 4.0, Circu Pool RJ60 SWG, Hayward Heat Pro 140K BTU, Polaris 380, Polaris Booster Pump (PB4-60),

  6. Back To Top    #6

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    Aug 2010
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    Atlanta, GA
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    Re: Vinyl Liner Steps - need some help/advice

    Quote Originally Posted by Drsafety View Post
    I just clicked the link and it worked. Try searching cardinal pool system steps...our Garrett liner was designed with a strip on each step (liner back) that inserted into the steel steps from Cardinal.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    I saw that, but didn't see the beaded step option for the vynall liner.
    Firefox is showing the images...that was my mistake! Looking now.
    40x20 Vinyl Inground (27,000 gal). SWG with Pentair 48 DE Filter.
    Also have a broken Polaris pump with no polaris and a broken AquaCal Heat Pump...inherited from last owner.

  7. Back To Top    #7

    Re: Vinyl Liner Steps - need some help/advice

    I will need to look at my install pictures, but I believe the liner track is screwed down to to steel steps. The liner holds tight and it looks great. My only issue is the steps are steel...if you fall back against them it can hurt.


    20x44.5 (3.5 feet SE, 10 feet DE), IG, Vinyl, Hayward Cartridge (C4030), 2HP Hayward Super Pump (SP2615X20), 2 main drains, 5 returns, Hayward ColorLogic 4.0, Circu Pool RJ60 SWG, Hayward Heat Pro 140K BTU, Polaris 380, Polaris Booster Pump (PB4-60),

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    Aug 2010
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    Atlanta, GA
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    Re: Vinyl Liner Steps - need some help/advice

    Quote Originally Posted by Drsafety View Post
    I will need to look at my install pictures, but I believe the liner track is screwed down to to steel steps. The liner holds tight and it looks great. My only issue is the steps are steel...if you fall back against them it can hurt.
    I'm thinking of cutting into the concrete (could it be vermiculite over steel? I'll look for signs). And install this http://www.poolsbycardinal.com/sidemount-coping-vt.php
    I'm asking the liner vendor if bead can be added on back of steps. I wonder if they say no if I can just glue it on the back. I'm not sure that's a good option, any thoughts?
    I can cut into the steps to install the bead track (cut vertical/up-down).
    40x20 Vinyl Inground (27,000 gal). SWG with Pentair 48 DE Filter.
    Also have a broken Polaris pump with no polaris and a broken AquaCal Heat Pump...inherited from last owner.

  9. Back To Top    #9

    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    Atlanta, GA
    Posts
    39

    Re: Vinyl Liner Steps - need some help/advice

    I know I'm being a pain but what about just using the loops for a rod and shoving them into the bead track with a bead lock? Anyone ever do that?
    40x20 Vinyl Inground (27,000 gal). SWG with Pentair 48 DE Filter.
    Also have a broken Polaris pump with no polaris and a broken AquaCal Heat Pump...inherited from last owner.

  10. Back To Top    #10

    In the Industry

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    Nov 2011
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    Moberly,MO
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    978

    Re: Vinyl Liner Steps - need some help/advice

    This has always been my biggest reason vinyl on steps was not a good idea. As vinyl ages it shronks. Not having 1' or more of water over it usually leads to it pulling away. The old loop and rod system isn't going to hold it. Latham I know has a system to lock it in the only thing is you would have to replace the entire step system you have now. Not 100% on that but pretty sure.
    Over 30 years in the pool business
    We build vinyl, fiberglass, stainless steel pools
    Certified in Hydraulics

  11. Back To Top    #11

    In the Industry

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    May 2013
    Location
    Albany, NY
    Posts
    59

    Re: Vinyl Liner Steps - need some help/advice

    Vynall does have the ability to manufacture a bead on the underside of the liner for attaching to a horizontal extrusion-type liner track that can be added to concrete formed steps with liner overlay. I've found that this way holds with less slippage / issues than the rod-and-loop method. Echoing swimcmp's concern, however, I'd certainly want more than one inch of water on top of that top step.
    Eric Adams, Technical Specialist, Radiant Pools

  12. Back To Top    #12

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    Mar 2014
    Location
    Canada
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    14

    Re: Vinyl Liner Steps - need some help/advice

    When you order the liner you can have a bead put on the back of it. Using side mount track does work and will hold the liner in place. I actually had to do this last year on a pool with vinyl over benches. I've done the rod in pocket way and it doesn't work as good as the beaded lock in method. Another way to do it is to order the liner and there are company's that can vinyl weld the step section on site for a perfect fit.

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