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Thread: Shouldn't it be called BBBAA?

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    zimm's Avatar
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    Shouldn't it be called BBBAA?

    My closet is stocked with Bleach, Borax, Baking Soda, and CYA. Today is the first time my Ph was high (8.0). Pool calcuator says to add Muriatic Acid. I need to run to the pool store for that- my home depot only has the watered down "safe" stuff. Why not call it Bleach, Borax, Baking Soda, Acid, Acid?

    Or BBBCM: Bleach, Borax, Baking Soda, Cyanuric Acid, Muriatic Acid

    Slow day at work....
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    Mod Squad jblizzle's Avatar
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    Re: Shouldn't it be called BBBAA?

    Why stock up on items that you may never need? I have never needed borax or baking soda.

    It is an old term that stuck and often ends up causing confusion.
    Jason, TFP Moderator
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    Re: Shouldn't it be called BBBAA?

    Quote Originally Posted by jblizzle
    Why stock up on items that you may never need? I have never needed borax or baking soda.

    It is an old term that stuck and often ends up causing confusion.

    First thing i did when i decided to do this was to buy bleach, borax and baking soda...... i still have all of the borax and baking soda
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    Re: Shouldn't it be called BBBAA?

    The borax works in the wash also and there's alot of uses for baking soda around the house.

    Not all pools are the same
    Jeff
    24'x54" AG Morada RTR (by wilbar) 13'500 gal. Hayward Powerflo Matrix 1hp 2 speed. Hayward Perflex EC65 DE filter.

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    zimm's Avatar
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    Re: Shouldn't it be called BBBAA?

    I needed borax early in the season and the baking soda was at costco.
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    Re: Shouldn't it be called BBBAA?

    A lot of times Home Depot will put the full strength acid in the paint section and the weak stuff in the pool section. I get acid at my LPS because it is cheaper there than at HD or Lowes.
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    Re: Shouldn't it be called BBBAA?

    Re: Shouldn't it be called BBBAA? Nah, the founders of this wonderfully named methodology used BBB for a reason; I believe they wanted something that was easy to remember and easy to convey to new recruits. My regiment could be called 'BA' for Bleach and MA 'cause that's about all I ever need to use according to my TFtest kit but if you want to call Your program BBBAA then by all means do it, but realize that when I'm explaining this website, and it's methods to a new person that has never heard of this way of taking care of a pool, BBB makes the theory easy to explain, is easy to remember and, best of all, elicits smiles when you tell someone that basic and relatively low cost Sundries can be used to keep their pool sparkling clean. When I started BBB I bought everything not knowing that I was never going to need Borax in my pool, upon reading the back of that box I learned 1/4 cup dropped into the bottom of each dishwasher load will, and has, really helped in making my dishes come out super clean with very little spotting! I took it as another benefit of the BBB program
    *Our water is 8.0 at the tap.
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    Re: Shouldn't it be called BBBAA?

    This topic comes up periodically in the secret moderator/expert room. There has been talk of renaming it, simply because too many people, like yourself, assume that borax is the miracle pill and that it's required, when it's not. It's a cheap way to raise pH and avoid the alluring snake oil displays at the pool store.

    A while back someone suggested TADA test accurately dose accurately. My contribution was WINO What It Needs Only.

    My pool has gone several years now without a hint of green and without once having to SLAM and it's been fed nothing but sodium hypochlorite (bleach), Muriatic Acid, and Trichlor pucks when I'm out of town. Nothing else. No flocs, shocks, clarifiers, pH up, baking soda, borax, alum, enzymes, nothing. And you can stand on the deck and look through eight feet of water and tell that the screws holding the drain cover on are Phillips head. Just test the water and add only what it needs and that's it. Troublefree.
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    Shouldn't it be called BBBAA?

    My fill water's PH was 7.2 and the TA was 70. So I figured when I add the stabilizer it was going to drop my PH out of range. I added a little borax to raise the PH so the stabilizer wouldn't drop it out of range. Worked out good. Raised the TA a little also.

    The rest of the borax went in the wash and only set me back 4 dollars and some change. Only thing else I add since then is bleach.
    Jeff
    24'x54" AG Morada RTR (by wilbar) 13'500 gal. Hayward Powerflo Matrix 1hp 2 speed. Hayward Perflex EC65 DE filter.

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    Re: Shouldn't it be called BBBAA?

    I think it is so simple of a fix to rename BBB. Replace BBB with TFP.

    This section of the forum would be labeled, The TFP Method.
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    Re: Shouldn't it be called BBBAA?

    I agree..I NEVER need Borax or Baking Soda...the three things I use during the summer from opening to closing is: Bleach, Muriatic Acid, CYA....so MY "BBB" is really just "BCM"

    Dan
    33' x 52" Swim and Play Inc. PARAGON AGP. Hayward H200 Heater. Hayward Power-Flo LX 1.5hp pump. Sta-Rite Cristal Flo T-210WF Sand Filter. Stenner 45M5 chlorine pump

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    Re: Shouldn't it be called BBBAA?

    I vote for BAB.

    All I've needed this year is Bleach and Adult Beverages to keep my pool humming along.
    33' round, 23,000 gal AG vinyl , 1HP 2spd PowerFlo Matrix downsized with 3/4HP impeller (X2), Hayward S180T 150# sand filter (X2), Hayward H250 NG heater Pool Store year 1 - $850 for 2 months; Pool Store year 2 - $440 for 2 months, TFPC year 1 - $170 for 4 months; TFPC year 2 - $95 for 4.5 months
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    Re: Shouldn't it be called BBBAA?

    LOL...that's good Smykowsi!! I like it...yeah I could add that "AB" to my version too!
    33' x 52" Swim and Play Inc. PARAGON AGP. Hayward H200 Heater. Hayward Power-Flo LX 1.5hp pump. Sta-Rite Cristal Flo T-210WF Sand Filter. Stenner 45M5 chlorine pump

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    Re: Shouldn't it be called BBBAA?

    How do you all get away with never adding baking soda? Doesn't TA get consumed? I've always found that it needs occasional replenishment.
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    Mod Squad jblizzle's Avatar
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    Re: Shouldn't it be called BBBAA?

    Quote Originally Posted by BobbyR
    How do you all get away with never adding baking soda? Doesn't TA get consumed? I've always found that it needs occasional replenishment.
    Not usually. TA only goes down if you are adding acid and lowering pH as well. This will happen if you use pucks or Dichlor, but most members using bleach or a SWG do not see TA dropping.
    Jason, TFP Moderator
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    Re: Shouldn't it be called BBBAA?

    Quote Originally Posted by BobbyR
    How do you all get away with never adding baking soda? Doesn't TA get consumed? I've always found that it needs occasional replenishment.
    If you are using only hypochlorite sources of chlorine (bleach, chlorinating liquid, Cal-Hypo, lithium hypochlorite), then there is no loss of TA and instead it will rise some from these products but also from evaporation and refill. It will only go down from dilution with water lower in TA or from addition of acid (along with carbon dioxide outgassing that restores the pH).

    You have had a bromine pool so cannot compare that to other pools. The use of bromine tabs is net acidic and the use of Trichlor you have most recently been using is also net acidic. This lowers the TA over time.
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    Re: Shouldn't it be called BBBAA?

    I use bleach daily, borax once every week or two, and baking soda (and CYA) once at the beginning of the season when I fill my pool. That's it. No other acid, no other chemical goes in my pool. Sparkling clear water all summer.
    Jim
    Intex 15' x 42" -- 4,000 gallons
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    Richard320's Avatar
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    Re: Shouldn't it be called BBBAA?

    Quote Originally Posted by BobbyR
    How do you all get away with never adding baking soda? Doesn't TA get consumed? I've always found that it needs occasional replenishment.
    High TA in the fill water replenishes it.
    16K freeform gunite with spa; Pentair 4000 DE filter; Century Whisperflow 1 HP; Pentair Minimax heater.
    Troublefree does not mean Maintenancefree. It's like brushing your teeth: You can spend a couple minutes a day and pennies a week or go to the dentist once a year and spend several thousand dollars.
    A pool is like a pet - you have to feed it every day, even the days you don't want to play with it!

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    Re: Shouldn't it be called BBBAA?

    Take that excess Baking Soda, heat it to convert it from sodium bicarbonate to sodium carbonate (washing soda / soda ash). Go buy some Fel's Naptha bar soap and grate it. Add the sodium carbonate and borax in proper proportions and you've got a low sudsing great cleaning home-made laundry soap for pennies per load. Recipes are all over the net, but here's the one I use...

    Ingredients:

    2/3 bar Fels Naptha Laundry Soap (equivalent of 1 cup grated)
    Cup 20 Mule Team Borax
    Cup Arm & Hammer Super Washing Soda.
    Container large enough to hold 2 cups of laundry detergent

    Directions:

    Grate the Fels Naptha laundry soap with a grater or use a food processor. Approximately 2/3 of a bar of soap will make 1 cup of grated soap.
    Add the cup of Borax and cup of washing soda to the grated soap.
    Shake and/or mix well

    Use:

    One tablespoon of detergent is sufficient per load of wash. If you have a high-efficiency machine, you might want to experiment with using a little less detergent for normal loads. If your clothes come out feeling stiff, lower the amount of detergent. For clothes that are heavily soiled, add a teaspoon more of the detergent..

    Yield:

    The recipe yields 2 cups of laundry detergent. If you use 1 tablespoon per load, you will be able to wash 32 loads of clothes.
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    Re: Shouldn't it be called BBBAA?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jeetyet
    Take that excess Baking Soda, heat it to convert it from sodium bicarbonate to sodium carbonate (washing soda / soda ash). Go buy some Fel's Naptha bar soap and grate it. Add the sodium carbonate and borax in proper proportions and you've got a low sudsing great cleaning home-made laundry soap for pennies per load. Recipes are all over the net, but here's the one I use...
    This may be a silly question... but on a front load washer... do you add that directly to the load instead of through the hopper? And, since it is low water... do you use less per load?
    NEW POOL: 11k IGP, Pebbletec, Hayward Pro-Grid 3620 D.E. Filter, 1HP Pentair?/Emerson
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