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Thread: Possible to use TF-100 To test Water Softener ?

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    Possible to use TF-100 To test Water Softener ?

    He folks, I just put in a water softener, I am supposed to select a number to set it for the softness and I have no idea what to set it to. I picked 15 off top of my head. Any way for me to use something in the kit that can help me get it set where it needs to be? I am unsure if there is some magic number, or do I just forget about it and use 15.

    thnx
    Pool 16 x 33.5 Foxx Pool with rounded corners 3.5 at each end and 5+ in the middle (16000 GAL)

    Equipment - 300 LB Hayward filter with a Pentair SuperFlo pump (3/4 HP). Also Hayward H series Heater and a dedicated jet for a Polaris 280 with a booster pump (3/4HP). Hayward Chlorinator CL200.

    Pool has Main Drain, 2 return Jets with 1 inch eyeballs, a skimmer with floating weir, and the dedicated Polaris jet. Also has a valve for the Waterslide.

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    Charlie_R's Avatar
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    Re: Possible to use TF-100 To test Water Softener ?

    Did you install it to reduce hardness? Or are there other factors involved?

    You can test your TA and CH pre- softener, and again post softener, then compare the results. The settings then become a matter of personal preference as to how far you are wanting to go with the removal of minerals etc.
    15'x48" 4500 gallon Intex pool, buried 1.5 ft. Pac-Fab Dynamo 3/4 hp pump. Hayward S180T sand filter, bought used. Taylor K-2006 test kit. Rocket mass heater based wood fired pool heater.

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    Re: Possible to use TF-100 To test Water Softener ?

    House had a softener installed when built (or previous owner) it wasn't working so I decided to fix it is all... I have never used one. I know the whole house is on it... Minus my yard that gets water from street source (sprinkler system). I can still get hard water from a tap in the yard and chk it and comp it to House water.
    Pool 16 x 33.5 Foxx Pool with rounded corners 3.5 at each end and 5+ in the middle (16000 GAL)

    Equipment - 300 LB Hayward filter with a Pentair SuperFlo pump (3/4 HP). Also Hayward H series Heater and a dedicated jet for a Polaris 280 with a booster pump (3/4HP). Hayward Chlorinator CL200.

    Pool has Main Drain, 2 return Jets with 1 inch eyeballs, a skimmer with floating weir, and the dedicated Polaris jet. Also has a valve for the Waterslide.

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    Re: Possible to use TF-100 To test Water Softener ?

    You absolutely can and should use it periodically to check your softener performance. A total hardness test is best, but the CH will work fine. Be informed when speaking to softener service companies, they speak in grains, NOT the PPM results we get with our TF100 test.

    So you know: 17.1 PPM = 1.0 Grn hardness.

    I don't know your source hardness but most home softeners are set up to get the TOTAL hardness down to 3.0 Grn or LESS. So, you really should see less than 50 PPM when you run a CH with your TF 100. If not, it could be for several reasons, so post back when you get a result and I will be happy to help you figure out what is going on.
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    Re: Possible to use TF-100 To test Water Softener ?

    To test Total Hardness, just get the Taylor K-0854 reagent and then use that in place of the R-0010 Calcium Buffer and R-0011L Calcium Indicator dye. You still use the R-0012 Hardness Reagent to titrate and the scale is the same (1 drop = 10 ppm for a 25 ml sample size; 1 drop = 25 ppm for a 10 ml sample size).
    16,000 gallon outdoor in-ground 16'x32' plaster pool; Pentair Intelliflo VF pump; Pentair IntelliTouch i9+3s control system; Jandy CL-340 square foot cartridge filter
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    Re: Possible to use TF-100 To test Water Softener ?

    Easier to just buy the Hach 5b water hardness drop test kit. It tests in grains of salt and can be ordered from Hack for $30.00. At the very least, go to your water companies website. They are required to publish their water reports on yearly basis and most will have the report on the site.
    Pool done!! (backyard = work in progress) 32' x 19' inground freeform with 7' spa, baja step w/ (2) bubblers, stonescapes mini pebble finish, rock waterfall feature, 12" raised bond beam, Intelliflo VS, Whisperflo feature pump, (3) 5G Color LED's, FNS + DE 60, 400K Master Temp, Easytouch 8 w/ remote, Intellichlor IC40, Vision Classic Ceramic Kamado smoker, Margaritaville DM1000!!! Party Coming Soon!!
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    Re: Possible to use TF-100 To test Water Softener ?

    How can it be easier to buy another kit when they already have the TF100 kit on hand to run a CH test with?

    Not only that, but HACH is likely way more expensive than Taylor. I don't know that for sure, but I would imagine they are.
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    Re: Possible to use TF-100 To test Water Softener ?

    Thanks for the help... I will give this a shot...

    I got 25ML of tap water and added 20 drops of R0010, then I added 5 drops of R0011 that gave me blue water. The next step was to add R0012 till it turned blue... but its already blue so I stopped... any idea? If I don't figure it out I can order the other kit... was just hoping to get this to work as is.

    Mike
    Pool 16 x 33.5 Foxx Pool with rounded corners 3.5 at each end and 5+ in the middle (16000 GAL)

    Equipment - 300 LB Hayward filter with a Pentair SuperFlo pump (3/4 HP). Also Hayward H series Heater and a dedicated jet for a Polaris 280 with a booster pump (3/4HP). Hayward Chlorinator CL200.

    Pool has Main Drain, 2 return Jets with 1 inch eyeballs, a skimmer with floating weir, and the dedicated Polaris jet. Also has a valve for the Waterslide.

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    Re: Possible to use TF-100 To test Water Softener ?

    That my friend means you are soft already. If there is calcium it will turn pink.
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    Re: Possible to use TF-100 To test Water Softener ?

    ah OK great... now let me ask you this... how do I know if its too soft? I am guessing there is some sort of scale like: very hard, hard, ideal, soft, very soft... and so on... wondering if I can figure that out? Or is it as simple as turning the water softer down till I get pink and then bump it up one number till I get blue agn? And does it matter when I test it... guessing first thing in the morning and then agn at night (to make sure it makes it through a day without running out).

    thanks for helping me!!!
    Pool 16 x 33.5 Foxx Pool with rounded corners 3.5 at each end and 5+ in the middle (16000 GAL)

    Equipment - 300 LB Hayward filter with a Pentair SuperFlo pump (3/4 HP). Also Hayward H series Heater and a dedicated jet for a Polaris 280 with a booster pump (3/4HP). Hayward Chlorinator CL200.

    Pool has Main Drain, 2 return Jets with 1 inch eyeballs, a skimmer with floating weir, and the dedicated Polaris jet. Also has a valve for the Waterslide.

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    Re: Possible to use TF-100 To test Water Softener ?

    Quote Originally Posted by myrddin
    ah OK great... now let me ask you this... how do I know if its too soft? I am guessing there is some sort of scale like: very hard, hard, ideal, soft, very soft... and so on... wondering if I can figure that out? Or is it as simple as turning the water softer down till I get pink and then bump it up one number till I get blue agn? And does it matter when I test it... guessing first thing in the morning and then agn at night (to make sure it makes it through a day without running out).

    thanks for helping me!!!
    You're welcome!

    No such thing as too soft. Your water will be soft like that or just a touch harder until the unit is exhausted if it is performing and set up properly. Right now is is working flawlessly. To know how many gallons it will treat more info is needed. A manual perhaps, or was this put in by a company? Either way, someone set it up based on hardness of you water and square feet of it's resin capacity. How much will be treated is based on number of occupants living in the home. They usually figure it at 70-100 gallons of water per person/per day of usage. We have to get more info to know what yours is doing in those terms. I would not re-test for another two-three days and then see. You will run out of reagent rather quickly, so you ought to get more ordered if you intend to keep checking this. Specifically R-0010 and R-0012, but get a bigger bottle of the R-0010 since it needs 20 drops. Ask Dave and he will help you out on that. See what info you can find on the softener and let us know.
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    Re: Possible to use TF-100 To test Water Softener ?

    The water softer is a GE GXSH40V. A company did put it in but they did not set it up. I know my old one was set to 19 but it didn't work at all so cant say it was set right. The past home owner said he thought it was set to high when I bought the house... so I thought I would set it to 15... that is where its at right now. and it regenerated every night at 2am. All I see is a setting for the salt level (its full so its on 7.5 (might have been 8.5). then it has a clock, and a setting for hardness - set to 15. and recharge... looks like it will also tell me average daily gallons, after 7 days pass. and it will show the flow rate, gpm.

    I can feel the change in the water... I just didn't know if I should reduce the hardness more of not.
    Pool 16 x 33.5 Foxx Pool with rounded corners 3.5 at each end and 5+ in the middle (16000 GAL)

    Equipment - 300 LB Hayward filter with a Pentair SuperFlo pump (3/4 HP). Also Hayward H series Heater and a dedicated jet for a Polaris 280 with a booster pump (3/4HP). Hayward Chlorinator CL200.

    Pool has Main Drain, 2 return Jets with 1 inch eyeballs, a skimmer with floating weir, and the dedicated Polaris jet. Also has a valve for the Waterslide.

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    Re: Possible to use TF-100 To test Water Softener ?

    Well, you really can't adjust the amount of hardness the softener is taking out. It will do what it can until it is exhausted and has to be regenerated with the brine solution. I'm sorry, but I can help with those numbers of 15 and 19. I don't know what they represent. I can tell you that having to regen every night sounds grossly excessive, and that will use a TON of salt. Unless you have extremely hard water, or your softener is chronically undersized, you should not regen near that often. How many people live in the house? I ask, as most softeners are set up to regen based on 70-100 GPD use per person. Your setting may be way off...or again the unit wrongly sized. Sorry to keep throwing questions at you, but there is a lot we need to know about the set up to understand what it should be doing.
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    Re: Possible to use TF-100 To test Water Softener ?

    Its just how it's set up, it asks at what time it should regenerate, default is 2:00am. The 15 represents how hard I want the water, I also have a valve I can open that allows water to bypass to help harden it up as well. Pretty sure the higher the number the softer it gets?
    Pool 16 x 33.5 Foxx Pool with rounded corners 3.5 at each end and 5+ in the middle (16000 GAL)

    Equipment - 300 LB Hayward filter with a Pentair SuperFlo pump (3/4 HP). Also Hayward H series Heater and a dedicated jet for a Polaris 280 with a booster pump (3/4HP). Hayward Chlorinator CL200.

    Pool has Main Drain, 2 return Jets with 1 inch eyeballs, a skimmer with floating weir, and the dedicated Polaris jet. Also has a valve for the Waterslide.

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    Re: Possible to use TF-100 To test Water Softener ?

    I do not know what that number represents. Either the manual, or a Technician will provide that info. Once regenerated, the unit will soften as much water as it can. Not to a lesser or greater degree, just whatever volume of a given amount passes through the resin bed. That volume might be 400 gallons, 800 gallons, or 200 gallons. I just can't tell you without knowing more. Once that given volume has passed through, the resin is exhausted, and now water coming through, comes out hard. Once it regenerates, it can soften that same volume of water again, and the cycle is repeated. They are not meant to be adjusted to make say 10 PPM, 20 PPM or whatever hardness level you want. They are meant to take a given amount of volume, take it down to 3 grains (51.3 PPM) (or less) Total Hardness for lets just say 400 gallons and start over. The bypass is designed to take the softener out of the loop if there is a problem with it, like it has a leak, needs maintenance, etc. It is not meant to adjust your hardness level. As for the regen time of day, 02:00 is default for all of them so you aren't as likely to call for water during a regen cycle. I can tell you with certainty that if you are regenerating every night something is wrong. Either you have too small a unit, and or it is not set up correctly. If your water is that hard, or you are using that much water, you should have a bigger unit. My guess is improper setup. Without knowing your softener size, your incoming hardness, and water use, I cannot tell you more about that, sorry. I really encourage to consult your manual, get a technician out, or both. You will tire of hauling and or paying for excess salt at some point if you don't get it set up properly.
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    Re: Possible to use TF-100 To test Water Softener ?

    Not to mention the water being wasted for unnecessary regens. A regen on my system uses about 65 gallons. With just me in the house I have the cycle set at max which is 7 days. I average about 35 gallons usage per day.

    Regards
    Michael
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    Re: Possible to use TF-100 To test Water Softener ?

    Quote Originally Posted by mmn
    Not to mention the water being wasted for unnecessary regens. A regen on my system uses about 65 gallons. With just me in the house I have the cycle set at max which is 7 days. I average about 35 gallons usage per day.

    Regards
    Michael

    Yes, and if your water table is high and recharges there, you can add a lot of salt to it over time.
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    Re: Possible to use TF-100 To test Water Softener ?

    Good point. Mine is outside and the table is high. Might try manual regents for a while testing every week with my TF100 to see how often it's really needed.

    Regards
    Michael
    14,288 gal IG freeform Diamondbrite
    Hayward 9002 filter
    3/4 hp Hayward pump
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    Re: Possible to use TF-100 To test Water Softener ?

    Now I'm confused... It is not too small... And there is not a setting to have it regenerate like once a week. I think it's this one (looking on my phone hard to tell):
    http://m.homedepot.com/p/GE-40-000-Grai ... 219780-_-N

    400000 grain?

    Model:
    GXSH40V
    Internet/Catalog:
    203219780
    Store SKU:
    126118
    The GE 40,000-Grain Water Softener System features SmartSoft technology that monitors water usage and anticipates future demand so you don't run out of soft water. It has 125 grains per gallon maximum hardness-removal capacity and it also removes 10 PPM of iron. Handy features such as programmable operation, an alarm and indicator lights and a permanent memory offer reliable, hassle-free operation. This system has the capacity and convenience features that make it ideal for families of 4 or more.
    Pool 16 x 33.5 Foxx Pool with rounded corners 3.5 at each end and 5+ in the middle (16000 GAL)

    Equipment - 300 LB Hayward filter with a Pentair SuperFlo pump (3/4 HP). Also Hayward H series Heater and a dedicated jet for a Polaris 280 with a booster pump (3/4HP). Hayward Chlorinator CL200.

    Pool has Main Drain, 2 return Jets with 1 inch eyeballs, a skimmer with floating weir, and the dedicated Polaris jet. Also has a valve for the Waterslide.

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    Patrick_B's Avatar
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    Re: Possible to use TF-100 To test Water Softener ?

    I'm sorry I added confusion, please understand I was noting possible causes for too frequent regens. Run a CH on your raw water (pre softener) and post it. We can then figure out what it will do. The size is likely just fine, but we need that info before we can decide anything else. Again, sorry if I worried you.
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