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Thread: Pool Fill - Is this an autofill?

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    Pool Fill - Is this an autofill?

    Hi all,

    Thanks for reading this. I'm still pretty new to pools. I found that my pool has a fill line attached to it. It has this 007M3 https://backflowpartsusa.com/shop/backf ... ?product=7 connector which flows through to a valve that runs into my secondary pump. This pump then runs two things: a waterfall overflow from the spa and a caretaker leaftrapper with ~90% of the water volume going to the leaf trapper. I'm attaching photos of the 007M3 and where it runs into my pump.

    I don't believe this is an autofill for the pool so I have a couple of questions as I'd love to have an autofill.

    1) Is this an autofill?
    2) If not, how does it work? If I open the valves on the 007M3 will it just dump water endlessly into the pool?
    3) If not an autofill, what would I need to do to make it one? And more or less how much does it cost?

    Right now, I've been just running a hose to the pool that is on a timer but I'd love to not have this responsibility.

    Thanks again!
    Jeremy
    Attached Images Attached Images
    A.O.Smith Pump 2HP, Pentair FNS Plus DE Filter 60 (for 60 sqft), Jandy Caretaker 5 port, MiniMax 400 pool heater, Rainbow chlorinator, Aqualink
    Secondary pump for leaf trapper/fountain 1 HP on Hayward Cartridge Filter model C12002
    Polaris 2 peak HP blower for spa
    20,000 gallon pool

  2. Back To Top    #2
    Mod Squad Bama Rambler's Avatar
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    Re: Pool Fill - Is this an autofill?

    It could be, but we need to see the complete picture. You can't make a connection between the pictures to tell if it's truly an autofill or not. I suspect that it's not, but you may be able to add that functionality to it with a level switch and a sprinkler valve.
    Dave J. TFP Moderator
    24' x 52" Round AGP. 2hp/¼hp SPL Power-Flo 2-speed pump. 200sqft Waterway Cartridge Filter. 45MHP2(3GPD) Stenner Peristaltic Pump
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    Re: Pool Fill - Is this an autofill?

    OK, so here's what happens between the two pictures. The first picture shows that backflow valve from my freshwater intake. That runs down that foam on the right in a pipe. From there it runs around a couple of corners in PVC and pops out connected to the red valve in the second photo. Is that enough information? I don't think the photos add value but I'd happily take them if you think it helps. Thanks for the speedy reply.

    I think it isn't an autofill either. Assuming it's not how hard is it to add the level switch and sprinkler valve?
    A.O.Smith Pump 2HP, Pentair FNS Plus DE Filter 60 (for 60 sqft), Jandy Caretaker 5 port, MiniMax 400 pool heater, Rainbow chlorinator, Aqualink
    Secondary pump for leaf trapper/fountain 1 HP on Hayward Cartridge Filter model C12002
    Polaris 2 peak HP blower for spa
    20,000 gallon pool

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    Mod Squad Bama Rambler's Avatar
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    Re: Pool Fill - Is this an autofill?

    The hardest part is routing the wiring from the switch to the equipment pad. The rest is easy.
    Dave J. TFP Moderator
    24' x 52" Round AGP. 2hp/¼hp SPL Power-Flo 2-speed pump. 200sqft Waterway Cartridge Filter. 45MHP2(3GPD) Stenner Peristaltic Pump
    Pool School ----- Pool Math ----- TF-Test Kit

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    Re: Pool Fill - Is this an autofill?

    So is there a way I can know for sure that this isn't a autofill? Are there any instructions or tutorials on how to make something like this an autofill? What type of products would I need to buy?

    How much do you think it would cost if I just call up the pool company that repairs things every now and then on the pool vs figuring this out myself?
    A.O.Smith Pump 2HP, Pentair FNS Plus DE Filter 60 (for 60 sqft), Jandy Caretaker 5 port, MiniMax 400 pool heater, Rainbow chlorinator, Aqualink
    Secondary pump for leaf trapper/fountain 1 HP on Hayward Cartridge Filter model C12002
    Polaris 2 peak HP blower for spa
    20,000 gallon pool

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    Mod Squad Bama Rambler's Avatar
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    Re: Pool Fill - Is this an autofill?

    Are there any connections between it and the pool anywhere (except the water line at the pump)? if not then it can't be an autofill.
    Dave J. TFP Moderator
    24' x 52" Round AGP. 2hp/¼hp SPL Power-Flo 2-speed pump. 200sqft Waterway Cartridge Filter. 45MHP2(3GPD) Stenner Peristaltic Pump
    Pool School ----- Pool Math ----- TF-Test Kit

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    Re: Pool Fill - Is this an autofill?

    Here's the flow of it.

    Freshwater > Backflow valve 007M3 > PVC pipe that bends around corners > connector (seen in photo before the red valve) > Red Valve > This then connects between the pump and filter (this merges with the water coming from the pump -- which comes from the main drain on the pool)

    Make sense? Thanks again for help on this. It's nice to have communities where you can learn about this stuff.
    A.O.Smith Pump 2HP, Pentair FNS Plus DE Filter 60 (for 60 sqft), Jandy Caretaker 5 port, MiniMax 400 pool heater, Rainbow chlorinator, Aqualink
    Secondary pump for leaf trapper/fountain 1 HP on Hayward Cartridge Filter model C12002
    Polaris 2 peak HP blower for spa
    20,000 gallon pool

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    Mod Squad jblizzle's Avatar
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    Re: Pool Fill - Is this an autofill?

    A typical auto-fill is in the ground near the pool with a float valve that turns the water on and off (basically it is like a toilet tank valve). The bucket that the float valve is in is connected by a water pipe to the pool ... so as the bucket is filled the water flows into the pool to maintain the same water level.

    I am not sure what you have.

    It sounds like you want some sensor to determine the water level which then would electronically open/close a valve to add water to the pool (like the sprinkler valve you mentioned). I am not sure what sensors are available to do this.

    FYI, it cost me $600 to add a "normal" auto fill to my pool when I was redoing the plaster. Required drilling a hole through the pool wall and adding the bucket and float valve and a shut-off/backflow prevention valve ... luckily I had an accessible source of fresh water already there.
    Jason, TFP Moderator
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    Mod Squad jblizzle's Avatar
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    Re: Pool Fill - Is this an autofill?

    BTW, you could pretty easily add a valve on your water supply that is on a timer to turn on for a certain period of time each day, but that is not a true auto-fill.

    Also, I would think you should only open that red valve when that pump is OFF. And then the fresh water is likely flowing backward through the pump and into the pool.
    Jason, TFP Moderator
    18k IG pebblesheen pool, Hayward ProLogic P4 w/ T-15 SWG, Pentair 1HP 2-speed Superflo, Hayward 6020 DE filter
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  10. Back To Top    #10

    Re: Pool Fill - Is this an autofill?

    OK interesting. It looks like the auto-fill isn't a simple solution. As for the sprinkler valve. Where and how would I put that into the system? I'd love a solution that involves not cutting into pvc/piping. I noticed that my backflow valve has some sort of connectors on the top of it. Is it possible to use something like that?

    Also, why would you want to make sure the pump is off? Would it really matter which way it flows?
    A.O.Smith Pump 2HP, Pentair FNS Plus DE Filter 60 (for 60 sqft), Jandy Caretaker 5 port, MiniMax 400 pool heater, Rainbow chlorinator, Aqualink
    Secondary pump for leaf trapper/fountain 1 HP on Hayward Cartridge Filter model C12002
    Polaris 2 peak HP blower for spa
    20,000 gallon pool

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    Mod Squad jblizzle's Avatar
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    Re: Pool Fill - Is this an autofill?

    If the pump is on and it has higher pressure than you house water, then you would end up pushing pool water up toward the house (although the backflow preventer should stop the water from getting into your freshwater supply).

    There are auto-fill devices that you set on the deck that hang into the pool that you hook a hose to ... simple to hook up and use, but you have to look at it sitting there.
    Jason, TFP Moderator
    18k IG pebblesheen pool, Hayward ProLogic P4 w/ T-15 SWG, Pentair 1HP 2-speed Superflo, Hayward 6020 DE filter
    500 sqft Heliocol solar panels, ThePoolCleaner, TF-100 test kit w/ SpeedStir
    Pool School + Test Kit + PoolMath = A TROUBLE FREE POOL
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  12. Back To Top    #12

    Re: Pool Fill - Is this an autofill?

    Yeah I don't want to ugly up my pool area. What would it take to just add the sprinkler timer valve? Are there any ways to add it without cutting into pipes -- like those fittings on the backflow valve?
    A.O.Smith Pump 2HP, Pentair FNS Plus DE Filter 60 (for 60 sqft), Jandy Caretaker 5 port, MiniMax 400 pool heater, Rainbow chlorinator, Aqualink
    Secondary pump for leaf trapper/fountain 1 HP on Hayward Cartridge Filter model C12002
    Polaris 2 peak HP blower for spa
    20,000 gallon pool

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    Mod Squad jblizzle's Avatar
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    Re: Pool Fill - Is this an autofill?

    I think anything you try to add is going to require plumbing work.

    I do not know what the fittings on that type of backflow valve (they call it a "double check valve") are for, but pretty sure they are not for adding any valves.

    You would have to cut somewhere between it and the pump and add an automatic valve (likely instead of the red ball valve) and then have some method of turning it on and off (like a sprinkler controller).
    Jason, TFP Moderator
    18k IG pebblesheen pool, Hayward ProLogic P4 w/ T-15 SWG, Pentair 1HP 2-speed Superflo, Hayward 6020 DE filter
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  14. Back To Top    #14

    Re: Pool Fill - Is this an autofill?

    If I were to add a mechanical water timer like this http://www.homedepot.com/p/Melnor-Mecha ... /100659515 how would I go about that?

    I know I need to cut into the pvc piping now. What fittings or ends would I put on. Then how could I connect it to a timer like this?

    If I do this do you think I can run it with the pump on and off?
    A.O.Smith Pump 2HP, Pentair FNS Plus DE Filter 60 (for 60 sqft), Jandy Caretaker 5 port, MiniMax 400 pool heater, Rainbow chlorinator, Aqualink
    Secondary pump for leaf trapper/fountain 1 HP on Hayward Cartridge Filter model C12002
    Polaris 2 peak HP blower for spa
    20,000 gallon pool

  15. Back To Top    #15
    Mod Squad jblizzle's Avatar
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    Re: Pool Fill - Is this an autofill?

    That is designed to just screw onto a hose bib and then connect a hose to it. You would just have to use PVC fittings with the same 3/4" (I think) threads. I don't think any option the way it is plumbed in is going to work with the pump on.

    Instead of buying a timer like you linked to which you are going to have to manually turn on anyway. Why not manually turn on the red valve and set a timer on your phone or in the house to remind you to turn it off?
    Jason, TFP Moderator
    18k IG pebblesheen pool, Hayward ProLogic P4 w/ T-15 SWG, Pentair 1HP 2-speed Superflo, Hayward 6020 DE filter
    500 sqft Heliocol solar panels, ThePoolCleaner, TF-100 test kit w/ SpeedStir
    Pool School + Test Kit + PoolMath = A TROUBLE FREE POOL
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  16. Back To Top    #16

    Re: Pool Fill - Is this an autofill?

    I have an aqualink system. Couldn't I just get one of their valve actuators and replace that red valve with that? Then get it wired up to the aqualink and have a button to press on the system inside?

    Is that difficult to do?

    I like not having to worry about turning things off so that's why I like the timer.
    A.O.Smith Pump 2HP, Pentair FNS Plus DE Filter 60 (for 60 sqft), Jandy Caretaker 5 port, MiniMax 400 pool heater, Rainbow chlorinator, Aqualink
    Secondary pump for leaf trapper/fountain 1 HP on Hayward Cartridge Filter model C12002
    Polaris 2 peak HP blower for spa
    20,000 gallon pool

  17. Back To Top    #17
    Mod Squad jblizzle's Avatar
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    Re: Pool Fill - Is this an autofill?

    That should work. You would either need to install a true pool valve and then mount an actuator on it. And then likely set a countdown timer in the Aqualink so you push a button and it turns on and turns itself off later. Or have it on for a set period everyday.

    Alternatively, I wonder if it could be wired to control a sprinkler solenoid valve to turn the water on / off. That would be cheaper (valve is $15, while the pool valve and actuator will be around $150).

    I do not know the capabilities of that automation system, so will defer to others.
    Jason, TFP Moderator
    18k IG pebblesheen pool, Hayward ProLogic P4 w/ T-15 SWG, Pentair 1HP 2-speed Superflo, Hayward 6020 DE filter
    500 sqft Heliocol solar panels, ThePoolCleaner, TF-100 test kit w/ SpeedStir
    Pool School + Test Kit + PoolMath = A TROUBLE FREE POOL
    If you found TFP helpful and we saved you money ... Become a TFP Supporter!

  18. Back To Top    #18

    Re: Pool Fill - Is this an autofill?

    I think I'm going to take the simple route and just cut into the pvc line put some ends on it and put a timer valve and leave the rest. That way I can just walk out there and set it and it will fill. Thanks for the help.
    A.O.Smith Pump 2HP, Pentair FNS Plus DE Filter 60 (for 60 sqft), Jandy Caretaker 5 port, MiniMax 400 pool heater, Rainbow chlorinator, Aqualink
    Secondary pump for leaf trapper/fountain 1 HP on Hayward Cartridge Filter model C12002
    Polaris 2 peak HP blower for spa
    20,000 gallon pool

  19. Back To Top    #19

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    Re: Pool Fill - Is this an autofill?

    Whats going to make it stop filling?Just the timer itself?So your going to fill for XX:XX amount of time.Interesting solution

    BTW the fittings on the top of your Watts 007M3 are called pet cocks(they are just small valves) they are used to test the backflow device annually.
    Rob

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