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Thread: Is there a max flow rate for SW Generators?

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    Is there a max flow rate for SW Generators?

    I have ask this question a few times at the local shops but I kind of get a non answer answer. Basically not a yes or a no.

    With my current set up below in my signature, I am not getting any Chlorine really in my tests. SWG is brand new. I feel it is set up right as per instructions. The guy that sold it to me assures me that it should be producing chlorine.

    I am running 8 hours per day with the Nano set to 85%. I had it on "boost" a couple times last week and even ran for almost 14 hours with no noticeable chlorine jump.

    Is my pump too much?

    I have the nano set up where it has a bypass manifold. As I understand it this is to have any excessive flow not pass through the SWG cell so it functions more efficiently. Maybe not.

    Ideas?
    8,000 gallon Saltwater
    Hayward Pro Grid DE-4820
    Pentair WhisperFlo 2HP
    Auto Pilot Nano SWG

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    Smykowski's Avatar
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    Re: Is there a max flow rate for SW Generators?

    Welcome!

    I think the answer is no, there is no max flow rate, but I'll let others chime in. What test kit are you using to test for chlorine? Did you try taking a sample right at the return and test that?
    33' round, 23,000 gal AG vinyl , 1HP 2spd PowerFlo Matrix downsized with 3/4HP impeller (X2), Hayward S180T 150# sand filter (X2), Hayward H250 NG heater Pool Store year 1 - $850 for 2 months; Pool Store year 2 - $440 for 2 months, TFPC year 1 - $170 for 4 months; TFPC year 2 - $95 for 4.5 months
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    Mod Squad jblizzle's Avatar
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    Re: Is there a max flow rate for SW Generators?

    I agree with the above response.
    What does your water look like?
    Jason, TFP Moderator
    18k IG pebblesheen pool, Hayward ProLogic P4 w/ T-15 SWG, Pentair 1HP 2-speed Superflo, Hayward 6020 DE filter
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    Re: Is there a max flow rate for SW Generators?

    I am not sure of the brand of test kit I have. Something from Home Depot. I just got this though. I have been taking my water to the local pool shop every couple days to get things checked. No chlorine.

    I have not checked at the return but yesterday I did crack open the union right after the SWG a little so some water would drip out. I tested that with no to little chlorine.

    My water looks great. Clearer than ever since we got the DE filter. The walls, floor and corners look like ****. I just cant get the algae to stop growing on the surfaces.
    8,000 gallon Saltwater
    Hayward Pro Grid DE-4820
    Pentair WhisperFlo 2HP
    Auto Pilot Nano SWG

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    Re: Is there a max flow rate for SW Generators?

    So I just did a comparative test back to back. Regular in the pool water and one of the returns from the SWG. We have a small raised area to the pool that is easy to drain down to the jets.

    From what I can see from my test kit there is a slightly higher reading from the return.

    Regular water-maybe 1.0 mg if I am lucky. Hard to tell at the bottom of the scale.
    Return water-between 1.0 and 2.0 mg

    I have a bypass manifold that is part of the auto pilot SWG. Water is bypassing the SWG. I cant really tell how much water is actually passing the cell.

    Also I have a question and debate about cyanuric acid. One store I used to go to says my levels are below 30. The other two I have gone to say it is 90-100. They all use the same test kist. Blue Devil brand. A little stick and vile. Move stick down until the dot disappears. Read level on stick at water level. In my personal test it reads 100. The one store reads the stick at the top of the vile. Which is under 30.

    So which is right? And can too much stabilizer hide free chlorine? I have read that it can slow down the oxidation process of chlorine by a lot.
    8,000 gallon Saltwater
    Hayward Pro Grid DE-4820
    Pentair WhisperFlo 2HP
    Auto Pilot Nano SWG

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    pwrstrk's Avatar
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    Is there a max flow rate for SW Generators?

    To help you with question about CYA levels. The pool store testing of CYA levels is bad at best. You just saw for yourself two wildly different results. For a SWG your CYA level should be 70 - 80 ppm.
    I would recommend getting yourself one of our recommended test kits and stop relying on pool store testing. The pool store doesn't really have any reason to give you good accurate testing. They won't be able to sell you chem's. Do yourself a favor and get one of these kits. pool-school/pool_test_kit_comparison
    Jeff
    24'x54" AG Morada RTR (by wilbar) 13'500 gal. Hayward Powerflo Matrix 1hp 2 speed. Hayward Perflex EC65 DE filter.

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    Re: Is there a max flow rate for SW Generators?

    Quote Originally Posted by Michaelinpr
    My water looks great. Clearer than ever since we got the DE filter. The walls, floor and corners look like ****. I just cant get the algae to stop growing on the surfaces.
    Welcome to the forum!

    SWGs do a great job of preventing algae once you figure out the run times and % you need. However, they will not clear up existing algae by themselves. As long as the algae is there, it's going to consume all of the chlorine your SWG produces. You need to slam your pool: pool-school/shocking_your_pool

    To do this, you'll need to raise your chlorine levels higher than what your current test and the pool store test can accurately read. You'll need one of the recommended test kits: pool-school/pool_test_kit_comparison
    Outdoor 14,000 gallon IG plaster pool built in 2000 with spillover spa, 2 hp WhisperFlo pump with MagneTek motor, Sta-Rite cartridge pool filter with 300 ft2 filtration area and 0.33 gpm/ft2 filtration rate, Aquabot Rapids 4WD robotic pool cleaner, Raypak digital gas heater, and Intermatic mechanical timer located in the Dallas-Fort Worth metroplex

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    Mod Squad Bama Rambler's Avatar
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    Re: Is there a max flow rate for SW Generators?

    Autopilot swgs have a bypass, but it's more for pressure than actual flow. The bypass is set to 5 psi. However, that's not your problem.

    Since you know that you have algae, that's what is consuming the chlorine. As said above, you really need to know what your CYA level is in order to fight it effectively.

    Have you ever used any chlorine products that contain CYA?
    Do you know how much CYA has been added since the last fill?
    When was the last fill?
    Dave J. TFP Moderator
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    Re: Is there a max flow rate for SW Generators?

    I do not think I explained myself well. According to the instructions of my Cyanuric Acid test it is 90-100. It was just the one store that says the instructions are wrong. They are also the same store that continued to make me buy stabilizer. Within 2 months I had added 10 lbs. As I understand it I would only need 4-5 lbs to start my pool from scratch.

    I do not know when the last complete fill was. We just bought the house in June.

    I do not have that much algae. Only about 15 % of surfaces were affected and took about 45 min to get the pool clean. But I know the algae will be back in a few days.

    You say that the Algae is consuming the CH but I have extremely low levels right at the from the SWG or the return. Is that being eaten by the algae that may be in suspension in the water? I know the algae must be in suspension but my water has never been more clear.
    8,000 gallon Saltwater
    Hayward Pro Grid DE-4820
    Pentair WhisperFlo 2HP
    Auto Pilot Nano SWG

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    Mod Squad jblizzle's Avatar
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    Re: Is there a max flow rate for SW Generators?

    If you see algae, then you need to SLAM. That is why you can not get a FC reading. You should be using bleach to maintain FC and to SLAM, but need to verify the CYA level first. If it really is approaching 100, you should probably lower to around 70ppm, before SLAMing.
    Jason, TFP Moderator
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    Re: Is there a max flow rate for SW Generators?

    There are two things that consume chlorine. Organics in the water and sunlight. If you have visible algae you need to SLAM.
    You can also do an OCLT test to confirm if you have organics present in your water. pool-school/overnight_fc_test
    Jeff
    24'x54" AG Morada RTR (by wilbar) 13'500 gal. Hayward Powerflo Matrix 1hp 2 speed. Hayward Perflex EC65 DE filter.

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    Re: Is there a max flow rate for SW Generators?

    Welcome to tfp, Michaelinpr

    Quote Originally Posted by Michaelinpr
    I do not think I explained myself well. According to the instructions of my Cyanuric Acid test it is 90-100. It was just the one store that says the instructions are wrong. They are also the same store that continued to make me buy stabilizer. Within 2 months I had added 10 lbs. As I understand it I would only need 4-5 lbs to start my pool from scratch.
    If you have added that much granular stabilizer, you cya level will be closer to 150 ppm for your 8000 gallon pool. That is way too much and should be lowered by a partial drain/refill.

    Quote Originally Posted by Michaelinpr
    You say that the Algae is consuming the CH but I have extremely low levels right at the from the SWG or the return. Is that being eaten by the algae that may be in suspension in the water? I know the algae must be in suspension but my water has never been more clear.
    Basically it sounds like your swg is not keeping up with the demand the algae is creating.
    TFP Expert who uses Pool School and my TF100 test kit along with PoolMath for my: Round 11K gallon AGP with deep end, 20" sand filter, Matrix 1hp 2spd, 6 2ftX20ft solar panels (and solar cover!), Intex SWCG (copper bars disconnected) and a Rubadub hot tub (chlorine). The SLAM process is not finished until: 1. CC < 0.5 ppm, 2. An OCLT < 1.0 ppm and, 3. The water is crystal clear.

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    Re: Is there a max flow rate for SW Generators?

    I think through overflow due to the rainy season here and subsequently draining down to normal level is how I do not have a stabilizer level of 150. Regardless I will try to get it down to normal levels.

    You say that it seems my swg seems it can't keep up with algae. There is hardly any algae. I will take a pic tomorrow which will be three days since I cleaned the pool.

    What I do not understand is I tested the water right at the return without mixing any of the pool water and the CH is still really low. If not barely readable. Shouldn't there be more CH right after the swg regardless of algae consumption?
    8,000 gallon Saltwater
    Hayward Pro Grid DE-4820
    Pentair WhisperFlo 2HP
    Auto Pilot Nano SWG

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    Re: Is there a max flow rate for SW Generators?

    If you have any amount of algae you need to SLAM the pool.
    Jeff
    24'x54" AG Morada RTR (by wilbar) 13'500 gal. Hayward Powerflo Matrix 1hp 2 speed. Hayward Perflex EC65 DE filter.

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    Mod Squad jblizzle's Avatar
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    Re: Is there a max flow rate for SW Generators?

    First, CH is calcium harness not chlorine.
    Second, read this thread again, you need to SLAM the pool!
    Jason, TFP Moderator
    18k IG pebblesheen pool, Hayward ProLogic P4 w/ T-15 SWG, Pentair 1HP 2-speed Superflo, Hayward 6020 DE filter
    500 sqft Heliocol solar panels, ThePoolCleaner, TF-100 test kit w/ SpeedStir
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    Re: Is there a max flow rate for SW Generators?

    It is possible to have algae in the pool that is high enough to consume all of your FC (especially with an SWG since they are designed to keep a lower but constant level of FC), yet that algae can be below the threshold of being visible.

    I agree with the others....you have algae in the pool, you just can't see it. The FC consumption is proof. Time to SLAM.
    33' round, 23,000 gal AG vinyl , 1HP 2spd PowerFlo Matrix downsized with 3/4HP impeller (X2), Hayward S180T 150# sand filter (X2), Hayward H250 NG heater Pool Store year 1 - $850 for 2 months; Pool Store year 2 - $440 for 2 months, TFPC year 1 - $170 for 4 months; TFPC year 2 - $95 for 4.5 months
    The most important article on this site - The ABCs of Pool Water Chemistry

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    Mod Squad Bama Rambler's Avatar
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    Re: Is there a max flow rate for SW Generators?

    Even in normal situations when there is no algae the FC ppm out of the swg cell is only 1 or 2 ppm higher than the bulk pool water.

    In your situation where there is algae getting pumped through the cell it uses up a decent portion of the FC as soon as it's generated, so it's not unusual not to see much of a rise, if any, in FC out of the cell when there's algae present.
    Dave J. TFP Moderator
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    Re: Is there a max flow rate for SW Generators?

    Just an update guys.

    I prepared myself to start the SLAM process and did the first dose of Chlorine. I got pulled away for work and have done nothing different for a week.

    I also dropped my Cyanuric acid level a little more. It didnt need much as the rain did it for me. it is now 60-70.

    Chlorine measured about 3 mg/l the next morning after I dosed the pool. It is a week later and the level is the same. I even backed off the cell to 50% from 100%.

    The pool is amazing. Back to what it was when I first started. Almost no brushing the walls and very little vacuuming each cleaning.

    Lets see how this goes. I am thinking to just leave this as is and see if the chlorine level maintains itself with the SWG. I know you guys are going to say continue the SLAM. Maybe I should take a pic. The pool is perfect now. Maybe I over exaggerated the problem in the first place.
    8,000 gallon Saltwater
    Hayward Pro Grid DE-4820
    Pentair WhisperFlo 2HP
    Auto Pilot Nano SWG

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    Is there a max flow rate for SW Generators?

    These are the three tests you must pass to stop the SLAM process.
    1 water is crystal clear.
    2 you have CC of 0.5 or less.
    3 you can pass the OCLT.
    If you fail any one of these you have something going on with your water. Do you have a test kit to test for CC. ?
    Also if you have to SLAM you should turn your SWG off.
    Jeff
    24'x54" AG Morada RTR (by wilbar) 13'500 gal. Hayward Powerflo Matrix 1hp 2 speed. Hayward Perflex EC65 DE filter.

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    Re: Is there a max flow rate for SW Generators?

    Quote Originally Posted by pwrstrk
    These are the three tests you must pass to stop the SLAM process.
    1 water is crystal clear.
    2 you have CC of 0.5 or less.
    3 you can pass the OCLT.
    If you fail any one of these you have something going on with your water. Do you have a test kit to test for CC. ?
    Also if you have to SLAM you should turn your SWG off.
    Water is amazingly clear.

    CC I am a little confused on. I am getting FC readings up to 3.0mg. Wouldnt my CC chlorine be that or higher? My test kit may be a little basic. You test for FC which is almost instant. For CC or Total Chlorine as it says, you just leave the same test for 3 minutes and read again.

    Over the week I tested the Chlorine and have not seen a drop at any moment. I was testing at about 6 AM, 3 PM, and 9-10 PM. Always close to 3 mg.
    8,000 gallon Saltwater
    Hayward Pro Grid DE-4820
    Pentair WhisperFlo 2HP
    Auto Pilot Nano SWG

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