New Inground Pool - Built in Massachusetts

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tobrien359

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Jul 30, 2013
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I've been researching this site for a while now and we’re getting ready to sign a contract with a pool company and trying to get a good grasp on budgeting. Right now, we have the below list of options we are interested in going with our selected pool company:

18’x36’ Permacrete Rectangle w/1 Roman End (w/a possible upgrade charge for freeform)
Concrete Walls & Bottom
2 Bottom Main Drains
8’ Wide Concrete Stairs
Built-In Swim Out
Mineral Springs Chlorine Generator
Cantilever Edge
750 sq. ft. Stamped Concrete Decking
Electrical Work
ColorLogic 12v Underwater Light
Foam Padding
28 Mil Liner
3 Returns
1 Stair Jet
2 Skimmers
Stainless Steel Handrail (Ladder also included)
DE-4800 Filter
Hayward 1.0 H.P. Super Pump
Poolside “Indoc”
Maintanence Equipment
Pool Water
Safety Line & Floats
Permit Work
Complete Project Management

We have an existing 4’ vinyl fence that does not meet pool code so we are planning right now to knock down part of it and enclose the pool in it’s own chainlink or aluminium fence that meets code.

After pricing everything out, we decided to hold of purchasing the dolphin pool vacuum and winter safety cover until we have a better idea of the overall cost of the project.

Can anyone out there give me any advice on my list of spec’s or tell me any “gotchas” that might arise. I know it’s hard to know what’s going to happen during excavation until it happens. They believe we have very good soil for backfill.

Thanks for any input.
 
Welcome to tfp, tobrien359 :wave:

tobrien359 said:
Mineral Springs Chlorine Generator
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Do you know which Saltwater Chlorine Generator (swg) they are installing? Skip the "Mineral Springs" chemicals...they are over priced and not needed when you understand your pool chemistry (which you will learn here at tfp).

tobrien359 said:
Hayward 1.0 H.P. Super Pump
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I would opt for at least a 2-speed pump, since most of the time you would run on low and save electricity.

tobrien359 said:
Poolside “Indoc”
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I have no idea what this is.

tobrien359 said:
DE-4800 Filter
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This small (at 48 sq. ft.) if my volume estimation on your pool is right. I am assuming 5.5 foot average depth and get about 26000 gallons. We would recommend a minimum 72 sq. ft. DE filter for that volume pool.

tobrien359 said:
Filter and pump will be Pentair
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You listed hayward equipment above?
 
Sorry, I had some items that I meant to delete at the bottom of the list. I edited it, sorry for the confusion. Also, Pool "indoc" is basically pool school by the company.

I am not sure which Saltwater Generator they are installing. Which do you recommend?
 
tobrien359 said:
Also, Pool "indoc" is basically pool school by the company.
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I would learn from them about the equipment, but I would skip/ignore their advice about pool chemistry since they are the ones suggesting the very expensive and unnecessary Bioguard stuff.

tobrien359 said:
I am not sure which Saltwater Generator they are installing. Which do you recommend?
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Most of the major manufactures are good. Here is what JasonLion said to the same question: http://www.troublefreepool.com/which-swg-brand-t40945.html#p339765 If you are getting automation (or thinking about it for the future), then you should consider going with the same brand swg. Hayward makes the aquarite. Make sure the cell is sized at least 1.5 to 3 times the volume of your pool...so for yours get at least a 40K cell, 60k would probably be better yet.
 
Pay attention to how the backfill is placed. Especially since they are proposing to use on-site soils. I am using the granular soils I have on site to save money and to avoid having to haul off site But I'm placing it in lifts and compacting it, and I plan to wait a while before completing the deck over the filled areas in case it settles. Pool builders want to get it backfilled, pour the deck and get out of there quickly which often results in settled backfill and voids under the deck. Also, as stated previously, try to get a more efficient pump. Massachusetts utilities offer a $200 rebate for efficient pool pumps and you will save enough money on electricity to pay for the pump in no time.
 
When you say "Permacrete" does that still mean it uses a vinyl liner? I ask since my comment about skipping the pool builders advice on pool chemistry is fine if it is a liner pool, but if it is a plaster type pool, then during the startup you generally want to follow their instructions.
 
Thanks! I will look into the Mass Rebates. We were thinking it might make sense to have the pool itself installed this fall and wait until Spring to install the decking so the earth can settle. do you think this is a good idea?

Yes, the permacrete pool will have a liner.
 
It looks like the Mineral springs swg is a hayward aquarite: http://www.parpool-spa.com/page/PoolCare/BioGuard_Mineral-Springs-MS10-20.html, so it may be fine...but I would price it out and see if it is cheaper to get the Hayward labeled one. You would want the 40K cell. Again, skip all of the Mineral Springs chemicals, all you really need is proper pool chemistry and solar softener salt for a swg.
 
Who are you leaning toward for a PB? I'm in mass and just starting to muddle through all the options, recommendations and advice. My pool builders I've been talking to have been impressed/annoyed at the knowledge I've learned from here.
 
I am also in MA and going through this process, I am in Western MA though.

I am pretty sure I am going with Sta-rite equipment, I do not think their is a huge difference between all the companies. I would go with the PB you like the most and just use what they use. Most out my way use Sta-rite or Jandy.
 

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I looked into the permacrete pools when I was in the research phase. A neighbor of mine has one and has had no issues with it at all. But when pricing it out, it was way over the top compared to doing a steel wall pool or a ploymer wall pool. The only company I could find that sold Permacrete was Easton pools which is about 20 minutes from where I live in southeastern MA.

Based on your specs you have planned, the one main area where cost can get outrageous is on the decking. 750 sqaure feet is not a lot. Unless you are limited in your space for decking, I;d go as big as you can. I originally planned 1000 sqaure feet but ended up at 2100 when all was said and done. Significant added cost!

Also, I did stamped concrete. I hate it. It's the one thing I regret doing with my pool build. Even with the grit in the sealer, it is super slippery. And it gets HOT. We did a silver base with charcoal. Looks nice but the heat and slippery aspect are tough to deal with. My decking guy offered to do a sealer next spring using 3x the grit for free if I want. I actually might just let the sealer wear off and let nature takes it course with the color fading and such.

Other than that, I can't really comment on equipment stuff. My PB uses all Pentair stuff and none of it is "state of the art" equipment but it has kepts my pool crystal clear with the proper circulation. I believe mine is a 1hp Whisperflow pump with DE filter (I can't remember all the specific numbers). I have 3 skimmers and 7 returns. Water moves niceley so make sure your PB thinks that the 3 returns and jets on the stairs will be truly sufficient. Last thing you want is an area where water doesn't move.

Are you doing any kind of heater? I've found that spending money on the heater has paid off very well considering the weather we've had lately. These 50 degree summer nights can really brings the water temps down!
 
Thanks for you info mpkelly, I actually saw your pool build on here and got a lot info from it. We are limited in the space for the pool and decking because we will be fencing it in and it will be fenced in within another fence. But we also already have an existing stamped concrete patio that will be near the fenced in pool area giving us extra room hang out and we plan to connect the existing patio with a walkway that leads to the gate for the pool area. Hopefully we can install 2 gates the will open up wide when the pool is in use. I'm guessing the walkway will probably be no more that 6 feet connecting the 2 areas. Not the most ideal situation but for now it benefits us with having dogs (that don't swim) and an existing one-year old fence that doesn't meet pool code that we don't want to rip down and rebuild. I will reconsider the stamped concrete after your statement, I have heard the same from others and I really don't mind the look of the exposed aggregate.

We will not be doing a heater right now but the pool builder agreed to have set up so it can be added down the road.

How did you excavation go and what about your backfill?
 
Well, excavation went fine. Backfill went fine and I haven't had any major issues with my deck cracking except for one area (which was discussed in my thread). However, one thing I am dealing with is settling under the pool so areas of the vermiculite walls and slant show signs of "sinking". Hasn't impacted the liner....yet and no water issues but my PB wants to fix it at the end of the season. I think that involves draining the pool which I'm not happy about but we will see.

You mentioned your floors will be cement. Mine are cement too with the walls and slant vermiculite. My fear with the cement is that it is less flexible than vermiculite so I am hoping that any settling doesn't cause cracking which can easily create sharp edges that can cut the liner. So keep that in mind if you have any issues with water tables.
 

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